Bub 
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/06 12:47:58
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skullsession
Bub...is there any particular combination of things that you can pinpoint that causes the issue? Or...is it just random - and can happen on any track, at any time?
It's very random. It can happen on any track at any time. I've had this happen on projects that I had been working on for days then out of the blue something doesn't sound right and I check Pro Channel and it's like the Comp and EQ are turned off even though the button is on and settings have been adjusted. I'm also getting the problem with my Tool Bar turning completely gray. Here's a link to a video I took of the gray bar problem so you can see exactly what I'm talking about. I sent links to both clips and I uploaded my project with audio (wav) data to Box.net and gave Cakewalk links to it as well. Hopefully they can pinpoint something with it. I also sent the links to Brandon since he was part of the Pro Channel discussion thread.
"I pulled the head off Elvis, filled Fred up to his pelvis, yaba daba do, the King is gone, and so are you."
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Bub
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/06 13:31:43
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Jim Roseberry
With all due respect, I didn't purchase X1 so that I could then purchase another bundle of software to "work around" a problem. That said... if you want to use X1, I wouldn't let the ProChannel alone make that decision.
There are far too many other good options for EQ/Dynamics... some of which you likely already own. 
Jim, my head's going to explode! AH!! LOL!  Have you ever seen the movie Groundhog Day with Bill Murray? This Pro Channel discussion reminds me of the part where he's in the therapists office and says, Doctor, I keep reliving the same day over and over. The doctor says, well that's unusual, how about we make another appointment and you can come back tomorrow? The doctor didn't understand the fact that Bill Murray couldn't come back the following day because he kept reliving the same day over and over and suggested something that he couldn't do because he didn't understand the problem. LOL! I'm going to give it one last try and then I swear, I'm never gonna talk about this again. LOL! There are three distinct bugs with the Pro Channel, two of which render X1 unusable (#1 & #2 below).
#1 Components of the Pro Channel will randomly turn on by itself without input from the end user. #2 Components of the Pro Channel will randomly turn off by itself without input from the end user. #3 The Compressor and Equalizer will not respond until you turn on Saturation. Point A. For some of us, not all apparently, we can not disable the Pro Channel because it will keep turning itself back on ( See #1 above), therefor X1 can not be used because we have to obsessively keep checking to see if one of the components of the Pro Channel have turned on by itself which means we can't use another Compressor plugin because at random times the track may be squashed to oblivion, again, due to the fact that the PC Comp keeps turning itself on. This isn't as big a deal for the EQ because it is flat when initially enabled. Point B. We also can't use the Pro Channel Comp or EQ exclusively because at random times it will turn off ( See #2 above), therefor un-squashing the tracks we wanted squashed and un-equalizing the tracks we have equalized. In conclusion ... that's why we can't use 3rd party plug-ins, which is part of the reason why I think the Pro Channel being embedded is a really bad idea. I'll be open minded about this and not place blame on X1. Who knows ... maybe it's a configuration problem ... whatever it is we need to get it figured out because regardless of the cause, X1 is dead in the water right now for a lot of us. I want it to work ... I love Sonar, it's all I've ever used. I'll just keep using 8.5.3 until this straightened out. Bub
post edited by Bub - 2011/07/06 13:33:58
"I pulled the head off Elvis, filled Fred up to his pelvis, yaba daba do, the King is gone, and so are you."
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skullsession
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/06 13:50:08
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Jim Roseberry
With all due respect, I didn't purchase X1 so that I could then purchase another bundle of software to "work around" a problem.
I agree with you completely in principal...
That said... if you want to use X1, I wouldn't let the ProChannel alone make that decision.
There are far too many other good options for EQ/Dynamics... some of which you likely already own.
Indeed, I do own and use my favorites in my current version of SPE. And I didn't NEED to upgrade. But I did in good faith. So it comes down to more than principal for me. It's more like principal + interest. It has a lot to do with paying for an upgrade for a specific new feature - to find that it didn't work....and by many accounts, still doesn't after these many months. And I have no recourse. That's a pretty crappy way to deal with a 16+ year customer. And I, for one, plan to beat this horse till it's truly dead. As I'm currently off X1, I must rely on these forums to inform me when it's safe to give it a go once again.
