Building a machine for friend - hyperthreading question

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pyrocide
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2011/06/27 11:27:18 (permalink)

Building a machine for friend - hyperthreading question

Hello all,
 
I am not a user of cakewalk software, I am however a computer builder. Been in the game for over 10 years now and have been a lot of machines for gaming, 3D rendering, but not one specifically for sound editing.
 
Friend asked me to build him a machine for sound editing, that uses "fruity loops" and "music creator".
 
I have the system almost narrowed down in terms of hardware, except for the CPU. As far as I can tell, there is nothing mentioned in the product sheets of music creator 5 that explicity states details about hyperthreading, however there are some threads i found that mention hyperthreading should be turned off in BIOS, but they were back in 2006, not so current now.
 
So does anyone have any insight on whether the i7 or i5 would be better for a sound editing rig?
 
As well, I have chosen the HT Omega 7.1 Sound card, and would like to know if there are some other cards that are able to directly plug a guitar into?
 
Thanks
 
-Tony
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    Beagle
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    Re:Building a machine for friend - hyperthreading question 2011/06/27 11:34:05 (permalink)
    which version of Music Creator?

    MC4 was multicore compatible, but it didn't work the best and sometimes had to be disabled (but that was also using winxp, win7 may be different, I haven't heard any complaints that I remember).  MC4 was based on Sonar 6.  MC5 is the newest version and it is multicore compatible and works fine with hyperthreading as well, so i5 or i7 either one will run MC5 well.  I have a copy of MC5 running on my i5, but EITHER will be fine for MC5.

    HT Omega 7.1 soundcard would not be what I would recommend for use with MC5.  in fact unless he's going to be creating surround sound files, he does not need a 7.1 system and if he's doing surround sound he needs Sonar, because MC will not do surround.  I would also not recommend any soundcard for recording that is not designed specifically for recording (as the HT Omega is NOT).

    check my website for soundcard recommendations.  I'd look at the line6 stuff if all he's doing is recroding electric guitar.  if he's doing more than guitar I'd look at some of the others on my site such as m-audio.
    post edited by Beagle - 2011/06/27 11:42:45

    http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
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    #2
    pyrocide
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    Re:Building a machine for friend - hyperthreading question 2011/06/27 11:56:46 (permalink)
    Its actually quite humorous, I was just reading your site and came back to post an edit about some of the mentioned cards there.

    I was liking the look of the Delta 1010LT. Specifically, the Line6, what does this mean for him? As far as i know it will only be him recording an electric guitar.

    As well, I believe he will have Music Creator 5.
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    Beagle
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    Re:Building a machine for friend - hyperthreading question 2011/06/27 12:09:33 (permalink)
    glad to be of service!

    the 1010LT is a good card, but it's overkill for him using MC.  MC doesn't allow more than 2 simultaneous inputs at a time, so the 1010LT's 8 analog inputs are more than he needs unless he plans to upgrade in the future (he'd need to step up to Sonar X1 Essentials to get more simultaneous inputs).

    Line6 products are popular with electric guitarists because those products come with amp simulation models that he can choose from to make his guitar sound like he's using different amps.

    I would also recommend getting something that has at least one mic input and phantom power if possible because he may want to record his guitar thru a mic'd amp eventually even if not right away.  if he knows he'll never want to do that, then don't worry about it, but that's a typical thing for guitarists to want to do in the future.

    http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
    i7, 16G DDR3, Win10x64, MOTU Ultralite Hybrid MK3
    Yamaha MOXF6, Hammond XK3c, other stuff.
    #4
    pyrocide
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    Re:Building a machine for friend - hyperthreading question 2011/06/27 12:33:16 (permalink)
    I just asked him and he did mention that he will be doing more than just guitar, not sure on if its simultaneously. Ill let him know about the Sonar X1.

    In your list, there doesnt seem to be any PCI (internal sound cards) that come with "Phantom Power".

    For his needs, do you have a specific model, in the range of 100-200 preferably internal? If external is his best option i can probably rig something up with a case mod.
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    Robomusic
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    Re:Building a machine for friend - hyperthreading question 2011/06/27 13:01:40 (permalink)
    If it is a desktop machine i would suggest a Delta 24/96 card for someone just recoding themselves. It is very easy to setup and works great. Solid drivers and such. Add a small mixer to that system.

    Remember that even though the delta 1010 does more inputs than MC5 does, your friend is likely to upgrade as his involvement grows, so it is sometims a good thing to start off with a bit more than you need so as not to need to upgrade to quickly.

    Many of the options both on Beag's page and other places are going to be USB or firewire external interface boxes. These are great, and very flexable, but for shear ease of install and getting going PCI cards are really great as well. It really boils down to need.

    If you use a USB interface the users must remember to attach and turn on the interface prior to starting MC. With a PCI card it is ready to go 24/7


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    #6
    pyrocide
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    Re:Building a machine for friend - hyperthreading question 2011/06/27 13:17:59 (permalink)
    It will be a desktop machine, a mini itx tower with modular PSU and very minimal cables showing, so i can fit whatever i need to in it.

    I think it would be best for PCI. So I think I will go for the Delta 1010LT. As well could one of you explain Phantom Power to me?

