Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro?

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cpellegr01
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/04/24 21:45:33 (permalink)
OK...I feel stupid. I can't even get Dim Pro to ***start***.

I'm running a G4 with Mac OSX 10.4. I ran the install (which never prompted me for a location) which consisted of 2 disks. Then I performed the update (1.2). I don't see Dim Pro in my Applications. The closest I can find to anything that looks like a program are the *.prog files.

What did I miss? Does it get invoked through some other program such as Garage Band? Did I not meet the minimum reqs?

Any help is appreciated.

#31
THERAKED
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/04/24 21:59:54 (permalink)
Try opening GB and inserting it as a Dxi or au or whatever you use on mac.
#32
cpellegr01
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/04/24 22:08:56 (permalink)
OK...so dimension pro doesn't have a UI of it's own? You have to invoke it via some other program?!

It doesn't say anything about that in the manual...I'm confused.
#33
THERAKED
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/04/24 22:47:49 (permalink)
It's a VST, Dxi, soft synth/sampler, I'm probably not the best to be answering this, but I do believe that you have to open it in a host program.
#34
THERAKED
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/04/24 22:49:21 (permalink)
I don't believe that it's a stand alone instrument, you do have a host program, right?
#35
lawapa
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/04/24 23:25:57 (permalink)
If you have no host there are free ones you can use to access Dimension in windows. While I've not searched for any mac apps. Could I be that Mac has no free hosts whatsoever? I do widows so, you know. Does GB host softsynths.
#36
whitefalcon
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/04/25 01:59:41 (permalink)
Youre Right Rene it does compare well.
The Dimension Pro sample is clearer and has better ambience then the other sample. At least to my ears this is so.
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whitefalcon
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/04/25 02:12:28 (permalink)
The important thing here is Dim Pro is right there with the other sample.
It is being compared to a sampler that is nothing but a Piano, Dimension is that and more, it keeps the pace with one of the best in the industry but can the other do the strings, the violins, the Dimensions that are in the device chain? Can it do any of those besides be a great piano? I say no. It cant, it is great at one thing, being a piano. Dimension is that and more.
No matter what you make in life, It could be perfection but there will always be someone that does not like it.
If one feels that there is a better Piano out there like The Grand 3 which is a very nice vsti piano of course buy that, but if you want a nice piano and more then Dimension Pro is competitive.
I agree now after reading details on pros and Cons of the Dim Pro sample, some of it is prefference. If you play around with some of the Piano vsts out there you will notice that there are not just one kind of piano sound. There are bright pianos, mellow pianos, even in the basic midi set this is the case. There are Pianos with strings, there are pianos that have a bit of honky tonk mixed in and some upright ones. I tune pianos or used to. And they all sound different. There are three strings in the mid range and all can be out of tune a bit creating interesting harmonics. So there is alot of variance in Piano sounds. The more expensive pianos sound clearer. Brandon said in his video and I think its true that the best pianos sound good in the higher ranges. The cheaper ones are muted in the higher ranges. The mid ranges are easier or harder to tell differences because they are more forgiving, add some harmonics and its hard to tell how good the piano sound really is in the mid ranges.
post edited by whitefalcon - 2006/04/25 02:21:29
#38
rpcomp
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/04/25 02:21:54 (permalink)
Well I’m amazed this post is still going a month after I first started it. As you know I was disappointed with the bread and butter sounds of Dim Pro and ended up purchasing a Motif ES rack. I also know that everyone has a preference for a particular sound, some like this, some like that so it’s very much a personal thing. I listened to the MP3 piano samples and did not like any of them. Am I asking too much? I don’t think so. I downloaded the test midi file and sent it to my ES Rack. Patch No 1 Full Grand. I compared it with all the MP3 pianos and it blew all of them away. For me it is just head and shoulders above anything else I have heard to date. I know it’s not a soft synth so maybe it’s an unfair comparison but the Motif only has 175MB ROM for over a 1000 sounds, not 230MB for just one piano. I would love for the Cakewalk crew to have a listen to the test file on a Motif ES and then compare with Dim Pro. For me there’s just an unnatural hard edge to the Dim Pro. I should perhaps add that I purchased the Motif because the pianos and guitars were exactly what I was looking for. This is just my opinion and we all know everybody has one.
#39
THERAKED
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/04/25 02:35:12 (permalink)
I was looking for a good piano, and was initially looking at the Grand, but for the same price I got eveything else with DP, personally, I couldn't be happier.
#40
René
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/04/25 06:51:57 (permalink)
Here's the Motif ES Grand Piano vs. Dimension Pro piano:

Yamaha Motif ES - Full Grand

Dimension Pro Piano


Don't let the specification numbers fool you. Memory in hardware modules is heavily compressed, using different tricks. You can think of those as mp3 files of high quality of the original samples. The sizes reported by soft samplers are PCM sizes, uncompressed. Those 175MB can very well be above 1.xGB after decompression.

