Anyone ever remaster old CDs?

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redbarchetta
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2013/03/08 18:05:52 (permalink)

Anyone ever remaster old CDs?

Hey all, just wondering if anyone has ever tried to remaster some of their older CDs?  Some of them back in the late 80's and early 90's sound rather stale by todays standards.  Just wondering if any of you have given it a shot and did you have much success?


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    Danny Danzi
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/08 18:07:33 (permalink)
    Hahaha yeah, I've done this way too many times to count. That's part of how I got my mastering skills up to par. Nothing like practicing on older mixes that weren't really mastered much compared to how things are done today. I've had great results on everything....once I knew what I was doing. LOL! :)

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    #2
    redbarchetta
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/08 18:10:25 (permalink)
    Excellent... Great to know it can be done. For some reason Van Halen's Diver Down seems to be kind of drab sounding. Might have to play with that one.

    Any suggestions?  Maybe you should do a video for us.  (strong hint, strong hint) 


    Rick - Sofware Engineer by trade, Rock Star God wannabe 
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    #3
    Danny Danzi
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/08 19:27:41 (permalink)
    Hahahaha! You know it's funny man....when I do videos for clients as I mix their material, I have no problems showing them everything I know. Yet, when someone asks me to do a mastering video...I always decline. Hahahaha! Some things...I sort of keep to myself because...well, if you like the results I get, you'll put me out of business. :)

    Yeah, as an old VH lover myself (I also play in a VH tribute band) that album definitely needed some work.

    Funny you mention them Red, we have been working on a demo for our tribute act for show booking etc. I wanted to try for a modern type sound in a sense, but using some of the older type sounds along with using the 1984 drum kit. It's not quite turned out the way I hoped...lol...but it's "interesting". Check it out....here's "Unchained"

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/lpb40cyeatkf3jn/Unchained%20MGK%20Final.mp3

    It's a half step down from the original because I tune goofy and really liked the sound of the low C chug thing. So this is sort of my take on a little more modern VH doing the old stuff. :)

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    redbarchetta
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/08 19:41:35 (permalink)
    Danny,
    WOW, you did a fantastic job on Eddies tone. I mean wow!  Are you getting that mostly out of your gear, or are you using a lot of Sonar and plugs to get that tone?  It is after all the wholly grail of tones considered by many. 
    So, the original was in drop d? 

    In one of my guitars I have the Seymour Duncan 78 custom.  Allegedly it's supposed to be the exact same pup that Seymour Duncan wound for Eddie back int the day.  Had to special order it from Duncan.  Nice pup. 


    Rick - Sofware Engineer by trade, Rock Star God wannabe 
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    #5
    michaelhanson
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/08 19:52:34 (permalink)
    So, how did you talk Edward into playing on this version?

    Mike

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    Danny Danzi
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/08 19:53:04 (permalink)
    redbarchetta


    Danny,
    WOW, you did a fantastic job on Eddies tone. I mean wow!  Are you getting that mostly out of your gear, or are you using a lot of Sonar and plugs to get that tone?  It is after all the wholly grail of tones considered by many. 
    So, the original was in drop d? 

    In one of my guitars I have the Seymour Duncan 78 custom.  Allegedly it's supposed to be the exact same pup that Seymour Duncan wound for Eddie back int the day.  Had to special order it from Duncan.  Nice pup. 

    Thanks man, much appreciated! The core of the tone comes from my gear, yeah. From there, to try and grab some of what Ed was doing due to recording with tape, the sound went through a UAD Studer Tape sim to just give it that saturated sound. See, this is the stuff I mean when you hear me say "UAD has it down with these saturator type things" as well as "this is why you buy the pricier plugs because these are the differences they give you."
     
    There were a few Sonar plugs used on the guitar sound. Sonitus compressor (taking away about -2 dB of gain) a Sonitus eq to further tweak it up to make it gel in the mix, Sonitus reverb and the delay is a Sonitus delay. Sonar effects are great for processing...like reverbs, delay etc. But some of the more "color" type plugs for compression or saturation....they just don't make the grade for me.
     
