AdamGrossmanLG
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CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
Hello, I have a 2700k i7 processor, which I never have issues with, but in Sonar it seems like the first core is being taxed and causes the playback to glitch. Is there any to spread the work over all 8 cores?  Thank You!
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noynekker
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/07 20:16:45
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Does core 1 spike with no plugins loaded at all, or do you have some "look ahead" plugins loaded when it does this ?
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noynekker
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/07 20:24:22
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Only tweak I know of for this is "ThreadSchedulingModel" in the Sonar Configuration file . . . for a Quad core I believe most have had best results with a setting of 2
post edited by noynekker - 2016/02/07 20:39:26
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John
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/07 20:27:33
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Which update are you using? I had a similar problem and the latest, Manchester, has fixed it.
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/07 20:31:18
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noynekker
Does core 1 spike with no plugins loaded at all, or do you have some "look ahead" plugins loaded when it does this ?
no, it is quiet without plugins... thing is, I'm not using any plugins really, it's mostly soft-synths, but I only have about 5 loaded right now.
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/07 20:31:35
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John
Which update are you using? I had a similar problem and the latest, Manchester, has fixed it.
Hi there, I am on the latest and greatest
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noynekker
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/07 20:42:20
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You could try archiving the soft synth tracks one by one to see which one(s) may be causing core 1 to spike.
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/07 21:14:43
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noynekker
You could try archiving the soft synth tracks one by one to see which one(s) may be causing core 1 to spike.
OK I will try that later. Thank you. Is there a way to get the load to spread against all 8 cores once I find the offending softsynth?
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tenfoot
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/07 21:23:33
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SilverBlueMedallion
noynekker
You could try archiving the soft synth tracks one by one to see which one(s) may be causing core 1 to spike.
OK I will try that later. Thank you.
Is there a way to get the load to spread against all 8 cores once I find the offending softsynth?
Depending on which OS you are running, it is worth trying disabling core parking. Certainly worked on my Win 7 system. Here's one utility that will do it. https://bitsum.com/parkcontrol/
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Ludus
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/07 22:40:19
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I'm having the same problem, even if I use core parking. I wish that someone from Cakewalk would respond to this problem. Core 1 is always 50% - 75% higher then the others. I see it the most with AD2 or multiple FX Plugins. Win 8.1 and Win 10pro, ASIO drivers. Manchester, Computer set to High performance.
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noynekker
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/07 23:08:17
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PassiveDrift
I'm having the same problem, even if I use core parking. I wish that someone from Cakewalk would respond to this problem. Core 1 is always 50% - 75% higher then the others. I see it the most with AD2 or multiple FX Plugins. Win 8.1 and Win 10pro, ASIO drivers. Manchester, Computer set to High performance.
Of course I can't speak for Cakewalk, but I think they can't control what other plugin manufacturers code into their products. Windows OS may have a hand in this as well. My example would be that when I use Izotope's Ozone 5 VST3 plugin for mastering within Sonar, core #1 is usually spiking, especially with "look ahead" type settings. There are limitations to what may be possible with your audio interface vs. Plugin settings + Windows OS.
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tenfoot
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/08 04:43:23
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PassiveDrift
I'm having the same problem, even if I use core parking.
Hi passive drift. You want to disable core parking - not use it.
post edited by tenfoot - 2016/02/08 04:57:02
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dlesaux
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/08 05:06:55
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noynekker
PassiveDrift
I'm having the same problem, even if I use core parking. I wish that someone from Cakewalk would respond to this problem. Core 1 is always 50% - 75% higher then the others. I see it the most with AD2 or multiple FX Plugins. Win 8.1 and Win 10pro, ASIO drivers. Manchester, Computer set to High performance.
Of course I can't speak for Cakewalk, but I think they can't control what other plugin manufacturers code into their products. Windows OS may have a hand in this as well. My example would be that when I use Izotope's Ozone 5 VST3 plugin for mastering within Sonar, core #1 is usually spiking, especially with "look ahead" type settings. There are limitations to what may be possible with your audio interface vs. Plugin settings + Windows OS.
Agreed. When the ThreadSchedulingModel parameter is set to 2 for multicore threading, Sonar on its own does a good of spreading the load across all cores. Some other plugins however don't do as well. Ozone for example wasn't coded to take advantage of a multicore processor. I has contacted them back in version 5 and that's the answer they gave me. I have Ozone 7 now and it's similar.
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Kylotan
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/08 05:10:57
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What's your ASIO buffer size? If it's too small, the CPU has to work harder to keep it supplied with data, and that's not work that can be spread across cores.
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jpetersen
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/08 07:12:30
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dlesaux
Ozone for example wasn't coded to take advantage of a multicore processor. I has contacted them back in version 5 and that's the answer they gave me. I have Ozone 7 now and it's similar.