Still, it's a compressed (as in using a tube compressor in the recording path) piano, which might be cool for pop/rock tunes but a no-go for many other styles. I'd rather have the option to use a compressor myself, if/when needed. It's also heavily eq'ed at several spots. Oh well taste But the main question remains, does it sound more 'real' than Dimension Pro piano? When you close your eyes, does it make you hear a real piano?

Anyways, thanks for the reference. We'll keep that one in mind.



-René

#41
rpcomp
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/04/25 08:03:23 (permalink)
Wow you guys are on the ball. We could still be discussing this next Easter!!! And your right, I play pop-rock songs and for me it works. Just sits nicely in a mix. I’m not technically minded, I just use my ears so I’m sure your right in saying the Motif would not work in every situation, but for what I do, it’s the sound I like. I’m sure some of the more talented aficionados are going to bag it but I think we’re all agreed it’s a matter of taste. And further, as I mentioned before, some of the Dim Pro sounds eat the Motif. 10 out of 10 for such a quick, informative and honest response. Thanks Rene.
#42
BillW
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/04/25 08:04:22 (permalink)

ORIGINAL: René

Here's the Motif ES Grand Piano vs. Dimension Pro piano:

Yamaha Motif ES - Full Grand

Dimension Pro Piano


Don't let the specification numbers fool you. Memory in hardware modules is heavily compressed, using different tricks. You can think of those as mp3 files of high quality of the original samples. The sizes reported by soft samplers are PCM sizes, uncompressed. Those 175MB can very well be above 1.xGB after decompression.

Still, it's a compressed (as in using a tube compressor in the recording path) piano, which might be cool for pop/rock tunes but a no-go for many other styles. I'd rather have the option to use a compressor myself, if/when needed. It's also heavily eq'ed at several spots. Oh well taste But the main question remains, does it sound more 'real' than Dimension Pro piano? When you close your eyes, does it make you hear a real piano?

Anyways, thanks for the reference. We'll keep that one in mind.



-René




The Yammy piano is an improvement on the Oasys, but not necessarily on DimPro. They're both decent sounding pianos, they're just different. I own an S90ES (which has that 53MB piano on top of the ES samples)...I can put up an MP3 of that if you're interested.

I'm not in the camp that believes more megabytes = a better sounding piano. My main piano sound in the studio is still William Coakley's Volume V, which takes up less than 128MB in my Fantom X6.



Intel Core 2 Duo 6600, ASUS P5B, 2GB, Vista Ultimate 32 (Sonar X2 Producer) , Emu 1820m

Roland Fantom G6 (2); Korg Kronos 61; Privia PX-350
#43
CharlieSolak
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/04/26 21:42:43 (permalink)
I listened to both at length. Neither of them sound like Dpro or Oasys.

I must have gotten a bad download, three times.

I can not find a sample on Dpro that sounds like either of the samples, nor can I find an audio or video that sounds like the Oasys.

Oh well. Nice playing whatever it was.
#44
René
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/04/27 08:15:36 (permalink)
Well, it's surprising how Dimension Pro can sound different than Dimension Pro sometimes. Here's the SONAR project I used to create the snippet. All needed to recreate the snippet is SONAR and Dimension Pro. Having those installed, just load the project.


http://www.rgcstuff.com/External/DimensionProPiano.cwp



-René
#45
tomhan
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/04/30 14:31:17 (permalink)
I have to join the ranks of those that are less than thrilled with the onboard sample sounds. I talking mainly about the more or less pure acoustic instrument sounds and not the synthesized or manipulated ones. I have to say I'm a bit spoiled in that my primary piano sound is a K2000 Young Chang sample that is 1 gb in size. When I AB the two all I can say is the K2000 makes me feel like I'm in the room with the piano and the DP sounds like I'm listening to a nice recording of a piano. Very distinct difference. I was hoping to ultimately replace a lot of my hardware synth units but I guess it's not to be just yet. DP has a lot of power and some interesting sound sculptures but I don't think it is the king of sample playback at this point in time. I'm not unhappy with my purchase because there is a lot of potential under the hood of DP. I was just hoping for more in terms of pure acoustic rendition. Synthesizers in general are a dime a dozen. One more thought. I seems to me that the Dimension piano (230mb) is geared more towards classical music. I'm having a difficult time getting it to set in the mix of rock fusion type material. It just doesn't want to play with the other guys.