    Like the flanger you hear on that...that's the flanger in my 2101 processor used in real time. I literally stepped on the pedal each time to turn it off and on. It's weird...I have a system to where I can make the flanger go up then down on each phrase timed perfectly....but I have to launch the patch in my 2101 just right at the start. I have to count it in before I play. LOL! But when I do it right, that flange goes up and down near perfectly in real time EVERY time.
     
    So yeah, for certain things, Sonar plugs rock. For other things...they just don't quite deliver for me. I can use a Sonitus compressor for just about any instrument. That's only when I want a compressor though without coloration, see what I mean? There are times something from UAD like a NEVE 33609 (used on all vocals) makes an incredible difference and adds a tone characteristic that I can't explain.
     
    Or how the Fairchild I use just gives me a sound that I don't get in anything else. So for some things, Sonar plugs rule and I'd be lost without them. But for other things, there's a pretty incredible difference for the better when you compare.
     
    So to really answer your question...and this is not a bash on Sonar plugs, but I could have used any delay, compressor, eq or reverb to get the sound processing you heard. The actual sound, comes from my guitar and the 2101 tube guitar pre I'm using.
     
    Hahaha....I got that same Duncan pup in one of my B.C Rich guitars. Then I swithced over to the Duncan Trem Custom because it just gave me a little more mids and beef. So that's what I use now unless I'm using one of my Carvin guitars. I left them all stock because the pups were perfect as they were. I didn't buy the stock pups though, I got the upgraded ones they offer when I had the guitars built for me.
     
    Glad you enjoyed the tune though...thanks brother. I figured you might get a kick out of that. :)
     
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    Danny Danzi
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/08 20:05:54 (permalink)
    MakeShift


    So, how did you talk Edward into playing on this version?

    LOL! You're too kind Mike. It's funny, my cover band was just on the radio the other night (I had to call in from the studio because, well you know, my work is never done here) and one of the jocks was telling me how I was one of the best VH cover dudes he had ever heard. Going on about my version of Eruption etc. I'm sitting here turning red because well, honest, I make myself sick when I really listen to me. I did a search on Youtube one time and found 100 guys that obliterate me at VH...it made me want to quit the band.
     
    So on the radio, I of course had to tell them I didn't agree and am just a pro at pulling the wool over their eyes/ears. When you're in a tribute band, you try to be as accurate as possible. My problem is, I don't try. I always add myself into it "inspired by" Eddie. So in all honesty, I don't play a single one of those songs right. I just sort of do my own thing and hope people like my take on it. I never liked the whole "clone it perfectly" concept...but part of that is because I simply can't play the stuff. Between my goofy tuning that stops me from playing certain things and just being a hack, I'm soo insecure and hard on myself...it's a wonder I can even perform live. But I thank you for the awesome compliment.
     
    Funny story really quick. We do this festival in PA all the time. The chick that hosts it and hires us, is a hair stylist for the stars. Wolfgang VH was touring in some band he's in on the side and got his hair cut at the place. They ran camera on him and because they wanted to see his reaction when he heard our tribute band playing his dad's stuff since this chick loves us. The first thing he said was "that guitar player looks a bit like my dad....and what the heck is he tuned to?! That isn't how we play that song. He's weird like my dad too!" Hahaha...well, I cracked up when I heard and saw that. Was pretty cool. :) Thanks again man.
     
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    maximumpower
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/08 20:57:25 (permalink)
    What a great topic redbarchetta! 

    I wouldn't mind hearing SRVs Texas Flood re-mastered.
    Danny, since you brought it up, what Carvin pickups are you using in your Carvins?


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    michaelhanson
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/08 21:00:39 (permalink)
    Sounded pretty convincing to me.

