Backup Method

Hey,

I'm in the process (which is long overdue) of backing up a bunch of my Sonar project folders to DVD. I'm wondering if anyone has any particular method or system of doing this that works well.

Specifically, I'm wondering about:

Storage... Where and how do you store your DVD's?

Labeling... Do you have a great system for labeling and keeping track of your DVD backups?

Any other tips or suggestions?

I know this may all seem trivial. But when the time comes that you want to locate and resurrect an old project, a good storage system/method is essential.

I look forward to your comments!

Yes, I'm backing up to DVD because it's possible that I may never ever need to work on these projects again. But, still want to hnag on to them (just in case).

I'v already come to realize that I cannot fit all of the information I need to on the DVD's themselves using a Sharpie. So... I've decided to just number the DVD's and then create a corresponding Excel spreadsheet that includes the project names, dates and notes.

the regular ones contain chemicals that will eventually harm the DVD

Huh. I did not know that.

After burning, do you guys try to open each of the backed-up project files from DVD before deleting the original source files from the hard drive? Seems like a good (and wise) practice.

ORIGINAL: Dave King

I'v already come to realize that I cannot fit all of the information I need to on the DVD's themselves using a Sharpie. So... I've decided to just number the DVD's and then create a corresponding Excel spreadsheet that includes the project names, dates and notes.

That's exactly what I do, (and then burn the updated spreadsheet to each DVD) - works a treat.

And while you are burning, do them all twice!

Twice??? I'm wondering if any other folks do this as well?

I would think that a CD might be safer than an external hard drive (or internal, for that matter) because, as unlikely as it might be, they can crash. But: do you guys save bundle files in case you want to continue working on a project later?
Mark

I've had good experience with bundle files in the past, but I'm under the impression that backing up using project folders is the better option. Maybe this is because large data storage options are much more prevalent and affordable now.

Serauk,

Thanks for the post. There's lots of good suggestions there to consider.

Thanks, again!

I'm not sure about the original poster, but I think some people are thinking about a backup, where the original continues to live in its normal place, versus an archive, where the original is deleted after the archive copy is made. (I'm not sure that I'm using "archive" correctly but I wanted a term to differentiate the two scenarios.)

For me, a backup onto a separate hard disk (NOT a partition on the same disk) is fine since I need a double-point failure to lose both copies. For an archive I want to have two copies on CD and/or DVD.

Since I have enough on-line storage (two internal hard disks and one external USB connected disk) I have never deleted a project to make room. I've only made backups.

--Larry

Personally, I would not go for the DVD/CD solution. For these reasons;
1- burning is time consuming and not failsafe imo
2- on larger projects you may have to split them to several different discs (NFG)
3- After burning originals you may accidentally scratch one of the discs rendering some info useless

These are just some reasons. I have an external enclosure that I can swap hard drives in and out of for these reasons. I know all my projects are intact and are readily available if I feel the need to re-open them, and without loading all the info back to my hard drive. For the price of 250 or even a 500gig drive, I feel this is most sensible. But what do I know

Craig

ORIGINAL: larrymcg

Here's something I learned from experience and has kept me away from backups on CDs ever since.
I used Retrospect and a CD burner for years doing incremental backups (and an occasional full backup) of my hard disks. My CD writer started to act up so I got a new DVD burner. Low and behold the DVD burner could not add files to the existing set of CDs and, even worse, it could not RETRIEVE any files from any of the CDs. I got confirmation on the Retrospect help forums that this is generally the case. The backup disks can only be read and written by the original hardware writer.

I suppose I could have started a new full backup using the new DVD writer but I decided to get an external hard disk instead.

Note that I have data (and music) CDs written long ago by Roxio Easy CD Creator that are readable by WinXP using the new DVD burner. It's just the ones written by Retrospect that give me trouble. So when doing backups or archives of certain files and folders, it may be best to NOT use a backup program that writes a compressed and proprietary version of the data. Use something that makes a disk readable by Windows (or Mac OS).

