BachFugue
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Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
Is there a way to adjust a track (or a section of one) such that no note attacks are below a certain velocity (i.e. the volume at which they sound)? Or to set it such that all note attacks are the same velocity. I have Sonar 7 Studio Edition. I have to press quite hard on my keyboards to avoid having to go back and right-click numerous individual notes in the track to juice up their individual sound level.
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/03 12:35:06
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There are several ways to adjust the velocity of midi notes, but this won't just affect the transient, it will apply for the entire note (subject to the natural decay of the patch) I'm sorry I'm not at my DAW at the moment, but I think you need to look in the Edit menu where you'll find Select by Filter. Start by unchecking everything, then just check notes, then apply the minimum & maximum values. this will then only select those notes falling within your particular criteria From there you can set them all to a given value in the Event Inspector
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BachFugue
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/03 13:16:34
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Thanks for the fast reply! I found the Event Inspector and can easily set all notes to the same duration with it and Ctrl-A to select all -- what a gas! I take it that is the only issue you're dealing with above, and Edit - Select - by Filter is purely for selecting notes you want to adjust? Anybody know how to set a minimum velocity for all notes in an existing track?
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DrLumen
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/03 13:38:28
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You can open the piano roll view and draw the velocity controller. Or under Process there is Scale Velocity. Both are shown here: As to adjusting the velocity for playing I found the Gain in the console strip works. I'm sure there are other ways as well.
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Kalle Rantaaho
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/03 13:52:53
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Just for the record: Do not mix velocity with volume. They are (mostly) two different things. Using a soft synth with velocity layered samples, velocity defines which of them is triggered. Using volume, you can make the most silent snare scratch louder than the full power hit. There may be an option to adjust the velocity curve of your keyboard. That may help you to get more consistent levels right from the start.
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/03 15:13:45
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Referring to the first picture by DrLumen, you can use this technique in conjunction with the Edit > Select by Filter function in order to have only those notes falling below your threshold highlighted so only those notes can be dragged upwards/downwards. Or you can use Scale Velocity again on your restricted selection Or.... you can select the desired notes as described, then in Track View, right click the clip containing the notes and choose Process Effect > Midi Effects > Cakewalk Fx > Velocity. This will open up the plugin's gui where you can do all sorts of things with velocity - it's a very powerful tool but it is also a destructive process meaning once you save your project without hitting undo, you'll lose the original velocities. Also, you might find the Velocity plugin is mapped to Uncategorized instead of Cakewalk Fx as outlined above.
post edited by Bristol_Jonesey - 2016/10/03 15:36:26
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brundlefly
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/03 15:38:36
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There are many ways to skin this cat: Edit > Find/Replace uses the same dialog as Select by Filter to define both the selection and how to change it in one operation. Start by selecting the whole clip so that the Find filter has something to work on; then you have basically two options: 1. Set Velocity Max in the Find dialog to the minimum that you intend to set (leaving Min at 0), so that only the low-velocity notes are selected. Then set the Velocity Min/Max in the Replace dialog to the desired minimum value to set all select notes to the fixed minimum. (You could also accomplish this using Select by Filter and then Event Inspector. 2. If you want more of a proportional 'compression' of all velocities toward the high end, set the Find range to encompass the lowest and highest values present (but not a lot more, or you'll get too much compression), and set the Replace values to your desired Min and Max. Or you can look into using azslow3's MIDI Compression MFX: http://www.azslow.com/index.php/topic,275.0.html See this post for more info: http://forum.cakewalk.com/FindPost/3437457 Keith Albright also posted earlier in the same thread about using Scale Velocities to achieve this.
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BachFugue
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/03 15:46:35
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"adjust a track (or a section of one) such that no note attacks are below a certain velocity" -- that's really all I'm after here, folks. Can't find the velocity controller or figure out Scale Velocity. DrLumen's Console view doesn't resemble mine. I'm reading "To edit velocity" in the program's Help. It gives 5 incomprehensible steps e.g. "2. Make sure Velocity has a checkmark next to it in the Show/Hide MIDI Events menu." No doubt the latter is in there somewhere, but it doesn't respond to any of my searches. Thank you ALL for your ongoing input. There has to be a very simple answer somewhere -- I feel it in my bones.