    Ya, know, I have read many occasions where guitarist say that they don't play their famous lead parts the same every night.  I seem to remember reading an article just recently where Frampton said that he tries to hit the most recognizable parts of his solos, but changes them up, some what, each night he plays....and then in joking manor, basically says that he couldn't probably play them exactly the same anyway if he tried.

    For me anyway, when I do one of my very limited abilities solos, a lot of it becomes an expression of how I feel at that moment anyway.  A little free form soloing is kind of where the soul is found.

    Mike

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    Danny Danzi
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/08 23:36:18 (permalink)
    max: I just spent the last 10 mins looking for my build receipts for those guitars. I just saw them last week! I have no clue what pups they are...MD something maybe? Sorry man...it's been years so I really have no idea but I know I didn't choose the ones that come stock. I paid a few extra dollars and got the best ones thet had and talked to the guy on the phone telling him what style I play. Whatever he recommended, they sound incredible. I need to find those receipts though...so when I do, I'll tell you what they are.

    I got 3 Carvins....each with different pups as they came out with new stuff each time I bought a guitar from them. I'll get back to you on this!

    Mike: Thanks bro! Yeah, soul soloing is really nice. But with the VH stuff, I try to keep the important parts in when I can. The rest is me doodling around with a VH tone...so it's like at that point, anything you do sort of sounds like Eddie unless I start sweeping arps and doing Malmsteen stuff. It's funny, when I do my own stuff, I nail it all note for note because I feel I have to. It's rare for me to alter my path there...but every once in a while, I may get a little pumped up and do the real solo and then improv some stuff after it and make it a little longer. I always tell my guys "watch me...if I get in the zone, I'll turn around and flick my tongue at you." That's our signal. LOL! So they know to keep on vamping that section until I cue them.

    I actually like when artists play a different version of a solo live....but it MUST be better than the original! And if a solo is sick enough on record, they HAVE to nail it or I'm depressed. LOL! :)

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    #11
    Guitarhacker
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/09 08:36:15 (permalink)
    A few years back I was listening to one of my old cassettes. As everyone knows, tapes do tend to degrade with time and this one was sounding like it was under a blanket.... bass was not distinct, and highs were all muted by several db.

    I copied it from cassette into Cake and used Ozone on it. Just a mild touch on the highs and low end as well as using the multiband compression and just generally experimenting. 

    The results were a huge improvement. I do believe it sounded better than the original on the day I bought it. It was from the 90's and country rock so as Danny said, they were not doing much in the way of mastering back then like we do today.  Country and country rock didn't really have the punch in it back then, nor the fat earth shaking bottom end like some of it does today. 

    Yes... it's totally possible to get a re-mastering of older stuff, and have it sound better when it's done correctly than it did originally. 

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    #12
    chuckebaby
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/09 09:27:11 (permalink)
    ozone rx is one of the most powerful tools ive ever used.
    I only re-master oler projects from bands that will drop in there 1980/1990's , 4.8 and 16 track demos for re mastering.
    I own a 16 trask Tascam so I see some business from clients who need someone who has one.
    my prices are also probably half of what it costs to send it out or bring it somewhere and have it done by a professional company,not that I think im not professional im just saying.

    ive used ozone rx to clean up rotten tracks,i mean really rotten tracks.
    I did a project where the lead singer pluged in to an old roland jazz chorus guitar amp and sang through that to get the effects of chorus,what a mess.

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    JTMusicVA
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/09 10:16:18 (permalink)
    Hey Red.
    Started a great discussion here! Yes, I remaster old stuff as well. I think the trick is NOT to get too crazy with the enhancements, i.e. too much high-end and bottom-end, which get too easy to go overboard with.
    But hey, there's no rule against experimentation! Right? Therein lies the fun in it all!

    I think iZotope's products, especially Ozone 5, are wonderful mastering tools! I however use Adobe Audition for mastering/remastering, mostly; as well as Sony Sound Forge. But yeah, I need to give Sonar a try as a mastering/remastering tool.
    If you really want to get crazy with remastering older stuff, check out the latest offering from Sony - "Spectral Layers Pro". Can do some really cool stuff with that.

