Doktor Avalanche
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Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
Yep another Linux thread. For those who don't know what wine is, it is a way of getting windows apps running on Linux. I notice Reaper 5 has taken these steps, and it runs. Sonar is now Windows 10 certified, perhaps they could use similar efforts to do this on Wine? (although I know of no certification process here). Just at least get it running on 64 bit for starters. I almost got it running but Microsoft foundation classes got in the way. I hear people have managed it on X3. It would also make a nice blog article. Call it a challenge if you like.. Thanks..
post edited by Doktor Avalanche - 2015/08/17 13:06:15
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pwalpwal
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/17 13:11:38
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Doktor AvalancheSonar is now Windows 10 certified
"certified" or "compatible"?
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Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/17 13:37:16
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☄ Helpfulby Doktor Avalanche 2015/08/17 17:36:40
SONAR would likely have to be modified to work on Wine. We take advantage of several more modern Windows API's and Wine lags behind several versions of Windows. I used to be a Wine developer a long time ago - check the authors and you will find my name :) I wrote a ton of code for the Windows clipboard handling in Wine that is still in use.
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Anderton
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/17 13:51:34
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☄ Helpfulby Andrew Rossa [Cakewalk] 2015/08/17 23:40:45
I run SONAR on wine sometimes. Usually it's a cabernet, but sometimes I'll go for a shiraz. Oh wait...not that kind of wine. Never mind.
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BobF
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/17 14:18:38
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☄ Helpfulby Andrew Rossa [Cakewalk] 2015/08/17 23:40:53
Anderton I run SONAR on wine sometimes. Usually it's a cabernet, but sometimes I'll go for a shiraz. Oh wait...not that kind of wine. Never mind.
Ditto ... Shiraz, Zin, Cab ... or even a blend!!
Bob -- Angels are crying because truth has died ...Illegitimi non carborundum --Studio One Pro / i7-6700@3.80GHZ, 32GB Win 10 Pro x64 Roland FA06, LX61+, Fishman Tripleplay, FaderPort, US-16x08 + ARC2.5/Event PS8s Waves Gold/IKM Max/Nomad Factory IS3/K11U
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mudgel
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/17 14:44:45
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Please don't whine about Sonar not working on Linux.
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/17 15:03:25
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A nice Pino Grigio works well
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BobF
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/17 15:12:49
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Bristol_Jonesey A nice Pino Grigio works well
my favorite with shrimp scampi
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John
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/17 15:24:58
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For a moment I thought I was in the Coffee House!
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BobF
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/17 15:29:35
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Bob -- Angels are crying because truth has died ...Illegitimi non carborundum --Studio One Pro / i7-6700@3.80GHZ, 32GB Win 10 Pro x64 Roland FA06, LX61+, Fishman Tripleplay, FaderPort, US-16x08 + ARC2.5/Event PS8s Waves Gold/IKM Max/Nomad Factory IS3/K11U
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jb101
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/17 16:10:53
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The only major problems I have had with Sonar can all be traced back to running it on wine..
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Anderton
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/17 16:26:35
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John For a moment I thought I was in the Coffee House!
Well, it wouldn't be appropriate unless we change its name to the Winery.
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mettelus
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/17 16:27:36
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I can run SONAR and whine just fine now.
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BobF
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/17 16:55:02
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Anderton
John For a moment I thought I was in the Coffee House!
Well, it wouldn't be appropriate unless we change its name to the Winery.
How 'bout a new forum called "The Tasting Room"?
Bob -- Angels are crying because truth has died ...Illegitimi non carborundum --Studio One Pro / i7-6700@3.80GHZ, 32GB Win 10 Pro x64 Roland FA06, LX61+, Fishman Tripleplay, FaderPort, US-16x08 + ARC2.5/Event PS8s Waves Gold/IKM Max/Nomad Factory IS3/K11U
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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/17 17:30:03
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You are clearly all pissed  . Thanks Noel...
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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/17 17:30:52
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Doktor AvalancheSonar is now Windows 10 certified
pwalpwal "certified" or "compatible"?
Certified.
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RSMCGUITAR
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/18 01:30:47
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Works with beer. Doesn't work with whiskey. Gin my bottom half gets aired out.
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joyof60
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/18 01:58:32
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I've found a good work around for running Sonar with Whisky, Just run it with a good single malt or a sour mash from Tennessee. Good rule of thumb with Whisky, "if it don't come from Tennessee, don't spell it with an E!" IMHO, Running Sonar on wine is next to impossible, all mine are Bordeaux's, generally intended for lying down, makes ya way to sleepy to enjoy the production process....Just sayin.....
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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/18 09:12:29
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Hang on. If you don't upgrade to gin cakewalk may no longer be able to support you when you fall down. Those who want to stay on whisky go ahead, but one of these days you may end up having a nasty accident, and you will be forced to stay where you are on whisky. Nobody will support you.