HOOK: Skullsessions.com / Darwins God Album "Without a doubt I would have far greater listening and aural skills than most of the forum members here. Not all but many I am sure....I have done more listening than most people." - Jeff Evans on how awesome Jeff Evans is.
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ampfixer
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/06 14:21:27
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Hey Bub, I have something for you to check. My PC bugs are slightly different but I'm wondering if you can reproduce them.
The first time I open PC on a given track, moving any of the controls will turn on their respective section of the PC. A careless click turns on that section and I have to shut that section off with the little blue button. If I then go to another track and come back this will not happen. I have to deliberately turn on that section of PC with said button. I made up a project with 50 tracks and the issue was repeatable on every track, every time.
I can go through each track once and kill the problem. However, if I save and reopen the track this cycle starts all over.
The other issue is with the 4K compressor. IF I use the side chain option it effectively kills the compressor. The little blue button is on but the compressor is not. Turn off side chain and it works again.
Can you confirm any of these issues on your system??
Regards, John I want to make it clear that I am an Eedjit. I have no direct, or indirect, knowledge of business, the music industry, forum threads or the meaning of life. I know about amps. WIN 10 Pro X64, I7-3770k 16 gigs, ASUS Z77 pro, AMD 7950 3 gig, Steinberg UR44, A-Pro 500, Sonar Platinum, KRK Rokit 6
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Rasure
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/06 14:26:59
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Happens to me occasionally I have to load a preset in order to get the whole thing going again.
post edited by Rasure - 2011/07/06 14:33:51
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sykodelic
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/06 14:32:36
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loading a preset works. I'll try that next time. I have been routing it to a new bus which sucks...
Asus P8P67 pro, I7 2600K, 8G Kingston Hyperflex, 2 1T WD Caviar Black(sytem,audio), 2T WD Caviar Black(samples), RME Multiface, Roland A500 Pro, Windows 7 Ultimate 64, Sonar X1C, Ableton Live 8, Reason 6, Komplete 7, DCAM Synth Squad, Omnisphere, Stylus RMX, Trillian
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michaelhanson
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/06 14:55:50
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Maybe that is why I have had so few issues with PC, I usually start with a preset and then tweak it from there. The only time I have noticed it turning itself off is when I have left a project for several weeks to work on other things. When I have come back to them, I occasionally, maybe twice, have found something is not lit up any more.
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lavoll
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/06 16:18:03
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today i had input quantize turn itself on on a couple of channels (ive never used input quantize, but opening a few days old project it was "on" on a couple of channels).
midi inputs are also sometimes forgotten.
bus routings are sometimes forgotten.
im also having some issues with one midi channel being stuck on input echo even though it is turned off, even when i set the midi in to "nothing", it will still echo the midi from some other channel when i play that other channel.
sonar x1b, win 7, 12gig ram, 6gb ssd, i7 Hexa Processor i7-970, lynx aurora
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Jim Roseberry
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/06 16:37:52
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#1 Components of the Pro Channel will randomly turn on by itself without input from the end user. FWIW, I've not experienced this... It would drive me mad if I did.
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M@ B
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/06 18:10:19
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happening here as well.
noticed it yesterday and today on at least one channel... goes off by its self.
it's kind of tricky to hear it happen in this project, because it's happening on the snare mic channel and much of the snare is being provided by the overheads, so when prochannel goes off i'm still hearing snare from the overheads. before i realized what was happening, i was wondering why i couldn't balance the kit.
please fix this in x1c.
thanks.
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Gary McCoy
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing its thing....
2011/07/06 19:04:17
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No problems at all. Works like a charm.
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simpleman
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/06 19:23:01
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Well, I use the Tascam FW-1884 controller. Even though I have not experienced the on/off issue with PC, my hard knob controls in the EQ area is not responding (making adjustments) to the PC curves consistently. Makes me wonder if the user’s having this issue has a sound card or controller driver faulting with PC. I use the mouse/keyboard anyway and don't expect Tascam to update anymore. I can learn what works with what to use the FW-1884, because I can get much smoother curves using the knobs of the ones which deem connected.
