konradh
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CD Spacing
To leave a couple of seconds between tracks, do you use the "assembling" program like Pyro to space the songs (as opposed to putting space and the start or end of a track)?
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scook
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Re:CD Spacing
2012/09/03 17:33:59
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Yes, CD Architect takes care of that for me.
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Lynn
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Re:CD Spacing
2012/09/03 18:07:51
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+1 scook
Yes, CD Architect takes care of that for me.
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randyman
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Re:CD Spacing
2012/09/03 18:46:51
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isn't the redbook standard to have 4 seconds between?
(i'm old and my memory isn't what it used to be so what do i know?)
A rack of noisemakers is not a definitive substitute for creativity. (though it does seem to help) what I spend my lunch time doing: (don't laugh - its just for fun!) www.soundclick.com/rnewburn
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konradh
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Re:CD Spacing
2012/09/03 18:48:38
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randyman, I will check the standards, but I have always put 2 seconds (right or wrong). UPDATE: Websites for ACID (Sony), Audacity, and a couple of others said 2 seconds. http://www.summitsound.com/mastering.html <<This link says 2 seconds is the Redbook standard. Wikipedia: Red Book Audio Specifications The basic specifications state that - Maximum playing time is 79.8 minutes[5]
- Minimum duration for a track is 4 seconds (including 2-second pause)
- Maximum number of tracks is 99
- Maximum number of index points (subdivisions of a track) is 99 with no maximum time limit
- International Standard Recording Code (ISRC) should be included
post edited by konradh - 2012/09/03 18:56:02
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konradh
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Re:CD Spacing
2012/09/03 18:52:56
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Jeff Evans
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Re:CD Spacing
2012/09/03 18:56:41
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You have not told us yet are you just making one or two CD's for yourself or are you getting a CD pressed by a CD manufacturer?
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konradh
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Re:CD Spacing
2012/09/03 19:04:11
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I am making CDs to sell. I expect most sales to be downloads, but I will have some CDs manufactured. The download version will be whole-ablum only, on my website and on iTunes.
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randyman
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Re:CD Spacing
2012/09/03 19:04:36
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my bad  i knew it was something  but I'm old and forgetful.
A rack of noisemakers is not a definitive substitute for creativity. (though it does seem to help) what I spend my lunch time doing: (don't laugh - its just for fun!) www.soundclick.com/rnewburn
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OlSkoolGuy
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Re:CD Spacing
2012/09/03 19:13:00
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Having said all that, you can actually blend (crossfade, seque) tracks together as long as you get that track index marker perfect.
I use a consumer program call "Spin it Again" from Acoustica to trim, time, space, seque, etc; but there is a strange learning curve... considering it is not really intended for professionals. It wasn't free, but not expensive either.
Using Disc-At-Once to actually burn a CD, it isn't difficult to create a CD that will play on any type of legacy CD player I have tried, without having to meet ALL the little Red Book standards (like the 2-second gap between tracks, which many programs allow you to adjust or disregard completely).
Its main selling point is the ease of use for archiving vinyl and tape to digital. But it works great to sequence a CD as one long track (with approximate spaces between... or not...) before flying into "Spin it Again". Works like a charm for me! Allows me to tag tracks while the recording process is happening (in real time, of course).
Regards,
Joel
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konradh
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Re:CD Spacing
2012/09/03 19:26:55
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Thanks for all the good dialog.
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OlSkoolGuy
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Re:CD Spacing
2012/09/03 19:29:37
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Best of luck with the project, konradh!
Let us know when is ready for sale/download.
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bitflipper
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Re:CD Spacing
2012/09/04 00:00:07
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There is nothing in the Red Book standard regarding gaps between songs, only the requirement that there be 2 seconds of silence before the first song.
