Anyone using the Presonus StudioLive RM (For Live AND/OR Studio)?

 Thinking this might be a nice interface/live system...
 
Information here:
http://www.presonus.com/products/StudioLive-RM-Series
 

Hi Pat.  I am a Presonus user and recently the Presonus road-show visited Australia so I can tell you a few things.  The RM stuff is excellent but it is still geared towards live, not studio.  (note you can use it in the studio but you really need racks of DI's in order to get balanced and unbalanced TS and TRS connections into the RM boxes.)  If so for live the RM units can be controlled by the UC software that runs on any computer although one with a touch screen is advisable.
 
The RM stuff can also be controlled by the new Presonus CS18AI mixer which has just come out as well instead of a computer.  More like a hardware mixer talking to the RM stuff.  Good thing about the CS18AI is it is also a complete control surface for Studio One software which is also rather cool. (what is cool is you can flick a switch and leave the Live mix alone and it all stays the same and then you can go over to Studio One for complete control and then go back to the live mix. Way good) But even so it is still more for Live apps where you might be running Studio One live along side a live RM mix.  (Although if you are just recording the live gig 'Capture' can do that as well.)
 
Now I am interested in studio applications rather than live and I would love a studio version of the RM box so I can plug in TRS/TS balanced/unbalanced line levels (synths) and Mics and RCA inputs etc..  I asked them if they were going to do something like this and they said maybe later but not now.
 
Good news is what is coming though next year is a new version of the StudioLive mixers but they are going to have DAW control built in and be able to talk directly to StudioOne  (and I am pretty sure other DAW's as well like the Faderport can, they are going to allow various control surface protocols I am sure)  The Studio Live mixers have all the connectivity you need for a decent studio setup. Not sure about this but they might also feature motorised faders too like the CS18AI.  So they are going to do something in between the CS18AI and the now existing StudioLive mixers which sounds sensible to me too.  There will only be 16 and 32 channel versions though.  All the Mic Pres will now be remote controlled via Studio One software. (and maybe a stand alone app if you are on a different DAW)

nice comparison of the Studio live 16.02, Behringer and Mackie dl 1608
https://www.gearslutz.com...udiolive-16-0-2-a.html
 

Vastman
isn't technological advance in this field amazing?   The Berhinger looks eminently more affordable for the needs of live shows at less than half the price and with direct recording to a DAW already.... good for studio tracking also???

 
The X32 is a great unit but it does not solve the issue of the stage box being on the stage.  The X32 is $2300 at Sweetwater.  The S32 channel remote stage box is $1500.  I am not not sure if the X32 and S32 can run in tandem.
 
The Presonus RM32 is $1800.  And it can be controlled by a free app that runs on any spare laptop you might have around with a touch screen.  The CS18Ai is $2000 so $3800 for both units together.  Or only $1800 for the RM32 stage box with an existing computer.
 
The CS18Ai will also handle 64 channels too by the way.  So the extra RM32 could be added in later.  Both options are different but the Presonus setup could also be had for reasonable money as well.
 
For anyone running Studio One however the level of integration is deep compared to basic with the X32 and Studio One.  It can record multiple channels but that might be as far as it goes.  The CS18Ai also doubles as a serious control surface for Studio One and it also takes over remote control of all Mic Pre functions of the RM16/32 as well.  So they are all stored along with your song files etc..
 
In the studio the Behringer X32 still does not solve the studio needs for bal/unbal TS/TRS higher imp inputs etc.  Got the same issue with XLR low impedance balanced lines only.
 
For studios the upcoming new StudioLive mixer might be the go. I am assuming it will be well priced too. (the current 16.4.2Ai is $1600 so I am hoping the new mixers will be similar price)
 
I forgot to mention too that Presonus is talking about a rack mounted extender to the new StudioLive mixer. Another full 16 channels will be available with XLR/Line inputs etc as per the new mixers. So you could get the smaller footprint 16ch new StudioLive plus the extender for 32 inputs all up in your studio. All Mic Pres will be remote controlled. Then you don't need the CS18Ai. (unless you want the Studio One control surface concept. I don't think the new Studio Live mixers will go as far as the CS18Ai for Studio One control, not sure about this yet)
 
Studio One will be able access the DSP inside the new Studio Live mixers as well. (it can now with the CS18Ai and also the current StudioLive mixers)
 
I agree the live thing is served well but the studio concept needs to catch up though.  There will be some interesting options coming.

I bought an RM16ai and find the limitation of no TRS a problem for use in a studio. That however is just the beginning of features that will eventually be available with further firmware updates.