My terms may not be well defined, so anyone else using the Tascam-1884 can chime in, and for others, check your controllers. I also wonder if any users of the VS-700 or other Cakewalk controllers are having issues.
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ampfixer
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/06 20:53:28
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DUDE!
"my hard knob controls in the EQ area is not responding"
Be not ashamed, it's happened to all of us.
Regards, John I want to make it clear that I am an Eedjit. I have no direct, or indirect, knowledge of business, the music industry, forum threads or the meaning of life. I know about amps. WIN 10 Pro X64, I7-3770k 16 gigs, ASUS Z77 pro, AMD 7950 3 gig, Steinberg UR44, A-Pro 500, Sonar Platinum, KRK Rokit 6
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Bub
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/07 00:27:58
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ampfixer
Hey Bub, I have something for you to check. My PC bugs are slightly different but I'm wondering if you can reproduce them.
The first time I open PC on a given track, moving any of the controls will turn on their respective section of the PC. A careless click turns on that section and I have to shut that section off with the little blue button. If I then go to another track and come back this will not happen. I have to deliberately turn on that section of PC with said button. I made up a project with 50 tracks and the issue was repeatable on every track, every time.
I can go through each track once and kill the problem. However, if I save and reopen the track this cycle starts all over.
Yes, the same thing happens to me.
The other issue is with the 4K compressor. IF I use the side chain option it effectively kills the compressor. The little blue button is on but the compressor is not. Turn off side chain and it works again.
I'm having just the opposite problem as you, I was not able to turn off Side Chain once it was enabled. Ain't that funny? :) I just found another bug in Pro Channel. It's not a big one, but I can repeat it. Basically, your track names show up in the wrong spot in Pro Channel sometimes, depending on which track template you pull up. Here are a couple of short video's to show you what I'm talking about ... Video #1 - Track Naming Bug Video #2 - Variation of Track Naming Bug
"I pulled the head off Elvis, filled Fred up to his pelvis, yaba daba do, the King is gone, and so are you."
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twoifbysea
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/07 12:58:29
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Is it normal for PC to contact my dead grandmother and ask for the recipe to her apple pie? I am using a x64 system with a x32 installation so I guess anything is possible.
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Bub
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/07 13:12:55
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twoifbysea
Is it normal for PC to contact my dead grandmother and ask for the recipe to her apple pie? I am using a x64 system with a x32 installation so I guess anything is possible.
No, but I have tried to interface a Ouija board with X1 to try and figure out what it's thinking sometimes. The mouse thingy wouldn't work so I chalked it up to being a bug in X1. LOL!
"I pulled the head off Elvis, filled Fred up to his pelvis, yaba daba do, the King is gone, and so are you."
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twoifbysea
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/07 13:17:39
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Did you set up your ouija mouse with ACT? It looks like there is a preset for it.
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M@ B
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/07 13:32:09
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simpleman
I also wonder if any users of the VS-700 or other Cakewalk controllers are having issues.
I'm using the vstudio 100 and having this issue.
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yorolpal
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/07 13:54:28
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ampfixer
Hey Bub, I have something for you to check. My PC bugs are slightly different but I'm wondering if you can reproduce them.
The first time I open PC on a given track, moving any of the controls will turn on their respective section of the PC. A careless click turns on that section and I have to shut that section off with the little blue button. If I then go to another track and come back this will not happen. I have to deliberately turn on that section of PC with said button. I made up a project with 50 tracks and the issue was repeatable on every track, every time.
I can go through each track once and kill the problem. However, if I save and reopen the track this cycle starts all over.
Can you confirm any of these issues on your system??
As stated on the other "PC" thread this is actually expected behaviour. It is the way PC is supposed to operate and NOT a bug.
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Bub
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/07 14:07:03
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yorolpal
ampfixer
Hey Bub, I have something for you to check. My PC bugs are slightly different but I'm wondering if you can reproduce them.
The first time I open PC on a given track, moving any of the controls will turn on their respective section of the PC. A careless click turns on that section and I have to shut that section off with the little blue button. If I then go to another track and come back this will not happen. I have to deliberately turn on that section of PC with said button. I made up a project with 50 tracks and the issue was repeatable on every track, every time.
