Helpful Reply64 bit can be done but to what advantage?

Page: < 12 Showing page 2 of 2
Author
Luteman
Max Output Level: -84 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 335
  • Joined: 2006/12/04 05:48:05
  • Location: UK
  • Status: offline
Re:64 bit can be done but to what advantage? 2013/02/03 18:19:54 (permalink)
To answer a specific question the OP has - as far as 32-bit plugs running in Bitbridge are concerned, there is little or no cost in terms of workflow. (I can't comment about JBridge as I have never used it).

With Bitbridge there is no additional setup involved as 32-bit plugins are wrapped automatically by 64-bit SONAR.

You open the plugin GUI in the normal way by double-clicking the icon in the synth rack. The only differences I believe are a) a wrapped plugin opens in its own window and by default cannot be docked and b) if you need access to the ACT controls you must open the GUI by Shift+double-clicking the icon. This opens a dockable control panel, from which you can toggle the plugin GUI.
Neither of these has ever bothered me, although I only ever use one 32-bit plugin regularly.

My take on this is that 64-bit SONAR does indeed have advantages in terms of performance and stability, with no penalty in usability.

YMMV.

I hope this helps.


Chris
SONAR Platinum, Windows 7 Pro 64bit, Core2Quad Q6600, 8GB, 2 x SSD, M-Audio Fast Track Ultra, M-Audio Axiom 61, Behringer FCB1010 MIDI pedalboard, Stephen Haddock 8-course lute, some guitars, a mandolin and a bass

#31
DW_Mike
Max Output Level: -6 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 6907
  • Joined: 2006/11/29 18:06:40
  • Location: The arm-pit of the good 'ol US...New Jersey
  • Status: offline
Re:64 bit can be done but to what advantage? 2013/02/03 19:59:00 (permalink)
We all seem to forget that pretty much all of us have better recording equipment than Elvis or The Beatles ever recorded on.

I'm just sayn'.

32 bit and 16/44.1 and the right skills are more than enough.



But because I can....I do.
The only upgrade I won't do yet is Windows 8 but other then that it's game on  


Mike

Sonar X3 ~ Scarlett 18i6 ~ Home Build DAW  
GA-Z77X-UD5H
Intel i7 3770k 4.2GHz
32GB RAM Crucial Ballistix Elite (4x8) 
2x Samsung 250GB SSD 
1TB WD Black HDD @ 7200RPM 6Gb/s 64MB 
Corsair H80i Liquid cooler 
Noctua Silent Fans ~ 3x120mm ~ 1x140mm 
Seasonic Platinum 760w PSU 
Windows 7 Pro 64Bit.
#32
gswitz
Max Output Level: -18.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 5694
  • Joined: 2007/06/16 07:17:14
  • Location: Richmond Virginia USA
  • Status: offline
Re:64 bit can be done but to what advantage? 2013/02/03 20:34:37 (permalink)
For me, I get a certain amount of time between recordings. That's how much attention the mix can get. The faster I bounce, the more work I can do in the same amount of time. With x64, I do more work in the fixed amount of time I'm willing to spend.

StudioCat > I use Windows 10 and Sonar Platinum. I have a touch screen.
I make some videos. This one shows how to do a physical loopback on the RME UCX to get many more equalizer nodes.
#33
gswitz
Max Output Level: -18.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 5694
  • Joined: 2007/06/16 07:17:14
  • Location: Richmond Virginia USA
  • Status: offline
Re:64 bit can be done but to what advantage? 2013/02/03 20:54:38 (permalink)
accidental double post

StudioCat > I use Windows 10 and Sonar Platinum. I have a touch screen.
I make some videos. This one shows how to do a physical loopback on the RME UCX to get many more equalizer nodes.
#34
Splat
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 8672
  • Joined: 2010/12/29 15:28:29
  • Location: Mars.
  • Status: offline
Re:64 bit can be done but to what advantage? 2013/02/03 20:59:07 (permalink)
Sadly none of us are recording with Elvis or The Beatles. My ex employer (when I was a spotty teenager) was once the producer of The Beatles believe it or not and I suspect he would have a field day reading these posts ;)

Sell by date at 9000 posts. Do not feed.
@48/24 & 128 buffers latency is 367 with offset of 38.