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BachFugue
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/03 15:50:21
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brundlefly 1. Set Velocity Max in the Find dialog to the minimum that you intend to set (leaving Min at 0), so that only the low-velocity notes are selected. Then set the Velocity Min/Max in the Replace dialog to the desired minimum value to set all select notes to the fixed minimum. (You could also accomplish this using Select by Filter and then Event Inspector.
Where are those dialogs, please?
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brundlefly
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/03 16:00:30
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OK, to be more precise: 1. Select clip or part of clip. 2. Choose Process > Find/Change in the main menu. 3. In the first dialog, enter (for example) 60 as the Max for Velocity, and OK. 4. In the second dialog, enter 60 as both the Min and Max for Velocity, and OK. All notes with a velocity at or below 60 will be set to 60.
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BachFugue
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/03 16:12:16
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OK. I found Process > MIDI Fx > Cakewalk Fx > Velocity which brings up a silvery Velocity machine face popup. This shows a rivet in each corner and is mainly taken up by a dark red screen with settable variables headed SET, CHANGE, SCALE, LIMIT, CHANGE, GRADUALLY, AMOUNT, TENDENCY. These are set at 100 -- 0 -- 1% -- 127 -- 120 -- 100% -- 1 -- 0. Below LIMIT, CHANGE and GRADUALLY are little boxes saying 1, 1 and 1%. Am I in the right place? There's no mention of min or max.
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brundlefly
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/03 16:51:40
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I was referring to Process > Find/Change.
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/03 17:03:35
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In order to use the plugin successfully you MUST make a note selection before opening it, otherwise any changes you make via the plugin will apply to ALL notes. Brundlefly's solution above is a good one though it does force all selected notes to a single value. The specific steps I would take are: Select entire clip Process > Scale Velocity This should default to values of 100 in both boxes As a starting point, set them both to 140, click Percentages, then Ok Have a look at the velocities in the PRV. If it's not what you want, undo & try again with different values
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BachFugue
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/03 18:30:15
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Initially trying what you said, weak notes were still weak and faint on the screen. Volume knob is up. Trying different strategies in that popup brings results that refuse to show any logic. I can get it to play very softly or loudly this way (and variations there of I've been trying), whether changing Begin to 111 and End to 67, then vice versa or setting them both high or both low -- yes, checking Percentages (though I tried it without as well). Why can't there be a simple control for this within sight of the word Velocity? That's all I want to adjust. Find/Change does not show under Process, Brundlefly.
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brundlefly
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/03 19:00:56
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Just noticed you are using S7. Back then, Process > Find/Change was Edit > Interpolate. Note that 'Gain' on MIDI tracks is actually Velocity Offset. This can be used to quickly increase the Velocity of a whole clip by a fixed amount. But selectively adjusting just the lower limit is a special case that requres more steps.
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williamcopper
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/03 20:33:13
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It would be a very easy CAL program. Something like, Get My_minimum_note_velocity foreach Event where event type = NOTE if note.velocity < my_minimum then (= note.velocity My_minimum). If you know anything at all about programming take a look at some of the samples provided in Cal Scripts, and modify.
post edited by williamcopper - 2016/10/03 20:55:04
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williamcopper
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/03 20:42:55
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;;--- something like this should work. You always have to make sure the parens balance. ;; Select notes however you like: the program will apply to all notes selected, whether by track, by range of time, or by ;; range of pitch, or some combination. (do (int My_min 64) ; default value (getInt My_min "Enter minimum velocity: 1 126 ) ) ;; body (do (if (== Event.Kind NOTE) (do (if (< Note.Vel My_min (= Note.Vel My_min) ) ) ) )
post edited by williamcopper - 2016/10/03 21:06:42
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williamcopper
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/03 20:47:35
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In Platinum, Ctrl-F1 should take you to the Cal scripts directory (At least on mine...) Identify the directory, use Notepad (windows) or some text editor to create a simple text file with .cal as the ending, place in that directory. Then access by Ctrl-F1.