    If you want some REAL fun and challenges (and you have a surround sound system available), convert stereo mixes to multi-channel surround sound. That's my specialty!

    Have fun, bud!

    JT

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    #14
    JTMusicVA
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/09 10:25:03 (permalink)
    Hey Chuckebaby - 
    Do you "remaster" (rescue) 4-track cassette? I had a Tascam Syncaset from the 80's that I was going to use to transfer stuff into Sonar, but, I dropped the machine and it broke!!
    I have several 4 track cassettes (3-3/4 ips, and DBX NR) I'd love to get transferred into Sonar (X2a)...... Can you do that, and for how much?

    The Stuff: Sonar X2a Producer 64 AND 32-bit installed (!!!), jBridger, old-school analog VST synths, PC (AMD 4-core CPU @ 3.7GHz, 16GB RAM, SSD drive (32GB)), Windows 7 Ultimate SP1 x64, Lexicon Omega & EgoSys Waveterminal 192L audio interfaces, ART DI/O tube A/D/A converter-Tung Sol tube, Novation RemoteZero SL controller, Novation X-Synth, BOSS DR-660 drum mach., Mackie MR5 monitors, Focusrite VRM Box, AT M50 headphones... blah blah blah...
    #15
    maximumpower
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/09 10:32:24 (permalink)
    Danny, probably M22SDs. No need to look them up on my account. I like my Carvin gear, so when you mentioned Carvin, I just wanted to know more :-)

    WRT mastering, is the biggest difference, do you think, between what we here today and like, have more to do with the switch to digital or better mastering tools? Or are people just better at mastering now because of collective experiences?

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    daveny5
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/09 11:01:51 (permalink)
    I have cleaned up some old cassettes, but I wouldn't mess with a commercial CD. I want to hear the original sound the way it was released. That's just me though. 

    Dave
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    Cactus Music
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/09 11:41:30 (permalink)
    I have done this to most of my older works from Cassette, but by the time we were printing to CD via DAT Masters things were pretty good Eq and sonic quality wise.
     The only thing I have done is make them Louder. :) 
     One song I added some reberb at the end because the original got cut off suddenly as the Multi track ran out of room. Adding reverb made a new longer ending. Little things that bugged me. 
    Yesterday I copied an old Tape from 1973 over to digital. I didn't touch it as I don't think it would do much good. It sounds like an old tape, so what. Just recorded it to Wave Lab and Normalized to -2db. 
    I'm not in this band yet until 1982, Curt the banjo player and me are working on a project that includes some of these songs. 

    http://soundclick.com/MonasheeMntnBluegrassBand




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    #18
    Progmatist
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/09 11:54:47 (permalink)
    I routinely remaster vinyl records after digitizing them. These records tend to be hit and miss: some are too bassey, some are too tinny.
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    chuckebaby
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/09 14:16:13 (permalink)
    JTMusicVA


    Hey Chuckebaby - 
    Do you "remaster" (rescue) 4-track cassette? I had a Tascam Syncaset from the 80's that I was going to use to transfer stuff into Sonar, but, I dropped the machine and it broke!!
    I have several 4 track cassettes (3-3/4 ips, and DBX NR) I'd love to get transferred into Sonar (X2a)...... Can you do that, and for how much?

    yup.sent you a message detailing everything man.
    16 bucks a song for transfer to .wav files.
    these load in to sonar easy as pie  !!!
     
    Charlie

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    #20
    redbarchetta
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    Re:Anyone ever remaster old CDs? 2013/03/09 14:33:28 (permalink)
    Thanks for all the feedback. I think I might give it a shot.  My goal thought will be to try and use the stock plugins from Sonar and the expanded pack for the Pro Channel that I bought. 



    Rick - Sofware Engineer by trade, Rock Star God wannabe 
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