Sonar Platinum(64 bit),Win 8.1(64 bit),Saffire Pro 40(Firewire),Mix Control = 3.4,Firewire=VIA,Dell Studio XPS 8100(Intel Core i7 CPU 2.93 Ghz/16 Gb),4 x Seagate ST31500341AS (mirrored),GeForce GTX 460,Yamaha DGX-505 keyboard,Roland A-300PRO,Roland SPD-30 V2,FD-8,Triggera Krigg,Shure SM7B,Yamaha HS5.Maschine Studio+Komplete 9 Ultimate+Kontrol Z1.Addictive Keys,Izotope Nectar elements,Overloud Bundle,Geist.Acronis True Image 2014.
#35
gcolbert
Max Output Level: -67 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1176
  • Joined: 2010/11/13 18:34:06
  • Location: Windsor Mill, MD
  • Status: offline
Re:64 bit can be done but to what advantage? 2013/02/03 21:06:22 (permalink)
The reality is that 32 bit programs run best on 32 bit operating systems.  If, because of the VSTs and plug-ins, you feel the need to run 32 bit Sonar, you need to consider backing your operating system back to 32 bit Windows.  32 bit applications running on a 64 bit OS don't perform as well or as dependably.  We saw the same issues going from 8 bit to 16 bit applications and again going from 16bit to 32 bit applications. 
 
To the OP, if you have the need to run 32 bit plugs, reload Windows with a 32 bit version.  This will give you the best performance. 
 
The OS bit width and the application word size don't have anything to do with the recording sampling rate and bit depth.  It doesn't matter how you mix and match the OS/Application word width.  The sound will be the same.  in the DAW, the sound is nothing more than numbers and 2 + 2 = 4 if you are using a 32 bit application or a 64 bit application.
 
Glen
#36
Splat
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 8672
  • Joined: 2010/12/29 15:28:29
  • Location: Mars.
  • Status: offline
Re:64 bit can be done but to what advantage? 2013/02/03 21:06:47 (permalink)
And in my day the discussion was what was the smallest van that could carry a Fairlight.... Which nowdays is emulated on an iPhone app.

Sell by date at 9000 posts. Do not feed.
@48/24 & 128 buffers latency is 367 with offset of 38.

Sonar Platinum(64 bit),Win 8.1(64 bit),Saffire Pro 40(Firewire),Mix Control = 3.4,Firewire=VIA,Dell Studio XPS 8100(Intel Core i7 CPU 2.93 Ghz/16 Gb),4 x Seagate ST31500341AS (mirrored),GeForce GTX 460,Yamaha DGX-505 keyboard,Roland A-300PRO,Roland SPD-30 V2,FD-8,Triggera Krigg,Shure SM7B,Yamaha HS5.Maschine Studio+Komplete 9 Ultimate+Kontrol Z1.Addictive Keys,Izotope Nectar elements,Overloud Bundle,Geist.Acronis True Image 2014.
#37
konradh
Max Output Level: -42 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3325
  • Joined: 2006/01/16 16:07:06
  • Status: offline
Re:64 bit can be done but to what advantage? 2013/02/03 21:18:00 (permalink)
If I had an unlimited budget and the entire staff of Abbey Road at my bidding as did The Beatles, I could probably get by with less computer power.

Konrad
Current album and more: http://www.themightykonrad.com/

Sonar X1d Producer. V-Studio 700. PC: Intel i7 CPU 3.07GHz, 12 GB RAM. Win 7 64-bit. RealGuitar, RealStrat, RealLPC, Ivory II, Vienna Symphonic, Hollywood Strings, Electr6ity, Acoustic Legends, FabFour, Scarbee Rick/J-Bass/P-Bass, Kontakt 5. NI Session Guitar. Boldersounds, Noisefirm. EZ Drummer 2. EZ Mix. Melodyne Assist. Guitar Rig 4. Tyros 2, JV-1080, Kurzweil PC2R, TC Helicon VoiceWorks+. Rode NT2a, EV RE20. Presonus Eureka.  Rokit 6s. 
#38
slartabartfast
Max Output Level: -22.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 5289
  • Joined: 2005/10/30 01:38:34
  • Status: offline
Re:64 bit can be done but to what advantage? 2013/02/03 21:22:38 (permalink)





+1000000000000000000000000000000




Good to see you haven't lost your famous perspective, Freddie.


Perhaps you should consider scientific  notation before your zero key wears out.
#39
musicroom
Max Output Level: -51 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 2421
  • Joined: 2004/04/26 22:31:02
  • Status: offline
Re:64 bit can be done but to what advantage? 2013/02/03 23:23:04 (permalink)
garrigus


Here's some info on the Cakewalk site that you might find useful...
https://www.cakewalk.com/...reader.aspx/2007013187

Scott

--
Scott R. Garrigus - http://garrigus.com - SONAR X2 Power! - http://garrigus.com/?SonarX2Power
* Author of the Cakewalk Sonar and Sony Sound Forge Power book series: http://garrigus.com/?PowerBooks
* Author of the Cakewalk Sonar ProAudioTutor video tutorial series: http://garrigus.com/?ProAudioTutor
* Publisher of the DigiFreq free music technology newsletter: http://digifreq.com/?DigiFreq
* Publisher of the NewTechReview free consumer technology newsletter: http://newtechreview.com/?NewTechReview





Thanks for the link Scott. I can absolutely attest to getting better performance with my system using 64 bit as listed in cake's article. I had to pry my hands off of a couple of cake's fx series plugs to finally leave 32 it. But the transition is quite worth it!

