Abrupt automation envelope changes--unsmooth transitions? Possible to fix??

Right-click the envelope line segment between the two nodes where you want to make the immediate change. Then choose Jump from the menu. That right-click menu allows you to control the type of transition between nodes.

Scott

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garrigus


Right-click the envelope line segment between the two nodes where you want to make the immediate change. Then choose Jump from the menu. That right-click menu allows you to control the type of transition between nodes.

Scott  

Even with a jump, I get the same problem for some cases.

bitflipper

Also bear in mind that nothing is instantaneous in a DAW, nor does it need to be. The shortest interval we can detect a level change is about 50ms, which is why that's the standard interval for RMS calculations. You can make a linear ramp that's between 10 and 40ms in duration and it will be perceived as instantaneous while still avoiding artifacts. 

Then for songs that do contain the smooth immediate automation transitions, how do they do it?

If you zoom in close enough, you can easily get away with having your envelope reduce/increase at an angle rather than an abrupt change, which as Bitflipper pointed out, WILL cause a noticeable click to be heard during playback.

Something like this, but at a steeper angle:
________
                \
                  \________
                  

Well I've tried everything, and unfortunately I can't seem to get that click/noise out of my abrupt automation transitions. I've tried positioning them immediately before a drum hit in hopes of masking the sound, but it does not work (in my particular case, the entire mix--every track--experiences the automation).

I've tried using the "Jump", didn't help. I've tried using a sloped transition instead of a vertical one, didn't help.

It just seems like the automated effect can't keep up, and it can't change as quickly as the automation envelope calls for. If it helps, my particular case I'm using the ProChannel's Lo-Pass filter to sweep a particular part of my song on the master bus.

Are you sure it's the EQ automation that's causing the click? IOW, if you disable automation (click off the "R" button) is the click still there?

Maybe it is an artifact caused by the ProChannel, although that would surprise me. If so, switching to another EQ would solve the problem. In addition to the Sonitus suggested by Jonesey, there is also the Cakewalk Fx:EQ, which I have actually used for just this purpose in the past.

Bristol_Jonesey


Try the Sonitus instead of the PC. See if that helps.

I did switch to the Sonitus and in fact the clicking is gone. Although the effect isn't quite the same as what I had liked from the PC, at least it works. Thanks

bitflipper


Are you sure it's the EQ automation that's causing the click? IOW, if you disable automation (click off the "R" button) is the click still there? 

Maybe it is an artifact caused by the ProChannel, although that would surprise me. If so, switching to another EQ would solve the problem. In addition to the Sonitus suggested by Jonesey, there is also the Cakewalk Fx:EQ, which I have actually used for just this purpose in the past. 

Unfortunately, I am convinced that it IS the automation that is causing the click. Ive taken measures to experiment this in and out prior to and during the life of this thread, and found that no such click exists without the automation. It's just a matter of the PC taking too long to "sweep" the EQ to the lo-pass position that I desire from the automation. Another strange thing is that, every once in a while, the PC does NOT mess up and does it correctly. Most of the time it does mess up, with the click being more noticeable some times compared to others. So it varies, depending on how fast PC decides the react to the automation each time I playback that part of the song. I did switch over to Sonitus like I mentioned above, which seems to react faster to automation than the PC.


What is Cakewalk FX:EQ? I only have Sonitus:EQ, Para-EQ, and LP-64 EQ. Am I missing something?

bitflipper


Maybe you don't have it, which could be the case if you started with X1 and it's no longer bundled. I think, though, that many of those older plugins are now available as free downloads.

What??? Where do I go to download these older plugins? It did seem to me that the there were not as many effects bundled with X1 as I had wanted...

brundlefly

I can't seem to get that click/noise out of my abrupt automation transitions.

I think you need to understand that a click is an abrupt transition. You can't have one without the other. Anytime you drastically alter the amplitude of a signal over a short period of time, you will tend to generate a glitch noise of some sort.

If I'm understanding what you're trying to do, I think I would approach it this way:

1. Split the clip at the transition point.
2. Put a short fast out fade to zero on the end of the first clip (3-5ms will usually give you smooth exit if you use the fast out curve).
3. Move the second clip to another track where you can have the automation for the High-pass filter freq already enabled with the frequency at minimum when you hit the start of the clip where it needs to start opening.

This way, you avoid the whole problem of having to hide the sound of the high-pass filter closing down on an active signal.

You might be able to achieve the same thing using overlapping envelopes for volume and filter-frequency automation, but I think the two track solution is more fool-proof.

I do understand that, but the "click" im talking about is not an actual "click" sound that you would hear if you change a volume envelope from 100% immediately down to, say, 20%. I'm automating the lo-pass filter (EQ) and the "click" i'm describe, for lack of a better word, is a sort of quick "sweep" sound that is very noticeable and annoying. If I had to sound it out with my mouth, it would be like an "jyooo" but very quick (lasts like half a second).


Unfortunately, I am automating the PC eq of a bus that has several (20 ish?) tracks sent to it.

the "click" im talking about is not an actual "click" sound that you would hear if you change a volume envelope from 100% immediately down to, say, 20%. I'm automating the lo-pass filter (EQ) and the "click" i'm describe, for lack of a better word, is a sort of quick "sweep" sound that is very noticeable and annoying. If I had to sound it out with my mouth, it would be like an "jyooo" but very quick (lasts like half a second).

Shutting down a low-pass (I accidentally wrote high-pass earlier) filter is going to cause a rapid change in amplitude as well as changing the frequency content. I would expect that to start out as a "whoosh", getting progressively more click-like the faster you do it. I don't think you can get away from that. as long as there's signal going through the filter when you shut it down.


The bottom line is you need to find a way to have already closed down when the signal hits it. Changing your buffer as czyky suggests may address the inconsistency you're hearing from one pass to the next, but I don't think it's going to eliminate the noise.


I see the problem of trying to do it on a bus. but I'm thiking you should still  be able to do what I described using a Prefader send to a second bus to get a second copy of the signal, and use volume automation on the two buses to kill the pre-sweep signal with a short fast-out curve between two nodes as you bring up the filtered bus with a complementary slow-in curve, and start opening the already closed filter.


Now you've got me curious. I might have to try it.  


I just tried the trick described in the last paragraph, and it worked like a charm. No bad "jyooo-jyooo".