Aligning different audio tracks: is there a better technique?

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okshaw
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2011/04/04 09:16:41 (permalink)

Aligning different audio tracks: is there a better technique?

For various good reasons that would take a long paragraph to describe,
I've generated two audio files for a project (one from Sibelius and another
from a different notation product), and I'm combining them in Sonar.

The two audio files have a different latency at the beginning, so I need to align
them.  I've done this by nudging one of them until they sound aligned.

Is there a more accurate way to do this?  I.e. to determine exactly where
the first audio is in the two tracks, so I can nudge them by the exact difference,
rather than by ear?  (both tracks start on beat 1).  Audio snap doesn't seem relevant.

Thanks

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    Slugbaby
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    Re:Aligning different audio tracks: is there a better technique? 2011/04/04 09:32:24 (permalink)
    If you turn off the Snap-To-Grid and zoom in, you can drag until the two tracks line up visually.
    Unfortunately that's the best option i can think of.

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    #2
    okshaw
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    Re:Aligning different audio tracks: is there a better technique? 2011/04/04 09:50:37 (permalink)
    Thanks.  That works better than just doing it by ear.
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    Bristol_Jonesey
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    Re:Aligning different audio tracks: is there a better technique? 2011/04/04 10:38:51 (permalink)
    If they were created in 2 different software packages, there is a chance they will drift out of sync as you play them together.


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    Rothchild
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    Re:Aligning different audio tracks: is there a better technique? 2011/04/04 11:39:43 (permalink)
    I used to do this sort of thing quite a bit for various (also long winded) reasons.

    The best thing IMO is to but a percussive noise in at the end of each sequence, or at the begining, (but they should be in the same relative position within the arrangement) and use this to line up the audio. With a percussive noise it's much easier to line them up. (using the slugbaby technique, I don't use nudge either just turn off snap and zoom in progressively down to individual samples).

    The most flakey cue I've had was the guitarist that did some overdubs at home and the sync cue was him cracking a tinny on the first snare of the 2 bar count in to where he was due to play!

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    #5
    bitflipper
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    Re:Aligning different audio tracks: is there a better technique? 2011/04/04 12:30:57 (permalink)
    Here's how I do it: a few beats prior to the start of the tracks, I go into the PRV and insert a short MIDI note with grid snap enabled so that I can precisely duplicate it in all tracks. Then I go to the audio file and zoom in until I can see the first sample of the first note and line it up with that MIDI note. This is more precise than lining up transients and works even if the tracks you're aligning are drastically different in terms of instrumentation.



    All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. 

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    #6
    Slugbaby
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    Re:Aligning different audio tracks: is there a better technique? 2011/04/04 13:13:46 (permalink)
    that initial percussive note is a good idea.  I may steal that for future projects.


    PS, Rothchild:  the 'slugbaby technique' is something totally different, and involves a lot of 'CTRL-Z'...

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    Rothchild
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    Re:Aligning different audio tracks: is there a better technique? 2011/04/04 13:33:33 (permalink)
    PS, Rothchild: the 'slugbaby technique' is something totally different, and involves a lot of 'CTRL-Z'...


    That sentence ended up much more palatable than I feared it might when I started reading it!

    I thought I'd add a couple of words about how I arrange things to make aligning audio easier.

    Obviously the first thing is having the tracks adjacent to each other and expanded in hight so you've got a good view of both of them. You might also like to adjust the 'gain zoom' (sorry don't know what this is called! When you grab the meter that separates the track header and the clips pane you can zoom the hight of the wave in the clip).

    If possible zoom your project so you can see the point you want to align and the point you want to align to it. Place the 'now time' marker on the transient you're going to be aligning to, then (with snap turned off) grab the clip you're aligning but grab it on the transient, you can then just move the mouse to where the play head is and you're going to be really close already.

    Because the playhead is already at that point it's easy to start zooming in and checking how well you've done. If you've got the same noise across the tracks that your aligning it makes it easier as you can just pick a recognisable feature (the first upwards peak, or an obvious little glitch or other recognisable shape and make sure their aligned. Again, I'll just put the play head on the feature in the reference track and grab the track to be aligned at that feature and move it to the play head. 

    When I'm really cooking with gas I can get a transient aligned to sample accuracy in about 4 moves and zooms.

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    #8
    okshaw
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    Re:Aligning different audio tracks: is there a better technique? 2011/04/04 17:25:27 (permalink)
    Many thanks for all the info.

    I'm afraid I must ask:  what's the "slugbaby technique"?
    #9
    Slugbaby
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    Re:Aligning different audio tracks: is there a better technique? 2011/04/04 19:02:59 (permalink)
    okshaw


    Many thanks for all the info.

    I'm afraid I must ask:  what's the "slugbaby technique"?

    Try something, fail, undo (ctrl-z).  Try something else, fail but hopefully better than the first time, undo (ctrl-z), try something else, fail but hopefully better than the second time, undo (ctrl-z) ...
    lol

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    #10
    okshaw
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    Re:Aligning different audio tracks: is there a better technique? 2011/04/04 20:25:00 (permalink)
    Thanks.  Now I'll have a name for what I do all the time.
    #11
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