--Larry

Hello,

That's a horror story indeed. Retrospect is the worst piece of cr*p to ever call itself a backup/archive tool. In early 2000 I had to stand by and wait 48 hours for Retrospect (Mac OS9.X) to build a catalog from the DLT-3 DAT tapes before it could restore my company's server from a fatal crash. The actual restore took another 24 hours. Retrospect tech support admited that it was a mistake that their software did not create catalog and then store it on the last DAT tape. So I say "lights out" on Retrospect.

With that said (Hi Dave), here's a few do's and don'ts.

Don't use CD-RW or DVD-RW.

Don't leave the disks "open" (not finalized).

Buy a DVD burner (around $40 to $50 for an internal drive) that comes bundled with Nero Express.

Do use CD-Rs or DVD+/-R disks

Do finalize (close) the disk. (Open disks that allow more data to be added later also called "multi-session" can be problematic in the long term.

Do use Excel to keep a record. My disk number scheme is simple: DDMMYY##. Example today the first disk would be 07220701, the second disk would be 07220702, etc. A plain ordinal number system will also work just as well.

Do store disks in paper sleeves in a disk box or buy a nice disk album. I have one that is the size of a fat looseleaf binder that holds almost 300 disks without sleeves or boxes in the width of 5 or 6 standard CD cases. I store disks both ways.

I don't know about the Sharpie thing. I've use sharpies to write on disks for years but why tempt fate. Get MediaFace (Fellows/Neato) software - the best tool for the job, and label each disk. The software comes with some labels and you can buy nice glossy labels from "compulabel." The label protects the delicate "top" of the disk (the reflector side). If the reflector side is scratched the disk will never play again. Scratches on the clear side do not create the same severe damage.

Do burn a disk with the finished work final or rough mix and MP3 and then burn another with the source code (the Sonar files and audio). I only use per-project folders (as every other DAW software except Cakewalk has done from day one). I do not use bundles because the files are no longer in native format. At the very least with per project folders you can import the audio files into something and at least listen to them to see what you were doing. A bundle file needs Sonar or it can't be opened.

For video projects I make two DVDs: an actual finished authored DVD that can be viewed on a regular DVD player (that connects to the TV) and a "source code" DVD data disk that contains the MPEG files, DVD Architect source code and Neato CD label source code. Once the project is complete and the customer/end user has signed off, then I delete the underlying raw DV source files (18GB/hour) unless it is specified that the source code is to be retained. Then I put a copy of the whole project on a hard drive and the customer has to pay for the hard drive (that would make two DVDs and a hard drive for the complete archive).

Do check the disks on a different CD/DVD drive then the one you use to burn. I've never had a failure to read a disk I've burned. I regularly use 6 year old CDs that I burned. Will these last for 100 years? Won't affect me. :-) For my personal/family videos on DVD, I certainly hope that my offspring will be able to view them long after I'm gone. But I certainly will not be able to report back on that. I can see disks I've burned lasting 20 years. I have burned disks that are 10 years old. If they are fine after 10 years, they can last 20 and they'll most likely last twice that.

The nervous part is deleting the project from your hard drive. Many video projects have files too large to fit in the trash so when you "pull the trigger" those files are really gone. I have about 200 archive CD/DVDs. I've had to go back a couple only once or twice. So they have been valuable.

GK

Twice??? I'm wondering if any other folks do this as well?

You could consider keeping 2 copies, one in a different location, in case of fire.

There's a few good websites on DVD archiving do's and don'ts.

The rundown is that most damage actually comes from dirty hands (acidic grime) when handling the discs, and storage in the wrong places. Store DVD's upright in a separate case, not in paper or plastic cheapo folders, and store them DRY AND DARK, in a cooler than room temperature spot. Also do get a good brand DVD for archiving, the ultracheap nonames may have production errors so layers can come apart way faster than using quality DVD's.

And indeed, close the sessions.

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