To have peace, teach peace.
#46
lfm
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/05/01 07:35:21 (permalink)

ORIGINAL: tomhan

I was hoping to ultimately replace a lot of my hardware synth units but I guess it's not to be just yet. DP has a lot of power and some interesting sound sculptures but I don't think it is the king of sample playback at this point in time.


Did you try this:
http://www.cdxtract.com/samplit.php

Turning your favourite hardware to software sampler library.

I think it's too much to expect the top of the line on every possible instrument in a large library collection. The needs are very different for different projects and persons.

I don't know if I am imagine this or not, but after update to DP 1.2 I think the pianos sound better. Less hard attack or something. I turned to my old Piano collection in SampleTank before, but now I'm not sure I need to do that anymore.

I'm curious about what might turn up as addons to DP in future.
#47
tomhan
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/05/01 14:09:11 (permalink)
ORIGINAL: lfm


ORIGINAL: tomhan

I was hoping to ultimately replace a lot of my hardware synth units but I guess it's not to be just yet. DP has a lot of power and some interesting sound sculptures but I don't think it is the king of sample playback at this point in time.


Did you try this:
http://www.cdxtract.com/samplit.php

Turning your favourite hardware to software sampler library.

I think it's too much to expect the top of the line on every possible instrument in a large library collection. The needs are very different for different projects and persons.

I don't know if I am imagine this or not, but after update to DP 1.2 I think the pianos sound better. Less hard attack or something. I turned to my old Piano collection in SampleTank before, but now I'm not sure I need to do that anymore.

I'm curious about what might turn up as addons to DP in future.
Thanks for the tip. This looks like an interesting program. I'm still on the fence as to what my next softsample player will be but it looks like you need Halion, sampletank, etc to play the converted files. Great idea though for grabbing some of my favorite hardware samples.

To have peace, teach peace.
#48
CapnSpanky
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/05/04 14:31:50 (permalink)
DP is definitely better. The Oasys has sort of a sparkly thing going on. That might make it sound good in certain mixes.

I have DP and I'm pleased with it. The sounds are at least equal and often superior to my Yamaha S80, Roland SC88, and my other soft synths. I bought Sonic Synth I a few years back after reading all the hype on KVR about it. Man!! Talk about an over-rated synth.

I look forward to more sounds sets coming out for DP.

Tim Wells
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Cap'n Spanky
From the Planet Screwball
#49
stratcat33511
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/05/04 15:38:23 (permalink)
I came - I bought P5V2 - I saw and heard the Dimension pianos
it's my goto instrument for pianos
I have the EVM grand as well.
I like My Dimension


Dim
#50
mewsicknerd
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/05/05 13:20:41 (permalink)
ORIGINAL: rpcomp
I downloaded the test midi file and sent it to my ES Rack. Patch No 1 Full Grand. I compared it with all the MP3 pianos and it blew all of them away. For me it is just head and shoulders above anything else I have heard to date.


Hi rpcomp,
Could you upload an MP3 of the file you rendered so that we could see what the ES Rack
sounds like compared to Dimension?
#51
mewsicknerd
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/05/05 15:41:00 (permalink)
ORIGINAL: CharlieSolak

A refund was appoved by support twice and apparently Josh had the final say.

[edit]

Sorry, for offending anyone. In the customer is always right department, Cakewalk should have refunded rather than excuse.


I can't remember a time when I've last heard of a software company giving a refund on a software product. This is especially true when:
1) There is no copy protection on the product
2) There is a downloadable demo so that you can try the product first.

Anyway, could you comment on your disappointment? What seems surprising is that you were "impressed" by demos, which I assume where only .mp3 quality audio performances, and so unimpressed by the actual product. I would think you could just play the MIDI file to recreate the same "impressive" sound.

Perhaps there is an issue with your PC configuration / sound card? In what manner did the
sound of the demo not equal the sound of the product? Or are you commenting on your perception of what the UI should be?
#52
dougsyo
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/05/06 11:55:02 (permalink)
The only DimPro instrument I've been disappointed with so far was one of the Hammond organ/fast Leslie patches. Towards the high end of the scale it's obvious there are not enough samples, the Leslie speed increases noticably as you go up the scale.

