A "release ASIO driver in background" setting?

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ULTRABRA
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2010/06/01 14:27:44 (permalink)

A "release ASIO driver in background" setting?

I'm having some issues with audio glitches in Windows 7 using MOTU Ultralite Mk3.   Someone asked me if Sonar (7.0) has a "release ASIO driver in background" setting?     Does it ...?

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    CJaysMusic
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/01 14:49:36 (permalink)
    Someone asked me if Sonar (7.0) has a "release ASIO driver in background" setting?     Does it ...?

    I dont know hat that means?
    Maybe he meant having your pc performance set for background services in the device manager. But with the new OS'es and PC's you should have that set to programs, not background services.
     
    With that said, Just make sure you have the latest drivers form Motu for win7 and try ASIO and WDM driver modes to see what works best for your pc
    Cj

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    rbowser
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/01 14:50:31 (permalink)
    I think what you need is under Options>Audio>Advanced> and have the first item checked "Share drivers with other programs."

    Randy B.

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    ew
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/01 15:05:32 (permalink)
    rbowser


    I think what you need is under Options>Audio>Advanced> and have the first item checked "Share drivers with other programs."

    Randy B.

    This.
     
    ew
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    ULTRABRA
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/01 15:18:08 (permalink)
    Thanks for the advice.  I ticked that box for "share drivers ..." now, will see if it makes the difference.  

    By the way, it was a Cubase user who suggested I check for a "release ASIO driver in background" setting, so probably they just have a different way of phrasing the same thing...


    I tried both ASIO and WDM, and get similar issues with both.  WDM mode seems to work slower, ie reacts slower to mouse requests within Sonar.   

    I have latest 64 bit MOTU drivers.  My problem is that I get occasional audio glitches when playing back a Sonar song, usually if I have internet open (which I know I shouldn't... ;-))  ... 
    post edited by ULTRABRA - 2010/06/01 15:21:35

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    bitflipper
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/01 17:43:53 (permalink)

    By the way, it was a Cubase user who suggested I check for a "release ASIO driver in background" setting, so probably they just have a different way of phrasing the same thing...

    Bingo. Not going to solve your problem, though. It just lets you avoid having to unload SONAR while you play a CD or listen to internet radio.


    WDM mode seems to work slower, ie reacts slower to mouse requests within Sonar.
      
    Neither ASIO nor WDM/KS is responsible for nor has anything to do with responding to your mouse. If you are seeing sluggish mouse performance, this may be an indication of an IRQ conflict between your interface and mouse/USB port. Such conflicts can and often do cause dropouts.


    All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. 

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    CJaysMusic
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/01 18:43:29 (permalink)
    Here is some info on IRq conflicts
    http://audio-mastering-mixing.com/FAQ___Q_A.html#36

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    southpaw3473
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/01 21:31:44 (permalink)


    Here is some info on IRq conflicts
    http://audio-mastering-mixing.com/FAQ___Q_A.html#36


    Hey CJ,
    Thanks for all the help you give around here-you've saved my butt a few times! The info you've provided on your web site is really helpful.  Just thought I'd thank you again.  You, Bitflipper, John and the rest of the gurus make this the most informative recording forum. Period.


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    tarsier
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/02 11:06:10 (permalink)
    ULTRABRA
    WDM mode seems to work slower, ie reacts slower to mouse requests within Sonar.   

    bitflipper
    Neither ASIO nor WDM/KS is responsible for nor has anything to do with responding to your mouse. If you are seeing sluggish mouse performance, this may be an indication of an IRQ conflict between your interface and mouse/USB port. Such conflicts can and often do cause dropouts.

    I've had the work slower/respond to mouse requests slower issue in Sonar. This was on a MacPro dual quad core running XP and a MOTU 2408 PCIe interface. It only happens in Sonar in WDM mode.  WDM mode is pretty much unusable on this system, ASIO is better.  YMMV.
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    bitflipper
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/02 11:50:42 (permalink)

    I've had the work slower/respond to mouse requests slower issue in Sonar. This was on a MacPro dual quad core running XP and a MOTU 2408 PCIe interface. It only happens in Sonar in WDM mode. WDM mode is pretty much unusable on this system, ASIO is better. YMMV.

    Interesting. Maybe it's a MOTU thing? (I use a MOTU interface too, but I've been running ASIO for years so have nothing to compare to.)

