The Maillard Reaction
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Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
No. This is because every video editor has scaleable playback... it's like a DAW's soft drop out feature on steroids. SONAR has a soft drop out feature... but it is a very light treatment. Video apps have so called scalable playback and the app can shift to a lower resolution display (it throws away or drops pixels on the fly) and it can drop lots of frames (variable framerate) while the transport remains smooth. Audio apps can't drop out very much data without the sound being effected greatly and that defeats the purpose of the DAW. Persistence of Vision allows a video edit person to view video playback comfortably even if pixels are being cast away or the frame rate is being altered on the fly. It works ok... so it works ok. So, what does all this mean? It means that video apps are actually pretty light on the computer compared to a multi track DAW. Video apps rarely combine more than a few streams as layers. The video playback requires huge data transfers and sometimes massive amounts of CPU but relatively little CPU juggling. A multi track DAW with 10 tracks and a couple dsp on each track is juggling stuff like crazy.... and we hear timing so precisely that any choke or cough is readily apparent. This is one reason that soft drops have limitation towards their helpfulness... they can't drop much before we hear the drop. This is why when a DAW does go over the cliff so to speak... it can end up at the white screen etc. DAWs run much closer to the edge than a properly run video editor. Now, I can operate a video editor in such a way that I can crash it every time. You can try to play back cpu intensive distribution video codecs and edit it and you will hate your video editor. You can crash a video editor easily... but you have to use it in an way that is possible but was never intended by the code writers. If you use a DAW normally and you use any dsp you think you may use you can easily come up with mix and match combinations of CPU and PDC juggling that brings your system to a halt with a great big drop out... or worse. This is one of the reasons so many people with systems that seem adequate find that their DAW doesn't work 99.99%. It may not be their system... it may their expectations. The way I have found comfort using my DAW is that I use dsp and routing that seems to work... and every time I stumble upon a new routing combo of my favorite dsp that doesn't work; I don't do that anymore. If you've gone through your system and feel it should be up to snuff then I suggest you carefully evaluate your choice of dsp and Vi and try to figure out what combo of routing may be stressing the playback beyond your sample buffers capability to smooth it over. The first thing to do is to ascertain which of your plugs and instruments push the PDC beyond the buffer limitation and then take a look at where those plugs and instruments are sitting in the routing matrix. Do you have a PDC user routed to another PDC user? DO you have some PDC users running in parallel? Imagine a car engine running without a timing chain? If you can. IF you can do that... imagine a car engine running with multiple timing chains. Does it seem complicated? It is. The best I can do is recognize the symptoms of soft dropouts and re evaluate my routing before the crash... which I do... and that keeps me at 99.99% happiness. Maybe that can work for other people to? Food for thought? best regards, mike
post edited by mike_mccue - 2013/02/13 07:23:00
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Jonbouy
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 08:29:36
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I tend to use Audio apps as a good barometer of whether my computer works as a DAW. I do a lot of testing and some wild DSP routings both and both audio and a ton of midi both inside and outside of the box. I don't crash ever. And I mean ever, this chart goes way back a year before what I've managed to show here.  I gathered awhile back from some of the guys in the hardware forum that optimising for audio and optimising for video are two distinctly different things. I listened, I learned and learned to test what worked and what didn't, I haven't messed with the setup for a long time. I stay updated with Windows updates, and drivers, and it's connected to the internet most of the time. I also run a tight security and maintainence policy. Not only is it stable but it maximises the performance of my interface as far as latency vs CPU goes. I was due for a mid-life hardware update about now, I'm not going to bother. I still have a large resource overhead on most things I do and it ain't broke. I agree, resource management and expectation are a big contribution to successful operations.
post edited by Jonbouy - 2013/02/13 08:33:56
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"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles. In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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Bub 
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 09:46:40
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I don't crash ever. And I mean ever ...
Careful now, you see what just happened to 57Gregy. Better knock on some wood. Throw some salt over your left shoulder with your right hand. Or is it your right shoulder with your left hand? Better skip that one, I'm not sure. Wouldn't want to make a bad situation worse! Just do something for the love of God, don't just sit there after making a comment like that! 
"I pulled the head off Elvis, filled Fred up to his pelvis, yaba daba do, the King is gone, and so are you."
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craigb
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 10:25:46
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Mine crashes all the time, but all I need to do is shake it over my head for a quick reboot... 
Time for all of you to head over to Beyond My DAW!
