ADAT -> FW-1884 -> SOANR. Anyone ever done it?

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bapu
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2008/04/22 12:30:10 (permalink)

ADAT -> FW-1884 -> SOANR. Anyone ever done it?

I'm about to embark upon taking my old ADAT tapes into SONAR via the lightpipe input on my FW-1884.

If I only had 8 tracks (one tape) it would be simple. And I do have some of those

How would I do three tapes (24 tracks) and keep all the audio in sync into one SONAR project?

TIA for any help. It's been 8 years since I used an ADAT (sold all three of mine) so I'm not boned up on how to do this.
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    ohhey
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    RE: ADAT -> FW-1884 -> SOANR. Anyone ever done it? 2008/04/22 15:25:38 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: bapu

    I'm about to embark upon taking my old ADAT tapes into SONAR via the lightpipe input on my FW-1884.

    If I only had 8 tracks (one tape) it would be simple. And I do have some of those

    How would I do three tapes (24 tracks) and keep all the audio in sync into one SONAR project?

    TIA for any help. It's been 8 years since I used an ADAT (sold all three of mine) so I'm not boned up on how to do this.



    You need to pick up a JLCooper DATASync or DATASync II off e-bay. That way you can get MTC out of the ADAT to drive Sonar. The only other device that would work would be the Alesis BRC but that's going to be more money. I've used the DATASync many times and it works great. Here is how it works.

    ADAT Machine 9pin plug -> JLCooper DATASync -> MIDI out to MIDI in on FW-1884 (or other MIDI inteface).

    ADAT Light pipe out of ADAT tape machine to FW-1884 ADAT input. Set FW-1884 to get sample rate clock from the ADAT. This means the sample rate must match the ADAT tape sample rate and the Sonar project must be the same sample rate also.

    In Sonar set the sync settings to "Trigger and Freewheel". and 30fps and set DATASync to 30fps also. If you have an old MIDI file make sure the Sonar project tempo map and time sig matches the old project. Also check the offset value and make sure it is correct.

    Add audio tracks, arm them and set the input to each channel of the ADAT in of the FW-1884. Set Sonar to sync to MTC and press record. It will display "waiting for timecode" but will not start rolling yet. Rewind the tape to a time just before the offset time in your project and press play. When the time on the ADAT reaches the offset time in your project Sonar will start recording the 8 tracks comming from the ADAT. When done switch Sonar back to internal sync, set the FW-1884 back to internal clock and press play. The MIDI and audio tracks should be close. If they are off just a bit nudge or slide (by samples) till you get the audio lined up perfect. It's best to freeze or bounce the MIDI first so you know EXACTLY where it will end up with the audio. That takes out vairables of MIDI latency and software synth response time.

    Also, if you want to use a different sample rate then don't use ADAT lightpipe. Use analog connections between the ADAT and the FW-1884. In some cases it sounds even better then a digital transfer. In fact, if it were me I would try it both ways to see what sounds the best. Yes you will be doing D/A and A/D but the D/A of the ADAT might have a "sound" you like or are used to. The digital out might not sound like you remember it. I would do both and pick and choose what version of each track sounds best. However, if you use a different sample rate from the tape you will also be doing sample rate conversion when you import the audio to compare so take that into account. The higher sample rate version will have to be a different project in Sonar.
    post edited by ohhey - 2008/04/22 15:50:19
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    ohhey
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    RE: ADAT -> FW-1884 -> SOANR. Anyone ever done it? 2008/04/22 15:33:42 (permalink)
    There is one JLCooper DATASync on e-bay right now... auction number 330229978961 go for it.
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    bapu
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    RE: ADAT -> FW-1884 -> SOANR. Anyone ever done it? 2008/04/22 15:35:53 (permalink)
    330229978961


    Actually I just did. Thanks. What would you pay as a maximum (include $18 shipping)?
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    ohhey
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    RE: ADAT -> FW-1884 -> SOANR. Anyone ever done it? 2008/04/22 16:02:40 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: bapu

    330229978961


    Actually I just did. Thanks. What would you pay as a maximum (include $18 shipping)?



    The deivce was about $300 new,... not much to go wrong but it is untested. I would go $100 or so and if it gets higher then that wait for the next one if you can. I think mine sold for about $70. Do a search on completed auctions and see what they have sold for in the past if there are any recent sales.
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    ohhey
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    RE: ADAT -> FW-1884 -> SOANR. Anyone ever done it? 2008/04/22 16:19:10 (permalink)
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    bapu
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    RE: ADAT -> FW-1884 -> SOANR. Anyone ever done it? 2008/04/22 18:03:38 (permalink)
    Frank,

    Thanks for the google. I might fall back to the first one ($30 + shipping) if I don't win the ebay bid ($50 max right now).