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DrLumen
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/03 21:01:24
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I guess I'm missing something... If you go to Edit | Select | By Filter and then carefully craft the range of note velocities you want changed (eg. from 0 to 32), once they are selected you should be able to use Scale Velocity to set or adjust as needed. Either as specific values or percentages of the source. Yes, a script would work but seems to be a bit of overkill.
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BachFugue
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/03 21:27:18
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brundlefly Just noticed you are using S7. Back then, Process > Find/Change was Edit > Interpolate. Note that 'Gain' on MIDI tracks is actually Velocity Offset. This can be used to quickly increase the Velocity of a whole clip by a fixed amount. But selectively adjusting just the lower limit is a special case that requres more steps. Not on mine, though Process > Interpolate brings up the same "Event Filter -- Search" screen as in Bristol's reply #1 above. OK, I do Ctrl-A and go to that screen and set it for notes of 0 to 90 velocity, because I want all of those to be set at 90. Before I screw it up again, exactly what do I do in the little Scale velocity popup to get that result -- no velocities less than 90, nothing above 90 affected by the change? Velocity offset sounds great for when I need it some other time. I think we're on to something here. Thanks for sticking with me, gang. [EDITED/CORRECTED]
post edited by BachFugue - 2016/10/03 21:56:00
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DrLumen
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/04 00:16:40
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IMS from the CW 7-8 versions, once the notes are selected from the filter selection, set both begin and end (min/max) to 90 (not percent) in the Scale Velocity popup.
post edited by DrLumen - 2016/10/04 00:41:29
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BachFugue
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/04 00:43:11
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DrLumen IMS from the CW 7-8 versions, once the notes are selected from the filter selection, set both begin and end (min/max) to 90 (not percent) in the Scale Velocity popup.
That just sets them all to 90. That was settled in reply #1, but it's good to have a 2nd route to doing so. I see now that Scale Velocity is for setting a crescendo or diminuendo. Does anybody have an idea how to up the velocity of, say, only the notes 90 or lower velocity? In attack, not tempo. I just tried going back to Event Filter - Search and unchecked absolutely everything except the Note parameter -- top line. Tried setting Velocity there to Min 0 and Max 90; clicked OK but it just took me to an almost identical Event Filter -- replace popup. I tried clicking Cancel and it gave me the same screen again. Hit Cancel again and it was gone. Went back and checked the parameters I'd unchecked -- it similarly resisted closing the popup before doing so. I've hit the C key many times by accident (aiming for the space bar) and now see it brings up a graph of the velocity. Help says this is for editing such, but I don't see how -- and the bottom of the graph isn't even visible. In Help I see under Process-Interpolate Velocity From 0 to 127 From 80 to 127 Compresses the velocity values into a narrower range We're getting warmer, but that still isn't it if it means it narrows everything proportionately. More frustration: Doing View > Console, sliders for the present track stack (Audio 1 and 2, MIDI 1 and 2) shows for a test track I've just created and the record button is red, just right. But all sliders are set in the same position -- about 1/6 of the way from the top. The one for my present MIDI 1 track appears to be for duration -- it's numbers range from 0 to 127. What's it mean? What to do here? NEXT DAY OCT. 4......... OK, the thin vertical line that accompanies each note in Player Piano View isn't a stem as I'd thought but a velocity indicator. Found this on trying Scale Velocity again. Opened the little popup and setting it for Begin: 80 and End: 100. This simply reset the velocities as a crescendo (from 80 to 100) from the beginning of the selected passage (they whole test piece) to the end -- you could see it in the rising row of vertical pinstripes. Now accepting theories as to why there's no Velocity knob in Console view on mine. There really isn't!
post edited by BachFugue - 2016/10/04 12:53:36
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BachFugue
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/04 20:15:44
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I guess there's no way to do it. Next question -- is there a timer in Sonar that simply gives you the real-time duration of a track in minutes and seconds?