Thanks for the heads-up! I was just about to upgrade to O7. Shall wait for a version where they clearly state it's been addressed.
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Ludus
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/08 07:34:40
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Kylotan
What's your ASIO buffer size? If it's too small, the CPU has to work harder to keep it supplied with data, and that's not work that can be spread across cores.
Buffer size in my case does not seem to be relevant to the core 1 problem.
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gswitz
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/08 08:35:49
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I only have this issue when using Rapture.
StudioCat > I use Windows 10 and Sonar Platinum. I have a touch screen. I make some videos. This one shows how to do a physical loopback on the RME UCX to get many more equalizer nodes.
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Ludus
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/08 08:40:06
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I'll say this, when you're in the heat of mixing and recording it may not see the clear problem. I just tested the crap out of the core 1 problem. frankly I can pile on the plugins with little problem some use a bit more core one then others. I also set up a few soft synths, I only use the ones that come with Splat with not much core movement at all. I ran around 12 tracks of a 4 minuet song using all Pro channels on and set to different settings and didn't get not much core movement. but when there was core action core one is always higher. AD2 is always the problem for me. and for me there are a few Waves plugins that push core 1. Ik plugins worked great. BUT my ik tron and moog crash Splat. none of the CW plugs or soft synths had core problems. I did not check them all or everything just a random test. I guess I want to know how to get AD2 to work without clipping core 1?
post edited by PassiveDrift - 2016/02/08 09:06:43
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Ludus
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/08 08:47:53
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gswitz
I only have this issue when using Rapture.
I tested both the Rapture VST 3 and ? versions that I have that came with Splat with out hardy any core movement but the movement was on core 1. I really don't use soft synths that much so my test is just what I see with no real load.
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jimkleban
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/08 09:04:15
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I do know that in the past I was having performance issues not related to SONAR but having audio glitches. After hours of trying to find a work around for my QUAD CORE multi thread CPU (8 cores), I hypothesized that perhaps the issue wasn't related to SONAR at all but my computer doing basic background stuff not getting enough CPU juice. I looked around and sure enough, there is/was a setting for the MAX cores for SONAR to use. I remember tweaking this number down to 7, 6 and then 5. 6 gave me my lowest latency without audio glitches. Once I changed this parameter in the .INI file (I think that was where this was), my system became stable again. I have since done a rebuild with a 6 core processor and faster clock and no longer need to throttle down the max number of cores available for SONAR. There is no doubt, that the lower I set latency, the more sluggish my DAW becomes. Editing MIDI notes in the PRV becomes painstakingly jittery, etc. So, you would think that the bakers would have some type of dual latency setting available for users to have one LATENCY setting for recording audio and another LATENCY setting for non recording mode? Just a thought, and it was save a ton of time of toggling this back in forth in the audio settings area. This would make for a smart way to set it and forget it to tune your DAW PC depending on the mode automatically, no? Jim
post edited by jimkleban - 2016/02/08 09:18:19
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Jyri T.
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/08 09:45:54
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I, too, have this problem. The worst culprits seem to be the Slate Digital virtual emulation plugins and some DMG Audio ones.
I have tried all the tricks in the book (including those mentioned in this thread) but no solution yet.
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Ludus
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/08 09:57:12
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Jyri T.
I, too, have this problem. The worst culprits seem to be the Slate Digital virtual emulation plugins and some DMG Audio ones.
I have tried all the tricks in the book (including those mentioned in this thread) but no solution yet.
Are you talking about the The Slate Virtual Console Collection? I tested that today on 12 tracks plus on the bus, It worked fine BUT I have the 64 bit upgrade. The upgrade was free but I had to ask Slate for it. I don't know if it's still a free upgrade.
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Ludus
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/08 09:59:49
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Hi Jim, I would like to know the name of the ini file if you think of it. :)
thanks!
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jimkleban
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/08 13:34:54
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Passive Drift,
Sorry, after checking the parm is in the CONFIGURATION file, and it is labeled "MixThreadCount". Default is ZERO which uses all available threads. S0, if you have a QUAD CORE multi thread CPU, you have 8 cores, trying setting this to 7 or 6. You will see the PERFORMANCE window only having the number of CORES based upon this number setting.
What this did for me was give the OS more juice to do its thing... with it set to ZERO, the OS and SONAR were fighting for the same CORE resources. This cleared up the glitches and other issues I was having with my DAW.
I am not sure what this PARM is for but this was a great work around for my DAW a few years ago.