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spacey
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 10:59:18
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Craig I'm looking at making the same exchange. I did shake my computer
but nothing changed so.....
And I know it's a crap computer because of the stuff I saw it do to X2.
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FastBikerBoy
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 11:09:19
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I agree with Mike for once. I rarely get Sonar crashing or dropping out but Camtasia is a nightmare in comparison although to be fair the latest version has improved things considerably.
While I was making the X2 video I was using Camtasia 8.0.1 and I was lucky if I could run it for much longer than 30 minutes without a crash - (that's the editor not the capture software which was fine). There seemed to be a fairly major bug with markers but the latest version 8.0.3 is much better if still a little sensitive.
I've never bothered to try and 'optimise' for video simply because it's so stable as a DAW I don't want to rock the boat.
If it ain't broke..... etc...etc
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Jonbouy
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 11:50:00
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Bub
I don't crash ever. And I mean ever ...
Careful now, you see what just happened to 57Gregy. Better knock on some wood. Throw some salt over your left shoulder with your right hand. Or is it your right shoulder with your left hand? Better skip that one, I'm not sure. Wouldn't want to make a bad situation worse! Just do something for the love of God, don't just sit there after making a comment like that!
I said crash. There's still nothing to stop it spontaneously combusting at some point... That graph even shows the period I checked out the X2 demo too. Spooky.
"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles. In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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bapu
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 12:17:18
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Is video a yewpheemism for pron? 
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craigb
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 12:34:00
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bapu
Is video a yewpheemism for pron?
Is that what you use to find pron?
Time for all of you to head over to Beyond My DAW!
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Bub
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 12:35:23
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bapu
Is video a yewpheemism for pron?
This guy thinks so ... 
"I pulled the head off Elvis, filled Fred up to his pelvis, yaba daba do, the King is gone, and so are you."
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bapu
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 12:37:11
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It only took 8 posts to take this to the gutter.
A new world's record?
Mebee Daveny5 is right?
(cracked software is the way to go)
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craigb
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 12:40:20
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I like to start in the gutter that way there's no where to go but up!
Time for all of you to head over to Beyond My DAW!
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bapu
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 12:43:01
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Bub
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 12:47:05
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bapu
It only took 8 posts to take this to the gutter.
A new world's record?
Mebee Daveny5 is right?
I could have done it in 3. Just sayin' ...
"I pulled the head off Elvis, filled Fred up to his pelvis, yaba daba do, the King is gone, and so are you."
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Jonbouy
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 12:59:58
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bapu
It only took 8 posts to take this to the gutter.
A new world's record?
Mebee Daveny5 is right?
(cracked software is the way to go)
What's the matter with you guys, even I managed to parcipitate properly. For one post anyway.
"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles. In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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Bub
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 13:01:23
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Jonbouy
bapu
It only took 8 posts to take this to the gutter.
A new world's record?
Mebee Daveny5 is right?
(cracked software is the way to go)
What's the matter with you guys, even I managed to parcipitate properly.
For one post anyway.
Sorry, I thought you made it up and was screwin' with him. LOL!
"I pulled the head off Elvis, filled Fred up to his pelvis, yaba daba do, the King is gone, and so are you."
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Jonbouy
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 13:06:27
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Bub
Jonbouy
bapu
It only took 8 posts to take this to the gutter.
A new world's record?
Mebee Daveny5 is right?
(cracked software is the way to go)
What's the matter with you guys, even I managed to parcipitate properly.
For one post anyway.
Sorry, I thought you made it up and was screwin' with him.
LOL!
Bapu has poopy pants for sure doesn't he? I didn't even notice that... It's like treading in something stinky Bapu left on the floor then going around to shake everyones hand in blissful ignorance. I shall send him the curse that will make him stick his big toe through the bedsheet tonight for that. Then he'll be sorry.
"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles. In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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Danny Danzi
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 13:26:03
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FastBikerBoy
I rarely get Sonar crashing or dropping out but Camtasia is a nightmare in comparison although to be fair the latest version has improved things considerably.
While I was making the X2 video I was using Camtasia 8.0.1 and I was lucky if I could run it for much longer than 30 minutes without a crash - (that's the editor not the capture software which was fine). There seemed to be a fairly major bug with markers but the latest version 8.0.3 is much better if still a little sensitive.
I've never bothered to try and 'optimise' for video simply because it's so stable as a DAW I don't want to rock the boat.