    Thanks for all the help BTW. Very helpful
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    Beagle
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    Re:Building a machine for friend - hyperthreading question 2011/06/27 13:26:22 (permalink)
    right - the PCI cards (most of them) don't have phantom power or even mic preamps (mic preamps are necessary for microphones).  the USB ones most of them DO come with mic preamps and most come with phantom power.

    ALL microphones need a preamp, but condensor microphones need phantom power to turn the mic "on".  dynamic mics do not require phantom power.  condensor mics are typically used in a studio setting and are used primarily on vocals and for recording instruments directly, dynamics are typically used for LIVE vocals and for recording guitar AMPS (however those are not exclusive examples).

    even tho the 1010LT has 2 mic preamps on it, it doesn't have phantom power.  I would advise with all PCI soundcards that you also get a small mixer, such as the Behringer Xenyx 802 to add to the soundcard for mic preamps and phantom power as well as a headphone output (which the PCI soundcards don't normally have, including the 1010LT).

    http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
    i7, 16G DDR3, Win10x64, MOTU Ultralite Hybrid MK3
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    #8
    pyrocide
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    Re:Building a machine for friend - hyperthreading question 2011/06/27 13:38:48 (permalink)
    Alright so a small form mixer with phantom, headphone output and mic preamps, PLUS the Delta 1010LT would be solid?

    As well considering the usage of HT, this is the build I was going to present to him.

    i7 2600, Asus P8Z68 Pro, Win7 x64, 8GB Gskill 1600.
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    Beagle
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    Re:Building a machine for friend - hyperthreading question 2011/06/27 13:55:26 (permalink)
    Yes, I think the 1010LT with a small mixer such as the 802 would work fine.

    but what do you mean by "as well considering the usage of HT..."?

    the rest of that system looks good, tho.

    http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
    i7, 16G DDR3, Win10x64, MOTU Ultralite Hybrid MK3
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    pyrocide
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    Re:Building a machine for friend - hyperthreading question 2011/06/27 14:15:01 (permalink)
    HT = hyperthreading

    MC5 used multicore tech correct? With a multicore CPU like the i7 it would be rock solid for years.
     
    If MC5 did not use multicore as well, I would have gone with the i5 instead.
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    Beagle
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    Re:Building a machine for friend - hyperthreading question 2011/06/27 14:19:41 (permalink)
    oh - sorry, I thought you were referring back to the HT Omega 7.1!

    MC5 uses multicore well.  the only problem could be that the drivers for the soundcard could pre-empt the use of multicores correctly inside MC, but I am fairly certain I have not heard of any problems with m-audio's drivers for multicore for the 1010LT.
     
    I assume you mean you'd have gone with the i5 if MC didn't use HT well?  since i5 is multicore, but not HT.

    http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
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    pyrocide
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    Re:Building a machine for friend - hyperthreading question 2011/06/27 14:23:03 (permalink)
    Sorry yes, that is correct.

    Apologies, too many acronyms being tossed around.

    If the Music Creator did not use hyperthreading well, I would have gone with the i5 instead of the i7.
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    Guitarhacker
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    Re:Building a machine for friend - hyperthreading question 2011/06/27 14:46:55 (permalink)
    I built a screaming fast DAW box last year based on the i5 intel chip. 

    As Beagle points out MC only allows 2 inputs at a time. I would recommend going with an EXTERNAL USB interface rather than a PCI card interface. It will provide ALL that he needs in a convenient external box that will work well.

    A bigger issue would be the OS. XP is what I use with MC4,  but MC5 will work with W7.

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    gcolbert
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    Re:Building a machine for friend - hyperthreading question 2011/06/29 20:29:15 (permalink)
    My god man!  You are puting Citreon CV2 wheels on a Masarati!  Have your friend go to Amazon or somewhere on-line and buy a copy of Sonar Home Studio 7 XL NOW.  SHS7 is a discontinued product, but it is just Music Creator 5 on steroids.  When he decides to upgrade to X1 the upgrade discount will be the same.  He might even get a cheaper upgrade from SHS7.  It is worth it just from the Boost11 compresser/limiter, but there is a whole lot more. It's X1 Essential with the simple to use interface from Music Creator.
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    sykodelic
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    Re:Building a machine for friend - hyperthreading question 2011/06/29 22:24:05 (permalink)
    My god man!  You are puting Citreon CV2 wheels on a Masarati!


    +1

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    Guitarhacker
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    Re:Building a machine for friend - hyperthreading question 2011/06/30 09:29:09 (permalink)
    I'd personally be careful of buying cake products from a second hand source on the internet. Buy it from Cake and you know you are getting a legal, uncracked, copy that will allow you all the rights and privileges of an owner.

    There is NOTHING wrong with buying MC5 ($40) and putting it on a screaming fast, state of the art, computer. I run MC4 on a very capable and fast machine. It makes the experience sweet to be able to do all I want to do without the hiccups from a machine that is struggling to process all the data.

    MC5 is a good way to start, and you can move "UP" later, when you actually need the abilities of the "big boys" in the cake stable of products.

    My website & music: www.herbhartley.com

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