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bitSync
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/18 17:14:54
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Doktor Avalanche Hang on. If you don't upgrade to gin cakewalk may no longer be able to support you when you fall down. Those who want to stay on whisky go ahead, but one of these days you may end up having a nasty accident, and you will be forced to stay where you are on whisky. Nobody will support you.
Seems like some kind of a subliminal cross post. But I never said I was staying on whisky permanently, just for now, until I'm ready for gin...
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BobF
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/18 17:20:09
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☄ Helpfulby Doktor Avalanche 2015/08/18 22:11:06
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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/18 22:03:25
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There's only one problem on gin... When I'm on the gin I feel that everybody is looking at me and my head is in the cloud... I don't feel very secure. I better get on the cool aid...
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Sycraft
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/19 05:58:21
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Even if it did work, I dunno that you'd be happy with it as a practical matter since the additional layers would add latency and make high speed audio more difficult. Going from ASIO to JACK to FFADO is not going to give the same results as going right to the soundcard. Plus I don't think your Saffire has any Linux drivers. Then of course there's all the plugins, which may not work or may have odd issues. It would just be setting yourself up for a massive headache. Pro audio is the kind of thing you want to run native, not in any kind of translation environment or virtualization.
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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/19 10:18:09
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Sycraft Even if it did work, I dunno that you'd be happy with it as a practical matter since the additional layers would add latency and make high speed audio more difficult. Going from ASIO to JACK to FFADO is not going to give the same results as going right to the soundcard. Plus I don't think your Saffire has any Linux drivers. Then of course there's all the plugins, which may not work or may have odd issues. It would just be setting yourself up for a massive headache. Pro audio is the kind of thing you want to run native, not in any kind of translation environment or virtualization.
OK thrown away the gin bottle for the moment... I am running other DAW's on Linux such as Ardour with Jack using a Saffire Pro 40. The drivers and the latency is much better than Windows, and I suspect better than Mac. Big gains here on an OS with a much smaller footprint. The environment is far more solid. Hence I am keen to get Sonar on it. VST compatibility is an issue, there is one DAW that claims to run them under wine but I've forgotten the name, here are some VSTs running under Linux... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHd_Vl5EVAk BTW Wine does not run under virtualization it's an emulator: http://wiki.winehq.org/Debunking_Wine_Myths#head-7c9ecddfaff60d8891414b68d74277244e7109eb Anyway cheers :)
post edited by Doktor Avalanche - 2015/08/19 10:28:22
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Sycraft
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/19 11:41:37
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Doesn't matter what you call Wine (and they'd argue it isn't an emulator, Wine is an acronym meaning WINE Is Not an Emulator), it's another layer of abstraction that'll slow things down. Particularly since you are talking translating dissimilar system calls, and it is an implementation done by reverse engineering. Not the kind of thing calculated to be fast. You'll also have to forgive me if I call BS on the "more solid" thing. That reads like someone who has looked up talking points for Linux from a decade ago. Here at work we run a mix of Windows and Linux systems, but at the core of most of it is two Windows Server 2012R2 systems running Hyper-V on which most of the rest of the systems run as virtual machines. Know how many times they've crashed in three years? Zero. That number doesn't surprise me, rather I expect it. I expect modern systems to have problems nearly never. If you have a Windows system that is unstable, the problem is with the setup, not with Windows, and you might wish to work on diagnosing and fixing it. Because Linux isn't magic, you can have a Linux system that is a rickety POS real easy. Don't get me started on some of the hacked together setups in labs that like to crash if you so much as look at them funny. If you like Linux, that's fine, but trying to run an advanced, complex piece of Windows software that interacts with lots of other pieces on it is rather silly. To me it would be the same as trying to run a complex POSIX program setup on Windows using cygwin. Ya you could do it, but it is a bad idea. Just run the OS for which the software was designed.
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joyof60
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/19 11:51:31
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☄ Helpfulby Doktor Avalanche 2015/08/19 12:26:11
I run ASIO on Jack quite regularly, very minimal problems, I do recommend the single barrel Jack, cuts latency down to zero. Good Tennesee Whiskey never did me wrong!
Joyof60 Sonar Plat., Windows 10 Pro (64bit), Custom Build, AMD Rizen 5 @3.95GHz, Assorted HDDs, 32 Gb G.Skill RAM. Focusrite Scarlett 18i20, Roland FA08, coupla guitars and misc. mics, cans, and gadgetry.