I can go through each track once and kill the problem. However, if I save and reopen the track this cycle starts all over.
Can you confirm any of these issues on your system??
As stated on the other "PC" thread this is actually expected behaviour. It is the way PC is supposed to operate and NOT a bug.
I saw that too olpal. But what's happening goes against what Ryan said should happen. " This means that when you create a project and a ProChannel module is auto-enabled once, it will never auto-enable again." What we're seeing is, it will in fact auto-enable again after you save the project and re-open it at a later time. Unless I'm reading it wrong, that's not what he's saying should happen.
"I pulled the head off Elvis, filled Fred up to his pelvis, yaba daba do, the King is gone, and so are you."
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codamedia
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/07 14:16:07
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M@ B
simpleman
I also wonder if any users of the VS-700 or other Cakewalk controllers are having issues.
I'm using the vstudio 100 and having this issue.
M@ B: Are you running the VS-100 with ACT on? (upper left corner) If you are - then that could "appear to" randomly enable/disable the PC components as you touch the items in the top left of the VS (the four knobs and the select push). The entire left side will do this if you have the VS set to "Full Daw Mode". Depending on which knob or button is assigned to the components "on/off", you may be hitting it in error and not even know you are doing it. PC is picked up through ACT whether it is being displayed or not. As soon as the track it selected, ACT will control PC if it is mapped to do so. Auto Engaging: Maybe this is a good time to remind everyone that as of X1B - each module of Pro Channel will Auto-Engage the moment any knob or switch is touched for the first time. Once you turn it back off - it should not auto engage again - on that track or module only! Every track and module is subject to this behavior, by design! Disclaimer: I'm not suggesting this is everyone's problem, or the only problem. I am just pointing out that everyone needs to understand how PC was designed to function (especially the major changes on X1B) so they can rule that out if it applies to them. Personally - I really dislike the auto engage features. They make "on/off" buttons for that purpose which is much less error prone. But that is just my opinion! Bub: Great videos showing the potential problems with PC. The video in which nothing works until you edit the Saturation area is actually quite disturbing. As for the naming, I am pretty sure this is by design. The track name appears in that area so you can easily store items as a preset from scratch. If the track name was "ugly guitar part" (I'm not suggesting anything - LOL) then you didn't have to re-type that when you go to store the settings. BUT - once you choose a preset - then that name takes over the slot. I don't know if this was Cakes intentions, or if it is documented at all - but that is how I have been understanding it.
Don't fix it in the mix ... Fix it in the take!
Desktop: Win 7 Pro 64 Bit , ASUS MB w/Intel Chipset, INTEL Q9300 Quad Core, 2.5 GHz, 8 GB RAM, ATI 5450 Video Laptop: Windows 7 Pro, i5, 8 Gig Ram Hardware: Presonus FP10 (Firepod), FaderPort, M-Audio Axiom 49, Mackie 1202 VLZ, POD X3 Live, Variax 600, etc... etc...
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skullsession
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/07 14:25:59
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Well...if you click on it, it should turn on. It's sort of like you just inserted the VST into the chain, and with that particular part of the "channel strip" that you were tweaking - turned on.
Right?
Then...if you turn it off, it should STAY OFF until you manually turn it back on.
RIGHT?
If that's not the case, then SOMETHING is making ProChannel act up.
HOOK: Skullsessions.com / Darwins God Album "Without a doubt I would have far greater listening and aural skills than most of the forum members here. Not all but many I am sure....I have done more listening than most people." - Jeff Evans on how awesome Jeff Evans is.
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Bub
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/07 14:36:00
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codamedia
Bub: Great videos showing the potential problems with PC. The video in which nothing works until you edit the Saturation area is actually quite disturbing. As for the naming, I am pretty sure this is by design. The track name appears in that area so you can easily store items as a preset from scratch. If the track name was "ugly guitar part" (I'm not suggesting anything - LOL) then you didn't have to re-type that when you go to store the settings. BUT - once you choose a preset - then that name takes over the slot. I don't know if this was Cakes intentions, or if it is documented at all - but that is how I have been understanding it.