I had hoped that I could make use of the inbulit AVB networking capability. Little did I know that the real info about AVB on a PC is hidden (quite deliberately I think) from potential users. The fact is that AVB is not a viable option on a PC as there isn't really an affordable network AVB card for a PC. There are only a few and as difficult to find in the market as hens teeth. Audio over AVB is not yet activated either as far as I'm aware.

There are far to many options not yet available in either the UC software or the firmware to make the unit fully functional for studio use.

Fortunately I got your unit on sale so I shouldn't have any problems selling it.

I must temper my criticism with a balanced view that for live use it should be quite good.

Karyn, do you use the RM32 for Live recording as well as sound?

Karyn I have got a question. (A bit off topic so sorry!) Is the Samson power conditioner OK? I have heard in some areas where there is a lot of solar installs the power voltages can fluctuate. I am moving to an area where this may be an issue not sure of course.  Would the Samson protect against voltages going high for example (not so much spike protection, more overvoltage protection)
 
I am looking into the Furman stuff as well. Seems they have got it under control as well. But it is more expensive. I believe Phonic make a power conditioner too. Do we know anything about them?
 
Personally I feel the RM32 is not really suited for studio. I asked the rep at the demo here if they are thinking of making a studio version and he said mybe later but not now. As mentioned above what they are doing is creating a new version of the StudioLive mixers instead.
 
Don't you need AVB if you want to hook up a whole lot of Presonus stuff to a hub eg a CS18AI, a Studio Live mixer, computer etc.
 
I agree with Mike after looking into the switchers they are not cheap! Although at the demo they had a nice small one. I might find out what it was.

Jeff, I had a Phonic 16 channel board once (Was supposed to allow recording all 16 tracks individually over firewire as well as live sound).  The live sound part was OK.  It was all analogue.  The firewire had issues though so I sent it back and went with Mackie 1640 with firewire.  No issues there.  The Phonic was very cheaply made.  I guess that is why is didn't cost much.  The Mackie sounds better as well.
 
 
I can do a live show with this (analogue) mixer and capture 16 channels of audio on a PC with a single firewire.  Works great.  I just take a laptop with me (Dual Core with built in firewire).  Fire up Sonar, check all inputs and I am good to go.  I do an entire set capture (about 45 minutes to an hour) in 1 pass.  I split up the songs later.

Jeff, I gave the info about the board because if it is the same company, it may have quality issues...
 
Karyn, please keep us posted about how the Dante works out for you.
 

If Pat doesn't mind..  (it's all Presonus relevant)
 
 
It's often said the price difference between AVB and Dante is because of the extortionate licensing cost of Dante.  The reality is that Dante is provided on a chip by Audinate which manufactures build into their equipment.
The chip handles everything.  There are several versions of it, the difference being the number of channels it supports.
AVB is handled by the hardware directly, relying on the network interface with AVB ethernet extensions to work.
 
The only way to add Dante to the CS18 would be with an option card that includes a Dante chip, but the CS18 doesn't support option cards.
 
You are right Jeff, it would have been totally logical for the CS18 to have the same expansion slot that the SL and RM units have....  but since when has Presonus ever done anything logical?  Their individual products are great,  I have several, but there's someone high up in the product development chain that seems to be running around like a headless chicken.
 
Audinate has a whole series of videos about Dante (obviously) and digital audio networking in general which I recommend, especially the infocomm RU credit courses.  You don't have to register for the course, or apply for the credit,  but run through it and you'll learn a lot from it.

"If Pat doesn't mind..  (it's all Presonus relevant)"
Not at all - please keep it going, I am learning a lot and thanks!

I just found a pic that shows quite well how I deal with the lack of line inputs and also multiple headphones...  if you're interested.
 
Pic shows RM32,  Proel DI box (2 in that rack slot, so 4 channels), Headphone amp with custom cable.

Nope you need 2 D-88s if you want sample rate > 48K. (From the D88 manual page 5):
 
"ADAT – S/MUX Input and Output. These are the ADAT – Dual S/MUX connections to connect your DigiMax DP88 to your audio interface. When the sample rate is set to 44.1 or 48 kHz, only the ADAT 1 input and output will function. When set to 88.2 or 96 kHz, each connection will provide four of the available eight channels:"

Oh, so I would only need 1 192 and 1 D88.  Thanks for clarifying that!
Well at least that would save $499. So $1398.  Which is why I was looking at the RM16.  It is currently $1199 at Sweetwater!
 
 

I want both!  I used to do a lot of Live recording, now I am just tinkering with studio.  I may get back into Live again though.  It was fun.