This is - unfortunately - common with other sampled Hammond/Leslies as well. Some of the other Hammonds sound better because it sounds like they're using no Leslie, but an LFO for the vibrato. That works well across the keyboard.

(For what it's worth, I've had B-4 since 2001 or so, and B-4 II is currently my fave Hammond/Leslie clone, so I don't usually bother with sampled B-3's. But it is something I often check out in samplers).

Doug

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#53
lawapa
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/05/06 19:49:36 (permalink)
Doug; I was wondering? Is it possible the original B3's range did not extend that far? If a real B3 was sampled with Leslie the last sample would be stretched up to accommodate that extended rage and give a less than worth while performance just past it's true range. I ask this because as I remember it the ol hammonds did have a limited range. Great TONE but limited range.
#54
blueelectron9
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/05/08 16:39:16 (permalink)
I thought the Yam. sounded a bit brighter/lighter and more open compared to the DP sample. Both were pretty close, but I can see where the original poster said the Yam. sounded more live and DP sounded more like a recording--slightly rounder and more laid-back. I'm not sure if the MP3 encoders have anything to do with the samples being so different.

I agree that it was definitely better than the Oasys (?) sample posted earlier, which sounded very artificial and MIDI-esque to me. In that regard, the DP certainly proved to be better.

I'll bet that with a touch of EQ or reverb, one could get the DP to sound as good as that Yam. sample (or higher bitrate MP3, better encoder, etc.).

I'm listening through a pair of Sennheiser HD650's.

--Scott
#55
Gerry
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/05/18 07:54:51 (permalink)
I think Dim Pro is brilliant and a great edition to anyones sound pallette but a virtual knob will never replace a real one.
When my new Motif ES Rack arrives I certainly will not be comparing it with Dim Pro but using them both when and as best I can. I don't see them as competitors but tools to use as and when.

Someone just sent me a vid of a French guy with a pile of Bulb Horns strapped to his body. A pure demonstration of its not what you have its how you use it.

Cubase or Sonar? Fender or Gibson? Dim Pro Piano or Motif, Oasy's etc. What is best for you is the best and that really is the bottom line

JMHO

Gerry

 
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http://www.gerrycooper.com/


#56
kudzu
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/05/18 15:27:29 (permalink)
I just presented a final composition for a music production class at school. I used only Dpro (rhodes,buzuki,grand piano, muted bass,guitars and a few of the "dimensions"). Other than the "dimensions" and some percussion loops, everyone thaught I used live instruments. I think Dpro especially shines with the electric pianos and other synth sounds. I am not completely pleased with ALL of the guitar sounds, but there are at least 8 that I use regularly, and no one can tell it is a synth. I am not so pleased with the garritan pocket orch, I guess my expectations were too high, but it is still better than most others I have heard. So to me, Dpro is fantastic and I can't wait to use Rapture! I'd like to add, the final kicker that got me to purchase Dpro was one of Rene's(or maybe B-rocks?)compositions posted in the project5 forum a few months ago. It was mainly guitar and it ROCKED! I still can't figure out how you did it!

namaste'
#57
b rock
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/05/18 15:32:53 (permalink)
one of Rene's(or maybe B-rocks?)compositions posted in the project5 forum a few months ago. It was mainly guitar and it ROCKED!
Was it shredder guitar, Kevin? Just a wild guess, but I don't think that was Rene ...
#58
kudzu
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/05/18 17:08:15 (permalink)
Yup! sorry, been a while since I was on Awesome mix, I wish some of the people not pleased with the guitar sounds in Dpro could hear that one!

namaste'
#59
Infinite5ths
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RE: Am I Wrong To Be Disappointed With Dim Pro? 2006/05/21 14:16:15 (permalink)
This is a bit off-topic for this thread...but it does relate:

I've got a Roland JV-1010 (baby brother of the JV-1080). I'd like to pick up a software instrument that has the same breadth of sound types. I've got GPO and some analog synths, but I'm missing guitars (mainly acoustic), vocal/choir sounds, percussion/rhythm, and some ethnic instruments. I still have to pull those from the JV.

Will DimPro fill the same slot that that the JV-1010 does, or does it have a dramatically different balance of sound types?
post edited by Infinite5ths - 2006/05/21 14:25:44

Mike
MichaelDanchi.com
IPM Productions
Sonar 8PE, Project 5 v2.5, Rapture, Dimension Pro, Z3TA+, RME FF400 + Presonus DigiMax FS
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