    EDIT: I just switched over to WDM for grins, to see if I'd notice any difference. Oops, that didn't go well. First, the profiler informed me that 44.1 and 48 were my only available sample rates, which was unsettling. Then SONAR complained that "The following audio output devices used by this project are unavailable", and listed "MAIN OUTS". Eh? It sees the headphone output, but not the main outs. Maybe this is why I went with ASIO in the first place.

    I think I'll be sticking with ASIO.
    post edited by bitflipper - 2010/06/02 12:01:05


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    tarsier
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/02 12:07:21 (permalink)
    I'm guessing some combo of MacPro and MOTU drivers.  I don't recall the details but BootCamp has to install some sort of bios emulation in order to get XP to boot, since the MacPro is EFI.  It's just another thing to troubleshoot, and I'm weary of troubleshooting.

    As far as the OP's problem, the first thing I'd check would be the various processor throttling options and disable them. The things like power savings and speedstep.

    The OP also mentioned internet. I have network/internet on all my DAWs and they run fine, but it's something to check. Wireless is also a frequent culprit in audio glitches. So disable wireless and network and see if it helps.

    And finally, is the Ultralight being used in a USB or Firewire port?
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    ULTRABRA
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/02 13:05:21 (permalink)
    Thanks for the replies.

    How do I check the "various processor throttling options and disable them"?   Throttling, sounds like something I'd like to do to a MOTU technician, but hey ... 


    I have the regular Mk3, so firewire is the only option.

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    tarsier
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/02 15:54:57 (permalink)
    (grrrr. I typed out a response, then accidentally hit the wrong button on this page and my response is now gone. One more time all together now: This forum software is atrocious!)

    I don't have specific instructions for the processor settings, but they are in your motherboard's bios options. There are guides around on what to tweak, but hopefully someone else can chime in with more detail on that.

    Do you know what firewire chipset you're using? TI (Texas Instruments) is the preferred chipset, but I'm using a non-TI chipset with a MOTU 828mkII and it works ok.

    I don't see that anyone has yet suggested the DPC Latency Checker. Download the DPC Latency check utility and make sure that it doesn't spike into the yellow or red. If it does, then you've got a device somewhere in your system that is hogging resources.
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    bitflipper
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/02 17:56:37 (permalink)
    I don't see that anyone has yet suggested the DPC Latency Checker.

    I thought CJ had that response linked to a hot key on his keyboard.

    My problem is that I get occasional audio glitches when playing back a Sonar song, usually if I have internet open

    There ya go, ultra. If the DPC latency checker shows big spikes, disable your network and see if they go away. If they do, you've diagnosed the problem.

    You can set up a Windows profile in which the network is disabled, but sometimes I want/need to have the network and SONAR up at the same time, so I use a batch file to conveniently disable and re-enable the network as needed.


    All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. 

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    Kraymon
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/03 04:38:28 (permalink)
    ULTRABRA


    Thanks for the replies.

    How do I check the "various processor throttling options and disable them"?   Throttling, sounds like something I'd like to do to a MOTU technician, but hey ... 


    I have the regular Mk3, so firewire is the only option.

    I get this with my RME fireface (so might be a different problem) and I read somewhere that the best way around it is to set Windows audio playback (in control panel) to different outputs than the ones you are using in Sonar. 
     
    ASIO isn't true multiclient apparently. It's a bit annoying if you don't use a mixer though, because you will be monitoring out of different outputs for SONAR and Windows.

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    ew
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/03 11:23:07 (permalink)
    Kraymon


    ULTRABRA


    Thanks for the replies.

    How do I check the "various processor throttling options and disable them"?   Throttling, sounds like something I'd like to do to a MOTU technician, but hey ... 


    I have the regular Mk3, so firewire is the only option.

    I get this with my RME fireface (so might be a different problem) and I read somewhere that the best way around it is to set Windows audio playback (in control panel) to different outputs than the ones you are using in Sonar. 
     
    ASIO isn't true multiclient apparently. It's a bit annoying if you don't use a mixer though, because you will be monitoring out of different outputs for SONAR and Windows.
    It all depends on the drivers. Very few ASIO drivers are designed to be multiclient in the first place.
     
    ew
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    ULTRABRA
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/03 14:24:43 (permalink)
    I loaded the DPC latency checker, and yes, I am getting occasional yellow and red spikes.  This happens when the network is enabled or disabled.   I tested with drivers on various devices disabled, but this did not change anything.