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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/19 12:18:30
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Sycraft Doesn't matter what you call Wine (and they'd argue it isn't an emulator, Wine is an acronym meaning WINE Is Not an Emulator), it's another layer of abstraction that'll slow things down. Particularly since you are talking translating dissimilar system calls, and it is an implementation done by reverse engineering. Not the kind of thing calculated to be fast. You'll also have to forgive me if I call BS on the "more solid" thing. That reads like someone who has looked up talking points for Linux from a decade ago. Here at work we run a mix of Windows and Linux systems, but at the core of most of it is two Windows Server 2012R2 systems running Hyper-V on which most of the rest of the systems run as virtual machines. Know how many times they've crashed in three years? Zero. That number doesn't surprise me, rather I expect it. I expect modern systems to have problems nearly never. If you have a Windows system that is unstable, the problem is with the setup, not with Windows, and you might wish to work on diagnosing and fixing it. Because Linux isn't magic, you can have a Linux system that is a rickety POS real easy. Don't get me started on some of the hacked together setups in labs that like to crash if you so much as look at them funny. If you like Linux, that's fine, but trying to run an advanced, complex piece of Windows software that interacts with lots of other pieces on it is rather silly. To me it would be the same as trying to run a complex POSIX program setup on Windows using cygwin. Ya you could do it, but it is a bad idea. Just run the OS for which the software was designed.
You read the link. It is not a CPU emulator, however it does emulate and it doesn't virtualize. More solid does not mean unstable. If I was banging on about instability I would have mentioned it. It means it just works better and maintains itself better. There is no doubt you need to do far more maintenance on Windows machines. BTW Windows is perfectly stable for me and runs really fast... for Windows... and I like Windows. I run Windows server as well for IIS/SQL Server (in a virtualized environment mainly). Although you wouldn't have me running anything critical on Windows 10 for at least 6 months to a year. You can't run anything low latency with Hyper-V that's why I dual boot. I maintain an open mind on all operating systems, if you aren't convinced you clearly haven't tried a DAW under it away from Hyper-V, or a compatible app on Wine. You might just choke on your brew how well it works. Wine is fiddly though and a lot of things can't run on it, I do admit that. Ultimately it would be nice to have a native Sonar app on Linux for sure. Get yourself dual boot and try it, and throw away your preconceptions.. I've been running Unix and Windows for most of my life now, I can finally see some sort of convergence finally starting to happen with operating systems on the client side. It might take another decade.... (Corrected for auto correct typo)
post edited by Doktor Avalanche - 2015/08/19 13:24:24
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Sycraft
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/19 12:48:06
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I don't need to try dual boot. As I implied, I'm a systems administrator professionally. We have a whole bunch of servers and clients (about 1000 computers in total) both Windows an Linux. I've used Linux plenty, plenty enough to not care for it at all as a desktop. Also plenty enough to laugh at the "far more maintenance" statement. Our Linux systems take a ton of time to maintain, particularly when you start talking about all the fiddling around with Puppet that needs to be done to roll things out across multiple systems. If you are enthralled with Linux that's fine, but realize not everyone is and that lack of exposure isn't the reason. When I was a kid Linux held this kind of hacker mystique to me and I thought it was something amazing. Now after a decade and a half doing systems administration professionally it's just another OS, and one that annoys me with its lack of standards, and lack of good enterprise administration tools. I like it for running web servers, and it is fine as a core for embedded systems, but I am underwhelmed with it as a desktop OS.
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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/19 13:08:34
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Hello I have been Microsoft certified in the past (sysadmin) since NT days, and I develop on .NET on Windows (web, mainly ASP.NET). I have also been a DBA and QA tester in the past. My degree in business information systems. Most of my IT career has been spent with Microsft, I have nothing against any operating system,operating system wars bore me to be honest. Some OS's do things better than others and vice versa. They are tools. Linux is extremely good at admin, so is windows. They just take different approaches it is clear which one you prefer. For me I see swings and roundabouts with both. I suspect the last time you have used Linux as a desktop was when you were a kid, because a decade ago I might have agreed with you. Fact is it auto updates like windows (Ubuntu), and more or less is trouble free if you don't tinker with it. It's pretty user friendly as a client, they hardly need to get under the bonnet. You will observe more and more DAWs are supporting or are running under Linux. Go figure. I don't use puppet.
post edited by Doktor Avalanche - 2015/08/19 13:20:42
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mettelus
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Re: Bakers please test Sonar running on wine.
2015/08/19 13:18:38
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LOL, Alex (I am just giving you crap now), does SONAR on rum count? (SONAR can step up from the "mid-life crisis DAW" to the "inebriated mid-life crisis DAW" now  ).
ASUS ROG Maximus X Hero (Wi-Fi AC), i7-8700k, 16GB RAM, GTX-1070Ti, Win 10 Pro, Saffire PRO 24 DSP, A-300 PRO, plus numerous gadgets and gizmos that make or manipulate sound in some way.
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