    I also bid on a blackface ADAT (since that was what I recorded my tracks on) for $100 max (incl shipping).

    If I get both of these, I might just keep them in the closet after I finish my project in case someone else comes along and needs a conversion. Or not.

    I can rent an ADAT and BRC in Hollywood, CA (40 miles from my home) for a combined cost of $90/day. I think this project may take me 2-3 days so if I win the ebay bids I'll save about $200 (or more since I can do it at my leisure).

    Thanks for your help.
    #7
    newfuturevintage
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    RE: ADAT -> FW-1884 -> SOANR. Anyone ever done it? 2008/04/22 18:21:21 (permalink)
    bapu--

    one thing I'd suggest would be to pick up an XT unit...it'll still play the blackface tapes, but the transport's faster on wind times, and more reliable in general.

    My inner child is an angry drunk.
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    bapu
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    RE: ADAT -> FW-1884 -> SOANR. Anyone ever done it? 2008/04/22 19:29:40 (permalink)
    Since I can't withdraw my ADAT Blackface bid on ebay, let's all pray that I lose that auction: b'cuz I found an XT elsewhere cheaper (as my backup plan).
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    bapu
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    RE: ADAT -> FW-1884 -> SOANR. Anyone ever done it? 2008/05/19 14:42:35 (permalink)
    Also check the offset value and make sure it is correct.

    Add audio tracks .... Rewind the tape to a time just before the offset time in your project


    ohhey,

    I got a DataSync II off ebay and I'm ready to start on this.

    However, I'm not quite sure what you mean by "offset time". Do you mean the actual time the song starts on the ADAT? I'm not quite remembering how I setup the projects in Voyetra SPG (with respect to time, offset or the like).

    TIA for any help.
    post edited by bapu - 2008/05/19 15:02:11
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    ohhey
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    RE: ADAT -> FW-1884 -> SOANR. Anyone ever done it? 2008/05/19 19:56:35 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: bapu

    Also check the offset value and make sure it is correct.

    Add audio tracks .... Rewind the tape to a time just before the offset time in your project


    ohhey,

    I got a DataSync II off ebay and I'm ready to start on this.

    However, I'm not quite sure what you mean by "offset time". Do you mean the actual time the song starts on the ADAT? I'm not quite remembering how I setup the projects in Voyetra SPG (with respect to time, offset or the like).

    TIA for any help.



    When you have Sonar sync to the MTC from the DataSync II it's going to start rolling at 0:00:00 unless you enter a offset value in Sonar. To set the offset pull down the Tools menu in Sonar and select Project.. On the clock page will be Source (set to SMPTE/MTC), ticks per quarter-note, and then Timecode Format. Set the Timecode format to match what the DataSync II is set for. Best to use 30 FPS ndf for the most part unless some other format was used on an old sequence. Under that is the field to set the SMPTE/MTC Offset. This is the point on the ADAT tape counter you want Sonar to start recording at. Best I remember the last two zeros are not on the ADAT counter just the first three sets. Do a little test to make sure.

    If there is only one song at the start of the tape and you started at zero then no offset is needed. But most folks had several songs on each tape. If the tapes were made with Voyetra synced up via time code of some kind you will have to know what the offset was or guess at it till it sounds in sync. You also need to know (or guess) the time sig. and tempo of the sequence and set that in the Sonar project. In my case they were Cakewalk wrk files so I could simply open then and see. In this case if you don't have Voyetra to open them up and look it will take some guess work.

    To set the tempo in Sonar pull down the View menu and select Tempo.. This is where it's really handy to know in advance what tempo the old sequence was.. if not it's going to take a while to find it. If the songs has tempo changes you have a lot of work to do.
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    bapu
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    RE: ADAT -> FW-1884 -> SOANR. Anyone ever done it? 2008/05/20 11:29:29 (permalink)
    In this case if you don't have Voyetra to open them up and look it will take some guess work.


    I'm fortunate in that I have Voyetra SPG to open up the orginal MIDI files, so I'll go there first to see if I set offsets. I used a BRC to drive SPG (thru MIDI as I recall) so it makes it hard to remember if I had to set an offset in SPG. The ADAT does have the ability to show time in SMPTE (aboslute, as I recall) so that may be my point of reference to begin with.

    I now just need to buy a 9 pin cable. Hopefully today and I have some free time tomorrow night to start this project.

    Thanks for your input and experience.

    #12
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