If it ain't broke..... etc...etc
Man Karl, total opposite for me. I beat my pc's to death with video's and they NEVER crash thank God. Camtasia 8 was weird...it messed up on me a few times so I went back to 7 and that's where I am still. Just got done using it for about 12 hours without a single crash or snert. Same with Vegas...I beat the living heck out of it and my pc's all the time and honest when I tell you (touches wood) never a crash. My temps ramp up to about 60 C during a render, but that's about the only thing happening over here. I'm fine with Sonar too as long as I stay away from x64. I'm starting to believe (from more testing) it's 3rd party plugs and VSTi's. As long as I stay "straight Sonar" it's been rock solid. As soon as I start messing around with other stuff, that's when I seem to have issues. I've tried my best to use nothing but x64 plugs too...so whatever it is, so far I can't narrow it down other than to stick with 32 bit....it just works for me. -Danny
My Site Fractal Audio Endorsed Artist & Beta Tester
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The Maillard Reaction
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 13:32:38
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Its more like:
how SONAR handles plug ins (including it's own) and VSTis.
Those plugins and VSTis often work real well in certain combinations and they also work well in other DAWs.
It is how SONAR handles the stuff and the wild number of combinations that makes it all seem so spontaneous and random.
The only practical solution is figure out what you think is doing it and stop doing it.
I'm so used to it all working well that if I introduce something new and it's makes something flaky I notice it right away and I make the problem go away... like when the ProChannel was switching on and off by itself.
I sent that head ache to the penalty box. Game over.
:-)
all the best,
mike
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Bub
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 13:42:29
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mike_mccue
Its more like:
how SONAR handles plug ins (including it's own) and VSTis.
Those plugins and VSTis often work real well in certain combinations and they also work well in other DAWs.
I can confirm that as well. And give examples. The PX-64 Percussion Strip. If you don't have the input signal hot enough going in to it ... it just flat out does not work. You can twist knobs till the cows come home and nothing happens. Jam up the input slider and it will kick on. Throw it in one of the other DAW's I use ... never have to touch it. There's many other examples I can give too, but I don't want to come off as I'm bashing Sonar. I think it's just the fact that so many different vendors have had their finger in the Cake batter bowl that things aren't as 'streamlined' as they should be. It is how SONAR handles the stuff and the wild number of combinations that makes it all seem so spontaneous and random.
The only practical solution is figure out what you think is doing it and stop doing it.
I'm so used to it all working well that if I introduce something new and it's makes something flaky I notice it right away and I make the problem go away... like when the ProChannel was switching on and off by itself.
That problem plagued me like, well, the plague. Doh! :) But I have to admit, it seems to be fixed with X2. Now, I have had individual modules go dead, but it's very rare, and fixed by removing the module and reinserting it in to the Pro Channel. I sent that head ache to the penalty box. Game over.
:-)
all the best,
mike
"I pulled the head off Elvis, filled Fred up to his pelvis, yaba daba do, the King is gone, and so are you."
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Jonbouy
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 13:46:41
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mike_mccue
Its more like:
how SONAR handles plug ins (including it's own) and VSTis.
Those plugins and VSTis often work real well in certain combinations and they also work well in other DAWs.
It is how SONAR handles the stuff and the wild number of combinations that makes it all seem so spontaneous and random.
The only practical solution is figure out what you think is doing it and stop doing it.
I'm so used to it all working well that if I introduce something new and it's makes something flaky I notice it right away and I make the problem go away... like when the ProChannel was switching on and off by itself.
I sent that head ache to the penalty box. Game over.
:-)
all the best,
mike
The key to doing successful testing is to run 180 degrees in the opposite direction to that.
"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles. In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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The Maillard Reaction
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 13:48:57
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I'm not a tester... I am an end user.
Testers are appreciated by someone such as myself.
Thanks.
best regards,
mike
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Jonbouy
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 13:56:36
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Danny Danzi
FastBikerBoy
I rarely get Sonar crashing or dropping out but Camtasia is a nightmare in comparison although to be fair the latest version has improved things considerably.
While I was making the X2 video I was using Camtasia 8.0.1 and I was lucky if I could run it for much longer than 30 minutes without a crash - (that's the editor not the capture software which was fine). There seemed to be a fairly major bug with markers but the latest version 8.0.3 is much better if still a little sensitive.
I've never bothered to try and 'optimise' for video simply because it's so stable as a DAW I don't want to rock the boat.
