[Answered, but still not happy] AD2 Presets/Mixer Question

The snares are showing consistent normal level for me in the console view

I think I answered my own question, but this still bothers me. The 35.6dB snare came from one of the Fairfax presets, but pretty much all of the Metal kits violate this... here is one example (+16.7dB snare).
 
 
There IS a compressor on the Master out, and the Gain Reduction spikes dramatically (I missed the snare on the screen cap which is way more than the kick).
 
 
I also highlighted the send buttons... but am still a bit put off that the individual tracks are running so hot. With these presets that hot, it pretty much requires mixing within the AD2 engine without adding a lot of overhead within SONAR.
 
Still debating this one, but is only day 2! I will say that I am very impressed by the recorder function in AD2, as I was pulling one shots from AD1 with Geist's "Spitter" and no longer need to do this. Layering with samples from AD2 is significantly simpler.

Not seeing this. I have the metal kits, and when I load Metal Mayhem, it defaults to -3db using the Metal song pack. Also, the default output for me is master only. I set up a template for individual outs, but didn't combine the master. Still, not peaking over 0db.
 
How are you inserting the program?

I'm not getting what you are saying, but the one thing I notice that is different, is when I use the console in sonar to mix, I have all the faders in the AD2 down, as I am not using them. So this may help or be completely missing your point.

Just checked and on my AD2 mixer the routing arrow is yellow, unlike Mattelus' picture where they are green. Testing this,
un-highlighted = Master (normal set up)
Yellow = Seperate out - direct to to individual channel in Sonar (a direct out bypassing AD2)
Green = Seperate out + Master ( so you can parallel process)
 
But it seems this doesn't seem to be the issue. I have just set a kick to green and moving the fader in AD2 has no effect on the separate out level in Sonar.
 
 

Since I had to log back in to reply, I checked just inserting AD2 on the normal template as well.
 
By inserting AD2 as a VSTi (even with all outputs shown) the default sends of each piece inside AD2 goes to master only. So unless you enable the send on pieces to either "Separate Out" or "Separate Out + Master" you will not see the levels of the individual pieces... AD2's Master buss compressor (on the kit shown above) has a fast attack with a threshold of -18dB and ratio of 5.3:1. Pretty aggressive, so the "Master" output of AD2 never clips. No biggie, so working just inside AD2 life is grand.
 
Some folks either want to process individual pieces within SONAR itself, or sample them for layering elsewhere. With these pieces running this hot it requires more work to achieve either of these. Mixing them within AD2 itself is no big deal (and may be why they set them this way), but they cannot simply be "routed elsewhere" without realizing how hot these are.
 
I have not gotten too deep into this yet, but AD2 also supports layering better than AD1, and it is easy to fire AD2 with any MIDI input. However, I do not see a method to get sounds into AD2, so I can only layer what I have bought from them (big limitation). With my current setup I can layer any sounds I choose/have access to.
 
The point with the OP was more wondering why the individual pieces are so hot, but unless someone used that template (or inserted AD2 and turned the individual pieces on) they would "never know."
 
Edit: The Audio Recorder in AD2 seems to tap into the Master out so is seeing more effect chain than an individual piece. Although this benefits layering tremendously, it is still a little "clunkier" than I am used to now.

I always prefer to have access to the individual kitpieces within the DAW. I'm starting to warm up tot he idea of using drum sampler's internal processing (and obviously XLN have provided some quality effects in this package) but seriously... it should be known that most producers are going to want to tweak things on a track per track basis as needed within their DAW or do any of the plethora of tasks one would use individual outs for. Even just for level adjustments. Who wants to have to mix in TWO seperate consoles.
 
As I said earlier the simple fix to these hot outputs, and this is pretty standard anyway, is to multi select all the audio outs and reduce their Gain levels before they slam into the ProChannel strip. However with signals THIS hot and varied the Gain reduction may be so drastic that it leaves little room to turn things down after that if need be. If we are forced to turn the Gain down past 12 o'clock that would be excessive.
 
Anyway... I get the idea that these are "mix ready" presets and they expect people to just drop them in and forget it but obviously many people do not work that way and every track is different with different needs. The presets (well some of them) do sound awesome based on my initial tests but there are things I will definitely need to change. Some if it within AD but much would be using Sonar tools. It will take some time to really dig into all this and I'm sure there is a logic behind it all but it seems like a huge distraction/learning curve for no good reason.
 
Maybe they should have added an extra direct out option of "Output to DAW at -12dB".
 
Meh.
 
Edit: And sorry if that all sounds whack, whiny and confused. I really am all discomboobulated today and probably not fully understanding what's going on here. Perhaps XLN have provided decent options but that interface is really quite offputting at first glance and I dread having to meander around it more than I need to.

Insert Soft Synth > VST2> AD2
(Insert Soft Synth options = Midi Source TICK, All Synth Audio Outputs : Mono TICK)
Deleted Tracks I did not need, Master and Buss tracks
Renamed them, because they have ridiculously long names
Opened AD2 Gui and set all the outs I am using to yellow
In console view picked up the mono Overheads and Room inputs and changed to Stereo
 
Picked a kit a random and played. Only thing running hot was a cowbell, checked EDIT page and saw the Output on Master was a little high and set to zero. It was then fine.
 
I don't have the Metal kit to check, but I have 15 snares and they were all fine with the brush snare being noticeably lower.