Don't forget the creative possibilities of varying the gap or eliminating it altogether. A standard technique is to count off a measure at the tempo of the previous song and start the next song on the imaginary downbeat. Or, if two songs are in the same key like all of the Coffee House Band's, run them together and let the second song fade in as the first one's fading out. Such things were novel back when the Moody Blues first did it, back when you had to use razor blades on tape, but nowadays it's a piece o' cake. Still effective, though.
 All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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AT
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Re:CD Spacing
2012/09/04 00:12:49
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CD Architect won't let you burn a CD w/o the two seconds at the start of the thing. I know, I've pulled my start song there before. The 2 seconds is automatically inserted.
If you are sending a CD off for replication CDA is well worth the investment.
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re:CD Spacing
2012/09/04 03:34:51
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Another +1 for CD Architect, one of my top 3 software purchases
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konradh
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Re:CD Spacing
2012/09/04 09:43:21
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bitflipper, Thanks for the Red Book clarification and thoughts.
Everyone else, Thanks for the suggestions and recommendations.
Strnagely, this hasn't come up since I've been on X1. Some older projects were mastered on DAT (and 1/4" with leader tape before that!). Then I did some things on a VS-1680 and assembled the master CD there. My most recent project was producing an alternative rock band in another studio and the engineer there handled this aspect. This is actually my first X1 in-the-box project for sale.
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markyzno
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Re:CD Spacing
2012/09/04 09:58:01
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+1 bitflipper
There is nothing in the Red Book standard regarding gaps between songs, only the requirement that there be 2 seconds of silence before the first song.
Don't forget the creative possibilities of varying the gap or eliminating it altogether. A standard technique is to count off a measure at the tempo of the previous song and start the next song on the imaginary downbeat. Or, if two songs are in the same key like all of the Coffee House Band's, run them together and let the second song fade in as the first one's fading out. Such things were novel back when the Moody Blues first did it, back when you had to use razor blades on tape, but nowadays it's a piece o' cake. Still effective, though.
Sonar Platinum 64 bit > Pro tools 10.3.2 >Intel i7 3770K > 16Gb Ram > Gigabyte Z77-D3H Motherboard> NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660 2 GB > ATi RADEON HD5700 > 240GB OCZ Agility 3 SSD> Win 10 home 64 bit> Delta 1010 > MOTU Audio Express > MA-15D's > NI Ultimate 9 > NI Kontrol S61 1.1 > NI MAschine Studio 2.3 / KORG MS-20 Mini - Arturia MicroBrute > KORG SQ1 - KORG Kaoss Pad KP3 > iPad and IO Dock 2 running various bits > Bunch of guitars >Sound Design on IMDB --
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Jim Roseberry
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Re:CD Spacing
2012/09/04 10:11:25
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There is nothing in the Red Book standard regarding gaps between songs, only the requirement that there be 2 seconds of silence before the first song. Yeah, the 2-second gap became "common" because some of the limited apps (Nero) automatically put a 2-second gap between tunes. Pro level burning apps (CD Architect, Samplitude, Wavelab) will let you layout the tunes anyway you choose.
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bitflipper
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Re:CD Spacing
2012/09/04 11:33:11
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There's a practical reason for the 2-second gap between songs. There is no physical index on the CD that allows the player to seek precisely to an arbitrary position on the disk. Rather, there is only a table of contents that lists the time offsets of each song and it's up to the CD mechanism to approximate where playback should start. CD players are generally not precision devices, and can only find that spot within plus or minus 1 second.
I still prefer gapless and variable-gap layouts, though. It's a little reward for those listeners who don't use random-play but listen to the album front to back as intended.
All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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CJaysMusic
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Re:CD Spacing
2012/09/04 17:53:51
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isn't the redbook standard to have 4 seconds between? No, not at all. You use what ever make the album flow the best. if that means 2 seconds for one song and a half second for another song. Then that is what you do. Red book doesn't decide the silence between your songs, you do... Red book are standards for playback The only 2 second gap you need is right before the 1st song plays. That is a red book standard, but what happens between your songs is up to you and only you. Cj
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