If it ain't broke..... etc...etc
Man Karl, total opposite for me. I beat my pc's to death with video's and they NEVER crash thank God. Camtasia 8 was weird...it messed up on me a few times so I went back to 7 and that's where I am still. Just got done using it for about 12 hours without a single crash or snert. Same with Vegas...I beat the living heck out of it and my pc's all the time and honest when I tell you (touches wood) never a crash. My temps ramp up to about 60 C during a render, but that's about the only thing happening over here.
I'm fine with Sonar too as long as I stay away from x64. I'm starting to believe (from more testing) it's 3rd party plugs and VSTi's. As long as I stay "straight Sonar" it's been rock solid. As soon as I start messing around with other stuff, that's when I seem to have issues. I've tried my best to use nothing but x64 plugs too...so whatever it is, so far I can't narrow it down other than to stick with 32 bit....it just works for me.
-Danny
I sometimes wonder what would happen with my machine if I did attempt editing video on it. I'd like to think it would cope to some degree, but it's not something I fancy taking on. I end up with more stuff than I can complete just with the audio stuff, I think for me personally I'd get someone who deals with it daily to put together anything I needed to get done. I don't know how guys like you do it, getting so much stuff out at the high quality that seems to come out. I suppose it must be that ol' necessity thing being the mother of invention over a period of time because if I think about what's involved in getting movie studio up and running on top of an audio one I think I'd just better go and lie down and rest now... 
"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles. In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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Jonbouy
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 13:58:26
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mike_mccue
I'm not a tester... I am an end user.
Testers are appreciated by someone such as myself.
Thanks.
best regards,
mike
Exactly, you WOULD be appreciating it if had been done enough.
"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles. In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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The Maillard Reaction
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 14:04:36
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I meant "thanks" for the good work you are doing on the various beta teams you are on.
Even if your contributions don't effect me first hand the pay it forward effort helps us all.
best,
mike
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Bub
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/13 14:29:11
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mike_mccue
I meant "thanks" for the good work you are doing on the various beta teams you are on.
Even if your contributions don't effect me first hand the pay it forward effort helps us all.
best,
mike
Huh, I didn't get that out of it. I need to pay attention better.
"I pulled the head off Elvis, filled Fred up to his pelvis, yaba daba do, the King is gone, and so are you."
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Danny Danzi
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/14 05:26:35
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Jonbouy
Danny Danzi
FastBikerBoy
I rarely get Sonar crashing or dropping out but Camtasia is a nightmare in comparison although to be fair the latest version has improved things considerably.
While I was making the X2 video I was using Camtasia 8.0.1 and I was lucky if I could run it for much longer than 30 minutes without a crash - (that's the editor not the capture software which was fine). There seemed to be a fairly major bug with markers but the latest version 8.0.3 is much better if still a little sensitive.
I've never bothered to try and 'optimise' for video simply because it's so stable as a DAW I don't want to rock the boat.
If it ain't broke..... etc...etc
Man Karl, total opposite for me. I beat my pc's to death with video's and they NEVER crash thank God. Camtasia 8 was weird...it messed up on me a few times so I went back to 7 and that's where I am still. Just got done using it for about 12 hours without a single crash or snert. Same with Vegas...I beat the living heck out of it and my pc's all the time and honest when I tell you (touches wood) never a crash. My temps ramp up to about 60 C during a render, but that's about the only thing happening over here.
I'm fine with Sonar too as long as I stay away from x64. I'm starting to believe (from more testing) it's 3rd party plugs and VSTi's. As long as I stay "straight Sonar" it's been rock solid. As soon as I start messing around with other stuff, that's when I seem to have issues. I've tried my best to use nothing but x64 plugs too...so whatever it is, so far I can't narrow it down other than to stick with 32 bit....it just works for me.
-Danny
I sometimes wonder what would happen with my machine if I did attempt editing video on it. I'd like to think it would cope to some degree, but it's not something I fancy taking on.
I end up with more stuff than I can complete just with the audio stuff, I think for me personally I'd get someone who deals with it daily to put together anything I needed to get done.
I don't know how guys like you do it, getting so much stuff out at the high quality that seems to come out. I suppose it must be that ol' necessity thing being the mother of invention over a period of time because if I think about what's involved in getting movie studio up and running on top of an audio one I think I'd just better go and lie down and rest now...