 
Dave
Songs
___________________________________
Desktop: Platinum / RME Multiface II / Purrfect Audio DAW  I7-3770 / 16 GB RAM / Win 10 Pro / Remote Laptop i7 6500U / 12GB RAM /  RME Babyface



 
 
#40
DW_Mike
Max Output Level: -6 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 6907
  • Joined: 2006/11/29 18:06:40
  • Location: The arm-pit of the good 'ol US...New Jersey
  • Status: offline
Re:64 bit can be done but to what advantage? 2013/02/03 23:29:11 (permalink)
CakeAlexS


Sadly none of us are recording with Elvis or The Beatles. My ex employer (when I was a spotty teenager) was once the producer of The Beatles believe it or not and I suspect he would have a field day reading these posts ;)

I'm sure he would Alex.  


Mike

Sonar X3 ~ Scarlett 18i6 ~ Home Build DAW  
GA-Z77X-UD5H
Intel i7 3770k 4.2GHz
32GB RAM Crucial Ballistix Elite (4x8) 
2x Samsung 250GB SSD 
1TB WD Black HDD @ 7200RPM 6Gb/s 64MB 
Corsair H80i Liquid cooler 
Noctua Silent Fans ~ 3x120mm ~ 1x140mm 
Seasonic Platinum 760w PSU 
Windows 7 Pro 64Bit.
#41
DW_Mike
Max Output Level: -6 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 6907
  • Joined: 2006/11/29 18:06:40
  • Location: The arm-pit of the good 'ol US...New Jersey
  • Status: offline
Re:64 bit can be done but to what advantage? 2013/02/03 23:33:52 (permalink)
konradh


If I had an unlimited budget and the entire staff of Abbey Road at my bidding as did The Beatles, I could probably get by with less computer power.

Hell, If I had that I'd just sit back and be a sponge.


Could you imagine what they could have done with today's technology?
Whew!


Mike 

Sonar X3 ~ Scarlett 18i6 ~ Home Build DAW  
GA-Z77X-UD5H
Intel i7 3770k 4.2GHz
32GB RAM Crucial Ballistix Elite (4x8) 
2x Samsung 250GB SSD 
1TB WD Black HDD @ 7200RPM 6Gb/s 64MB 
Corsair H80i Liquid cooler 
Noctua Silent Fans ~ 3x120mm ~ 1x140mm 
Seasonic Platinum 760w PSU 
Windows 7 Pro 64Bit.
#42
Freddie H
Max Output Level: -39 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3617
  • Joined: 2007/09/21 06:07:40
  • Status: offline
Re:64 bit can be done but to what advantage? 2013/02/04 10:30:05 (permalink)
gcolbert


The reality is that 32 bit programs run best on 32 bit operating systems.  If, because of the VSTs and plug-ins, you feel the need to run 32 bit Sonar, you need to consider backing your operating system back to 32 bit Windows.  32 bit applications running on a 64 bit OS don't perform as well or as dependably.  We saw the same issues going from 8 bit to 16 bit applications and again going from 16bit to 32 bit applications. 
 
To the OP, if you have the need to run 32 bit plugs, reload Windows with a 32 bit version.  This will give you the best performance. 

 
The OS bit width and the application word size don't have anything to do with the recording sampling rate and bit depth.  It doesn't matter how you mix and match the OS/Application word width.  The sound will be the same.  in the DAW, the sound is nothing more than numbers and 2 + 2 = 4 if you are using a 32 bit application or a 64 bit application.
 
Glen
Even that is not true! I don't know what you have got this from but I'm sorry, you info can't get more wrong, Glen!
Any x32bit program or x32bit application runs better, faster and more stable on x64bit OS VS 32bit OS. All old XP programs runs more stable and better on Windows 7 x64 then Xp32.
 
So there are no benefits with x32bit only setbacks!
 


-Highly developed spirits often encounter resistance from mediocre minds. -It really matters!
#43
Freddie H
Max Output Level: -39 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3617
  • Joined: 2007/09/21 06:07:40
  • Status: offline
Re:64 bit can be done but to what advantage? 2013/02/04 10:35:33 (permalink)
slartabartfast



+1000000000000000000000000000000




Good to see you haven't lost your famous perspective, Freddie.


Perhaps you should consider scientific  notation before your zero key wears out.


No worries, I use x64bit OS so I have a lot of headroom regarding 1 and 0's.