I thought it was by design too until I noticed that on the 'Normal' template, it only stores the track name in the preset name box for Track 1. It leaves it at 'No Preset' for all the other tracks that you rename. Doh! :) So, even if it is the expected behavior, it only works for Track 1 on the 'Normal' template which is a bug. LOL! You can't make this crap up man! HEHE! Watch the video again of the one with only 2 Tracks and you'll see what I mean. :)
"I pulled the head off Elvis, filled Fred up to his pelvis, yaba daba do, the King is gone, and so are you."
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skullsession
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/07 14:44:23
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codamedia
Personally - I really dislike the auto engage features. They make "on/off" buttons for that purpose which is much less error prone. But that is just my opinion!
I completly agree with this. Roland somehow got the idea that it was too much trouble to have people manually insert a VST channel strip into the fx bin. Then, they got the idea that it was too much trouble to turn the damn thing on once you did it. ProChannel has really turned out to be a (some say buggy, I say broken) VST that's locked to the channel strip, which takes up to much real estate when open - but can't be repositioned to other parts of the screen like all other FX windows. Overthunk it in the name of "streamlining". Even the embedded EQ that's been there for years can be snapped out of the channel and placed where you want it while you work on other tracks to balance a mix. An EQ, by the way, that you have to turn on manually, then turn on each band before you tweak.
HOOK: Skullsessions.com / Darwins God Album "Without a doubt I would have far greater listening and aural skills than most of the forum members here. Not all but many I am sure....I have done more listening than most people." - Jeff Evans on how awesome Jeff Evans is.
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Beagle
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/07 15:01:00
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skullsession
codamedia
Personally - I really dislike the auto engage features. They make "on/off" buttons for that purpose which is much less error prone. But that is just my opinion!
I completly agree with this.
Roland somehow got the idea that it was too much trouble to have people manually insert a VST channel strip into the fx bin. Then, they got the idea that it was too much trouble to turn the damn thing on once you did it.
ProChannel has really turned out to be a (some say buggy, I say broken) VST that's locked to the channel strip, which takes up to much real estate when open - but can't be repositioned to other parts of the screen like all other FX windows.
Overthunk it in the name of "streamlining".
Even the embedded EQ that's been there for years can be snapped out of the channel and placed where you want it while you work on other tracks to balance a mix. An EQ, by the way, that you have to turn on manually, then turn on each band before you tweak.
I thought you could float that module?
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M@ B
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/07 15:18:59
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M@ B
simpleman
I also wonder if any users of the VS-700 or other Cakewalk controllers are having issues.
I'm using the vstudio 100 and having this issue.
Hello all, please disregard this post. I am not having any hardware issues that I am aware of. I misinterpreted Simpleman's question. Sorry for the confusion. Thanks anyway Coda for your advise/info.
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karma1959
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/07 15:27:03
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I haven't noticed the issues highlighted above however I have encountered issues where I've been unable to activate the ProChannel EQ on some tracks that used the Sontius EQ previously, despite holding the Cntrl button while clicking the EQ power button.
Initializing the ProChannel EQ on other tracks within the same project via holding Cntrl and clicking the power button seemed to work fine interestingly enough.
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The Maillard Reaction
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/07 17:10:59
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With regards to Ryan's comments...
Does it apply if you do not have a VS100?
Does it apply if you do not have ACT turned on?
Does it apply if you do not have a VS100 and have never ever used ACT?
I'm curious how Ryan's comments apply to all the folks that don't have VS100 or any ACT stuff happening.
best regards,
mike
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timidi
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/07 18:20:31
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It has a lot to do with paying for an upgrade for a specific new feature - to find that it didn't work.. Has a familiar ring to it.
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John T
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Re:About ProChannel randomly doing it's thing....
2011/07/07 18:30:38
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ampfixer
The first time I open PC on a given track, moving any of the controls will turn on their respective section of the PC. A careless click turns on that section and I have to shut that section off with the little blue button. If I then go to another track and come back this will not happen. I have to deliberately turn on that section of PC with said button. I made up a project with 50 tracks and the issue was repeatable on every track, every time.
As discussed elsewhere, that's the intended behaviour, not a bug. For what it's worth, I don't think it's a good design.
http://johntatlockaudio.com/Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
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