You know what my biggest problem is Jon? The learning curve. It's like...there are so many things coming at us from all different directions with this software stuff, it really does your head in. I think I've been really lucky with the video thing though...as well as the audio part. Even my crap machines seem to work well. Most of my problems went away with pc's the day I went to www.blackviper.com believe it or not. I've bee using his tweaks for a long time now and have everything pretty etched in my brain on what to try if I have a problem. Quite a few DAW builders borrow from there too...so it can't be total bs. LOL! But a fairly experienced user knows what to touch and what not to...especially when the guy gives you in depth instructions about what each service means. But yeah, the video thing is definitely tough on a machine as well as the person working with it. Especially when you sort of learn as you go along with everything like I do. You sort of get forced into that in a sense and sometimes it's not fun, other times...it's a blast of a time. I try to never walk away from anything over here. Had a rapper call me about a year ago. First thing out of his mouth was "do y'all do DDP?" I'm like "excuse me"? He says "you know, DDP mastering? If y'all can't do it, I can't work wiff you." So I figure he's just not too up on the technology or something because a year ago, I had never heard of this. I say "oh yeah, no problem...we do everything here". He books a date, we hang up...and I start looking up DDP. LOL!!!!! I start reading all this stuff about it and how you need a special hook-up with it while using Wave Lab...and it's pricey as heck, and this other place had a deal on something but you need to do this and this...and man, I'm ready to call the dude back and tell him I misunderstood him and don't have that capability, then a lightbulb went off.... I soo remember seeing some DDP button in Studio One 2....let me open that. Sure enough, DDP with the click of a button. I had no clue what it was or what it was used for. Talk about luck?! LOL! Anyway, sorry to get off the path there. If you don't need to do any video stuff brother, don't even go there. Though I know these newer cpu's run a little hot under a load, keeping them at 60 C with spikes up to 65 C for a few hours or more during rendering is definitely beating them up. My main video machine has two of these http://www.imarketcity.com/la2026inmipe.html on it at all times when rendering those huge projects. I leave the CD bay open and shoot air in through there, and shoot another one at the other side to push some air through and to the back. This one (even in a 70 to 75 degree F room) runs temps of 57 C to 60 C when I use those fans during rendering. Without them, it will spike to 65 and on one occassion...I saw a 69 C. So the fans have definitely helped a bit...but you know that sort of heat continuously is going to break some stuff down after a few years. So if you don't need to do video, stay away from it brother. :) -Danny
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Danny Danzi
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/14 05:50:55
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mike_mccue
Its more like:
how SONAR handles plug ins (including it's own) and VSTis.
Those plugins and VSTis often work real well in certain combinations and they also work well in other DAWs.
It is how SONAR handles the stuff and the wild number of combinations that makes it all seem so spontaneous and random.
The only practical solution is figure out what you think is doing it and stop doing it.
I'm so used to it all working well that if I introduce something new and it's makes something flaky I notice it right away and I make the problem go away... like when the ProChannel was switching on and off by itself.
I sent that head ache to the penalty box. Game over.
:-)
all the best,
mike
Scratches head....I....I....wow....I totally agree with this! :) I definitely think there is a lot of truth in this at least in my case. When you run some other plugs in other programs, they definitely behave differently. Waves especially with the knob/fader movements. Even some of the big stuff I use...it's amazing how it just reacts differently when in Sonar. For the longest time I had a few plugs that just wouldn't work in Sonar yet worked in everything else. This is definitely an issue from time to time for people that I'd love to see sorted out. Question for you guys.... Have you ever felt that while using Sonar, you feel the need to tread softly and have to make sure you've done this that and this before you execute something? Like you're sort of walking on eggshells hoping you won't crash it and being extra careful? That's sort of how I feel. I just about always stop playback before doing something and try not to multi-task anything while using Sonar. Sort of like....remember Win 95 or 98? When you first boot up, you normally didn't touch a thing until you knew it was done loading up and you stopped seeing hourglasses? In Xp and beyond, you could just do whatever you wanted....so what if you're hourglassing or seeing a little spinning circle...do whatever you want, you'll be ok. That's how things work for me in other DAW software. I can punch the lion in the mouth and it just laughs at me while audio is playing. Bring in huge sample libraries without audio cutting out or dropping out or pausing. It's like every time I try to do something like this in Sonar, when it pauses, it gives me a "not responding" message in the top left title bar. Some times it crashes but most times it doesn't crash, it just scares the heck out of me when it does that because it pauses first, then you see that "not responding"...than you're waiting for that white faded screen....which