-Highly developed spirits often encounter resistance from mediocre minds. -It really matters!
#44
wmb
Max Output Level: -77 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 658
  • Joined: 2004/03/18 00:49:16
  • Status: offline
Re:64 bit can be done but to what advantage? 2013/02/05 14:32:56 (permalink)
I'm glad this thread blossomed without turning into some kind of battle. The variety of responses made for an informative aggregate. I can tell a few people here were following me down the path of workflow vs sound quality considerations for the type of work I normally produce. Best of all I was inspired to do more research about how bitbridge and jbridge work and that it's something you set up one time per plugin as opposed to every instance. Also, that it seems like once a plugin is playing nicely it will continue to do so more or less. 

I don't look at this forum very often but when I do I see posts about 64 bit problems and I guess I got the impression that it was not totally ready for primetime. I also tried using a 64 bit version of vegas 8 early on and while it was great from some things it was very problematic with others. The later versions are completely usable and I don't even have a 32 bit install of those. 

The main factor is that I don't really want to change the way I work all at once. I have to be productive and if I didn't need more processing power I wouldn't change anything. I'm leaving an incredibly stable system behind that was just plain old 32 bit XP that just runs and runs and runs. Unfortunately it just doesn't run fast enough at higher sampling rates so in the name of progress I must move on.


My current plan is to go ahead with my 32 bit setup for my current projects but also start setting up 64 bit X1/X2 installations so I can begin figuring out the plugin management. 

Cheers all.
#45
WDI
Max Output Level: -54.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 2069
  • Joined: 2007/08/28 02:31:11
  • Status: offline
Re:64 bit can be done but to what advantage? 2013/02/05 14:39:53 (permalink)
chefmike8888


konradh


If I had an unlimited budget and the entire staff of Abbey Road at my bidding as did The Beatles, I could probably get by with less computer power.

Hell, If I had that I'd just sit back and be a sponge.


Could you imagine what they could have done with today's technology?
Whew!


Mike 
Played a part for one measure using amp simulator and looped forever. Yay! And Ringo was just fired because Paul decided he could program better beats. 


Sonar 7 PE
Windows XP Pofessional (SP3)
MSI K8N Neo4-F
AMD Athlon 64 3500+
2 GB PC 3200 Ram
RME Fireface 800
Edirol FA-66
CM Labs MotorMix

Old stuff: ARJO
#46
WDI
Max Output Level: -54.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 2069
  • Joined: 2007/08/28 02:31:11
  • Status: offline
Re:64 bit can be done but to what advantage? 2013/02/05 14:44:18 (permalink)
Oh, and yoko became main singer as they just used pitch correction. Every one could tell but didn't care! Robot sound became legendary to reproduce and v-vocal now sells for $2000. Of course the original code with all it's bugs is best but hard to one by. 

Sonar 7 PE
Windows XP Pofessional (SP3)
MSI K8N Neo4-F
AMD Athlon 64 3500+
2 GB PC 3200 Ram
RME Fireface 800
Edirol FA-66
CM Labs MotorMix

Old stuff: ARJO
#47
garrigus
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 8599
  • Joined: 2003/11/05 17:23:21
  • Location: www.garrigus.com
  • Status: offline
Re:64 bit can be done but to what advantage? 2013/02/05 15:54:08 (permalink)
musicroom
Here's some info on the Cakewalk site that you might find useful...
https://www.cakewalk.com/...reader.aspx/2007013187

Scott 
Thanks for the link Scott. I can absolutely attest to getting better performance with my system using 64 bit as listed in cake's article. I had to pry my hands off of a couple of cake's fx series plugs to finally leave 32 it. But the transition is quite worth it!
Hey David,


No problem. Yeah, it's an older article, but there's still some good info there.


Going 64-bit is definitely worth it and definitely provides better performance. I wouldn't say it's absolutely necessary for everyone though because some people only work on smaller projects or they just do audio, etc. For anyone using MIDI and lots of soft synths, 64-bit is a definitely step up. That extra RAM access really makes working with virtual instruments so much nicer.


Scott

--
Scott R. Garrigus - http://garrigus.com - SONAR X2 Power! - http://garrigus.com/?SonarX2Power
* Author of the Cakewalk Sonar and Sony Sound Forge Power book series: http://garrigus.com/?PowerBooks
* Author of the Cakewalk Sonar ProAudioTutor video tutorial series: http://garrigus.com/?ProAudioTutor
* Publisher of the DigiFreq free music technology newsletter: http://digifreq.com/?DigiFreq
* Publisher of the NewTechReview free consumer technology newsletter: http://newtechreview.com/?NewTechReview


#48
Page: < 12 Showing page 2 of 2
Jump to:
© 2024 APG vNext Commercial Version 5.1