Balanced/Unbalanced

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Bren Gun
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2008/01/28 13:45:07 (permalink)

Balanced/Unbalanced

Hey folks, as I have received excellent information on these forums I'm here once more in need of your excellent expertise. Now, I should know about this as I learnt **** but usually these kinds of things are of little interest to me (or so I'd think at some point in the past), so I forget.

Balanced audio = when hum/noise/etc. is automatically reduced in the cable and the cable must go from Balanced Output to Balanced Input to achieve this? It is especially good for longer distances? This is higher-quality ****.

Unbalanced audio = the opposite.

Now, what I also need to know is about these connections. Suppose you have a device that has only unbalanced audio output, what would the effect/drawback/advantage/etc. be if the receiving device only has balanced audio input?

And: what about the cables themselves to be used?
#1

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    krizrox
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    RE: Balanced/Unbalanced 2008/01/28 13:57:11 (permalink)
    Generally, you can hook anything to anything with anything and chances are it will work in some form or fashion. 30+ years of live sound work taught me that much. In order for balanced technology to work, it needs 3 conductors. That's the bottom line here. If you're going to run an unbalanced device over a long haul you're better off plugging it into an adapter at the source end which converts it to balanced and then run the longer cable as a balanced connection. Shorter connections/cable runs don't matter much as long as you use common sense. But you can take an unbalanced output and run it into a balanced input. Absolutely you can do that. You won't get the benefits of the noise cancellation but it might not matter anyway. There are other issues at stake though (impedence/level matching and such). Those are more important that any trade-off for noise reduction if you ask me.
    post edited by krizrox - 2008/01/28 14:13:02

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    #2
    Bren Gun
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    RE: Balanced/Unbalanced 2008/01/28 14:09:51 (permalink)
    Thanks. The part about using common sense when you said shorter cable runs don't matter much: what would you exactly fill in there to elaborate it? I might be missing something.
    #3
    yep
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    RE: Balanced/Unbalanced 2008/01/28 14:31:55 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: Bren Gun

    Thanks. The part about using common sense when you said shorter cable runs don't matter much: what would you exactly fill in there to elaborate it? I might be missing something.

    All else being equal (which it never is), the longer the cable run, the more room there is for noise to get introduced, and the more benefit there is to using balanced cable.

    The only purpose of using balanced connections is to reject electrical noise, such as from nearby power lines, motors, flourescent light ballasts, CRT screens, radio waves, and so on. If there is no electrical noise, there is nothing wrong with using unblanced connections and cable. In fact, strictly speaking, unbalanced connections are actually better because they remove the additional stage of the balancing/unbalancing transformers. However the vanishingly small tradeoff is almost certainly worth it, and in practice, balanced connections are generally regarded as better all-around.

    Common sense plays a lot in minimizing noise and signal quality problems. Every place and wire run is a little different, and trial-and-error and careful, critical listening are the basic requirements. The more an engineer understands about the technical aspects, the easier and quicker they can assess the situation, but at the end of the day there is no way to "think it through" to a certainty-- you have to actually listen and see what it sounds like and make some judgement calls about what comprimises are acceptible and where to draw the line between perfect and practical.

    Cheers.
    #4
    ohhey
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    RE: Balanced/Unbalanced 2008/01/28 14:40:07 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: Bren Gun

    Hey folks, as I have received excellent information on these forums I'm here once more in need of your excellent expertise. Now, I should know about this as I learnt **** but usually these kinds of things are of little interest to me (or so I'd think at some point in the past), so I forget.

    Balanced audio = when hum/noise/etc. is automatically reduced in the cable and the cable must go from Balanced Output to Balanced Input to achieve this? It is especially good for longer distances? This is higher-quality ****.

    Unbalanced audio = the opposite.

    Now, what I also need to know is about these connections. Suppose you have a device that has only unbalanced audio output, what would the effect/drawback/advantage/etc. be if the receiving device only has balanced audio input?

    And: what about the cables themselves to be used?


    You only get the benefits (noise cancellation, no loss over long runs) of balanced when BOTH ends are balanced. When working with an unbalanced output you need to find out how the input device is designed to work with an unbalanced source, might take a little research. For example on some you just use one of the contacts and the shield, on others (like a Lynx card) you have to use both contacts with no shield on one end. If there is no information you might have to do some trial and error or use some type of adapter.

    There are other compatibility issues with connections other then balanced or unbalanced. Line level, impedance, etc. Both ends need to "match" if possible. For example if you want to connect a guitar to a microphone preamp you really need a direct box that will not only convert from unbalanced to balanced but also from high impedance to low impedance. Also, if you connect a balanced line level out to a microphone level input you could overdrive the microphone preamp and get distortion or even damage the preamp. If you connect a balanced microphone to a balanced line level in you will get almost no signal because there is no preamp.

    So for each connection you need to make you need to find out what is needed to do that correctly.
    #5
    Bren Gun
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    RE: Balanced/Unbalanced 2008/01/29 10:40:48 (permalink)
    Alright. Thanks, guys.
    #6
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