for some odd reason...I don't get in any other program. Do you guys? Is that a Win 7 default crash screen by chance? I don't ever see that anywhere else other than when Sonar crashes. Everything else (not just audio programs) gives me an illegal op message or something...but that white faded screen....I don't see that ever in anything else. I'm with you Bub...honestly I'm not trying to bash on Sonar either...but it was way easier for me to have a fan boy side with Sonar when I hadn't used anything else. See man, some people don't get it. They think "just trying something" is the same as "using something" for a longer period of time to where you literally learn it like you know Sonar. I'm not that far with the alternatives I use, but when you spend some time with them you definitely get those "oh wow" moments and some of them are pretty darn impressive. Features and looks, Sonar to me always edges out the competition. But there are things all the competition sort of has in common with themselves that are necessities....and these things in my opinion, are what Sonar needs to borrow from. Stuff like gapless audio, pitch control on the fly are common in just about every program....and to me are extremely important. I mean there's more...we can list several, but those things are standard really and to me make a difference when using other programs. Especially the engine stop thing. If I had to say my worst pet peeve in Sonar, that would be it. And it's something I never have a problem with in any other program I use. But then you'll get 100 guys come on here and say "the audio engine never shuts down on me Danny, it's your system." Which I won't argue with....but "my system" doesn't experience this with programs that don't have an engine on/off nor do I get drop outs while recording at low latency....so in a sense, we'd be both right. :)
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FastBikerBoy
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/14 06:13:20
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Danny Danzi
FastBikerBoy
I rarely get Sonar crashing or dropping out but Camtasia is a nightmare in comparison although to be fair the latest version has improved things considerably.
While I was making the X2 video I was using Camtasia 8.0.1 and I was lucky if I could run it for much longer than 30 minutes without a crash - (that's the editor not the capture software which was fine). There seemed to be a fairly major bug with markers but the latest version 8.0.3 is much better if still a little sensitive.
I've never bothered to try and 'optimise' for video simply because it's so stable as a DAW I don't want to rock the boat.
If it ain't broke..... etc...etc
Man Karl, total opposite for me. I beat my pc's to death with video's and they NEVER crash thank God. Camtasia 8 was weird...it messed up on me a few times so I went back to 7 and that's where I am still. Just got done using it for about 12 hours without a single crash or snert. Same with Vegas...I beat the living heck out of it and my pc's all the time and honest when I tell you (touches wood) never a crash. My temps ramp up to about 60 C during a render, but that's about the only thing happening over here.
I'm fine with Sonar too as long as I stay away from x64. I'm starting to believe (from more testing) it's 3rd party plugs and VSTi's. As long as I stay "straight Sonar" it's been rock solid. As soon as I start messing around with other stuff, that's when I seem to have issues. I've tried my best to use nothing but x64 plugs too...so whatever it is, so far I can't narrow it down other than to stick with 32 bit....it just works for me.
-Danny
HI Danny - I was late to the party with CAmtasia so I trialled V7 which I didn't have any problems with but by the time I got round to buying it V8 was out so that's what I ended up with. I haven't tried but I assume I'm not entitled to download V7. I rather gather from their forum that for some users V7--->V8 was their 8.5--->X1. AS I'd only used the trial for a month I really didn't know much difference workflow wise so that side of it never affected me but the initial V8 was certainly far more unstable than V7 which for the month's trial never crashed once. V8 on the other hand was a nightmare. The first update settled it down somewhat and the latest is even more stable with some workflow enhancements. It is still nowehere near as stable as X2 for me though. I'm 64 bit all the way with Sonar and have been since V7, I switched about halfway through that cycle when I made the mistake of installing XPx64.  A nightmare I'd rather not think about. 
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Mooch4056
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Re:Are video edit apps a good barometer of a CPU's ability to be a DAW?
2013/02/14 06:45:48
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Oh so now you're all video experts???? Get some video going along with a wah wah pedal in sonar and send it to some smut company and bingo .... Your making an extra 75k a year playing and editing background music for smut triple or quadruple X? I see where this is all going. Meanwhile Mooch is still getting paid minimum wage recording the neighborhood 15 year olds band who call themselves "dynomite glue" cuz they are gonna be rock starts some day. And then the neighbor hood kid can't even afford to pay me minimum wage so I end up working for free. This is all a plot by Bapu to screw me over. I see how is. You're all here just to screw mooch. You were never gonna tell me about your plans to make a pile of money doing background smut cake music. Thanks a lot guys. That's ahhhhh LOT!!! Sincerly, Epstiens Mother ;) J/k
post edited by Mooch4056 - 2013/02/14 11:27:26
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