    So, I'm getting occasional audio glitches, and occasional red spikes - not necessarily at the same time.

    Usually the spikes come when some kind of audio is started, or stopped.

    I did also check CJ's IRQ conflict instructions, but cannot find any conflicts there (although there is some sharing of IRQ numbers).   

    Any ideas how to troubleshoot further?

    Thanks

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    tarsier
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/03 15:12:10 (permalink)
    What ASIO buffer size are you using? Try increasing it to see if your glitches go away.
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    bitflipper
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/03 15:25:22 (permalink)
    Next step is to determine which interrupt handlers are responsible for those yellow and red spikes. Tools exist for that (e.g. xperf), but it would appear that you already know who the culprit is. Disable the network interface and run the DPC Latency Checker again.


    All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. 

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    ULTRABRA
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/03 17:00:14 (permalink)
    tarsier


    What ASIO buffer size are you using? Try increasing it to see if your glitches go away.

    The MOTU was set at 192, but no change even at 1024.

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    ULTRABRA
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/03 17:02:52 (permalink)
    bitflipper


    Next step is to determine which interrupt handlers are responsible for those yellow and red spikes. Tools exist for that (e.g. xperf), but it would appear that you already know who the culprit is. Disable the network interface and run the DPC Latency Checker again.

    I do ??!       Well, no change if network is enabled or disabled.  


    Would it, should it make any difference if I uninstalled the MOTU drivers etc, and started again?   I don't know why that would make any difference but ... 



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    ULTRABRA
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/03 17:05:18 (permalink)
    tarsier


     Do you know what firewire chipset you're using? TI (Texas Instruments) is the preferred chipset, but I'm using a non-TI chipset with a MOTU 828mkII and it works ok.


    Yes, TI chipset on the motherboard.

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    tarsier
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/04 12:17:16 (permalink)
    Have you made sure all your drivers are up to date? Even though a driver update can possibly worsen performance, generally they improve things. Particularly with Video and Network drivers.

    Are you running any other software in the background? Acrobat speed launcher?  Java Launcher? Antivirus? Anything?

    I downloaded your motherboard manual, and here are some instructions for the bios tweaks. If you don't feel comfortable doing this, then DON'T!  Call a computer tech and get some help. Also, keep notes about what you're doing so you can undo these if they don't work.

    When your computer is starting, press the Del key to enter the bios setup.
    Go in to "M.I.T. Current Status" and then into "Advanced CPU Core Features"

    Disable the following:
    Intel(R) Turbo Boost Tech.
    CPU Enhanced Halt (C1E)
    C3/C6/C7 State Support
    CPU EIST Function

    Now hit escape to back out to the initial bios screen and go into "Power Management Setup"
    Disable "HPET Support"

    Now press F10 to save and exit setup. Reboot and see if that helped.

    And if anyone disagrees with any of those bios tweaks, please chime in!

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    noonie
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/04 13:27:59 (permalink)
    I recently bought an UL mk3, but I'm using USB and with a laptop, so my scenario is different than yours but this might help anyway.

    I had horrible glitch/crackle issues also when I first set it up (w/ASIO ). I eventually noticed that my Novation Remote SL had stopped responding after installing the MOTU drivers. In fact it dissappeared and was no longer even seen by Automap.

    I removed both drivers and reinstalled MOTU first then the Novation.....been fine ever since (though the RT latency sucks over USB)

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    tarsier
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/04 15:18:19 (permalink)
    And try setting your firewire drivers to legacy mode:

    http://forum.cakewalk.com/fb.ashx?m=2026615

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    bitflipper
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/04 15:53:28 (permalink)
    I do ??! Well, no change if network is enabled or disabled.

    Sorry, I misunderstood. When you said "My problem is that I get occasional audio glitches when playing back a Sonar song, usually if I have internet open..." I took that to imply you'd established a correlation between dropouts and network activity.

    If disabling the network has no effect, then whatever is causing those DPC spikes is something else. Start by looking for devices that share an IRQ.


    All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. 

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    ULTRABRA
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    Re:A "release ASIO driver in background" setting? 2010/06/09 15:30:09 (permalink)
    Sorry for my delayed reply.   I appreciate all the help and suggestions   The solution was to install the newest drivers of the motherboard.  Now I can use Sonar and Sound Forge together without any audio glitches ... and I can even have the internet open at the same time (although I will disable network during recording sessions ;-) )

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