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brundlefly
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/04 21:21:24
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Okay, one more time with feeling... Going back to what I posted earlier, and substituting 'Edit > Interpolate' for 'Process > Find/Change', and using the minimum value of 80 you mentioned above, this should do exactly what you described: 1. Select clip or part of clip. 2. Choose Edit > Interpolate in the main menu. 3. In the first dialog, enter 80 as the Max for Velocity, and OK. 4. In the second dialog, enter 80 as both the Min and Max for Velocity, and OK. All notes with a velocity at or below 80 will be set to 80.
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BachFugue
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/04 23:00:37
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It WORKS! THANK YOU!!! That was your item 1 in reply #7, huh! Forgive me, I just don't know the jargon or terrain yet -- and things are definitely different in my 7. You don't know what this does for me -- basic answers can be sooooo hard to find in the digital age -- my sexegenarian head's not built for it! So it's a simple Find and Replace action -- and I've been the one telling everybody how marvelously similar this all is to writing documents What about the silvery/dark red screen I mentioned in #11 above? What's it for? And is there anything built in to Sonar that will give the duration of a track?
post edited by BachFugue - 2016/10/05 00:36:37
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/05 03:30:10
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Glad you sussed it out. Incidentally, if you want to preserve the relative value of your velocities after doing the Edit > Interpolate thing, then opening the Scale Velocity box, you could set both boxes to say, 140, tick percentages and all the selected notes will go up by 40%
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BachFugue
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/05 05:48:43
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brundlefly
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/06 03:52:59
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The Velocity MIDI FX you mentioned in post #11 is primarily for altering velocity non-destructively on playback. The advantage of this is that you can experiment with different settings without permanently altering what you originally recorded. If necessary, it can be applied destructively once you're satisfied with the result, or it can be left active indefinitely. In this case I don't think it can do exactly what you want, but you can hit F1 with focus on the FX dialog to bring up the Help on how the settings work. You might want to consider an upgrade to the current SONAR if you can swing it. So much has changed since S7 that it will be difficult for most users on the forum to help you effectively... even oldtimers like me.
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BachFugue
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/06 07:48:36
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Thank you! Does that make it the same thing as the other approach except that changes only last thru the session? What if you save? I wouldn't mind an upgrade, but have read that the older versions are easier to use? I'm a proud dinosaur, I like old stuff. There's no timer in S7, correct -- as in minutes and seconds? Next question -- is there a tempo slider somewhere in S7 or any version, or is it limited to manual changes of tempo? I want to be able to freely add ritards and accelerandi during playback, then Ctrl-S to instantly save 'em like any other change. I've learned how to do them in slo-mo while laying down a track live at a super slow speed (my normal procedure for faster compositions) but it would be a lot easier to lay the track metronomically, then add these features after the fact with a slider or similarly simple control. No doubt this can be done by setting up scaling, but that's too coldly mechanical for the present need. By helping me you're helping to keep a great deal of classical organ music in circulation that would otherwise crumble in file drawers.
post edited by BachFugue - 2016/10/06 08:24:28
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dcumpian
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Re: Basic actions e.g. note velocity/volume
2016/10/06 08:06:38
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☼ Best Answerby BachFugue 2016/10/06 09:37:50
BachFugue Thank you! Does that make it the same thing as the other approach except that changes only last thru the session? What if you save? I wouldn't mind an upgrade, but have read that the older versions are easier to use? I'm a proud dinosaur, I like old stuff. There's no timer in S7, correct -- as in minutes and seconds? Next question -- is there a tempo slider somewhere in S7 or any version, or is it limited to manual changes of tempo? I want to be able to freely add ritards and accelerandi during playback, then Ctrl-S to instantly save 'em like any other change. I've learned how to do them in slo-mo while laying down a track live at a super slow speed (my normal procedure for faster compositions) but it would be a lot easier to lay the track metronomically, then add these features after the fact with a slider or similarly simple control. No doubt this can be done by setting up scaling, but that's too coldly mechanical for the present need. By helping me you're helping to keep a great deal of classical organ music in circulation that would otherwise crumble in file drawers.
Have you tried reading the manual? S7 came with a big fat one that I used to read between sessions. All of your questions are answered there. There is no Tempo slider. Rather, there is a tempo VIEW where you can draw in tempo changes. Regards, Dan
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