Jim
The Lamb Laid Down on MIDI www.lldom.com Studio Cat Custom i7 with Thunderbolt (wonderful system built and configured by our own Jim R) Apollo Duo (via TB) UAD Quad UAD Duo WIN 8.1 x64 with 32 GB Ram 4 SSD for programs and sample libraries Splat (latest version)
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Ludus
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/08 13:56:24
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jimkleban
Passive Drift,
Sorry, after checking the parm is in the CONFIGURATION file, and it is labeled "MixThreadCount". Default is ZERO which uses all available threads. S0, if you have a QUAD CORE multi thread CPU, you have 8 cores, trying setting this to 7 or 6. You will see the PERFORMANCE window only having the number of CORES based upon this number setting.
What this did for me was give the OS more juice to do its thing... with it set to ZERO, the OS and SONAR were fighting for the same CORE resources. This cleared up the glitches and other issues I was having with my DAW.
I am not sure what this PARM is for but this was a great work around for my DAW a few years ago.
Jim
OK! Now I'm getting someplace! :) "MixThreadCount" to 4 AND I had to set the Enable set threaded ideal processor to False. the cores are spread-out better, I'm going to see if I can tweak this setting but it's grate as it now!! Thanks Jim!
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Kylotan
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/08 14:08:46
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Bear in mind that if you have a Quad Core system that claims to have 8 cores (eg. the Intel i7), then 4 of those cores are not real - they are 4 cores that are each split into 2 virtual cores that use hyperthreading. As such, although this is better than 4 'plain' cores in almost all cases, you shouldn't expect a 2x speedup relative to an old-style 4-core machine. Typically though, you don't need to worry about that, as I'm sure Sonar will be taking this into account. But possibly you have other, CPU-expensive background processes that don't... check Task Manager and look.
There are many reasons why one core is likely to see a lot more CPU use than another, and playing with core parking is just going to move the problem rather than fix it, and potentially make things worse by anchoring certain processes to certain cores even if they would be better off moved.
As I mentioned briefly above, setting audio driver latency too low will result in a lot of CPU usage, primarily on one core. There's not much Sonar can do about that since trying to change that dynamically would probably cause ten times more support problems than it solves. But if that's not your problem, then it's probably plugins.
For the most part, a single plugin will run on one thread, and nothing you can do will change that. So usually all you can do is find the plugins that take up the most CPU time, and try to reduce this. This might include increasing any internal buffers, disabling any unneeded features, switching to 'low quality' where that is available, etc. Sadly I don't think AD2 offers many of these options.
Also, check for 'hidden' plugins like the ProChannel. I'd be very surprised if each instance of the ProChannel didn't run on a different core, but who knows.
Sonar Platinum (Newburyport) / Win 8.1 64bit / Focusrite Scarlett 6i6 / Absynth / Kontakt / Play / Superior Drummer 2 / ESP LTD guitar / etc Twilight's Embrace - gothic/death metal | Other works - instrumental/soundtracks
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Ludus
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/08 14:18:22
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Kylotan
Bear in mind that if you have a Quad Core system that claims to have 8 cores (eg. the Intel i7), then 4 of those cores are not real - they are 4 cores that are each split into 2 virtual cores that use hyperthreading. As such, although this is better than 4 'plain' cores in almost all cases, you shouldn't expect a 2x speedup relative to an old-style 4-core machine. Typically though, you don't need to worry about that, as I'm sure Sonar will be taking this into account. But possibly you have other, CPU-expensive background processes that don't... check Task Manager and look.
There are many reasons why one core is likely to see a lot more CPU use than another, and playing with core parking is just going to move the problem rather than fix it, and potentially make things worse by anchoring certain processes to certain cores even if they would be better off moved.
As I mentioned briefly above, setting audio driver latency too low will result in a lot of CPU usage, primarily on one core. There's not much Sonar can do about that since trying to change that dynamically would probably cause ten times more support problems than it solves. But if that's not your problem, then it's probably plugins.
For the most part, a single plugin will run on one thread, and nothing you can do will change that. So usually all you can do is find the plugins that take up the most CPU time, and try to reduce this. This might include increasing any internal buffers, disabling any unneeded features, switching to 'low quality' where that is available, etc. Sadly I don't think AD2 offers many of these options.
Also, check for 'hidden' plugins like the ProChannel. I'd be very surprised if each instance of the ProChannel didn't run on a different core, but who knows.
I am seeing no core bars hitting the roof or popping on this computer, that's all I cared about. But you gave me a lot to think about moving ahead on this core stuff. Thanks again!
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microapp
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/08 14:22:34
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It is my understanding that all GUI processes (display) run on Core 0. The actual audio processing will be distributed across cores (depending on settings), but no matter what, the GUI processes for Sonar and plugins will run on Core 0. Sonar does a good job of allocating cores on my I7-5820 (6 cores) but Core 0 is always somewhat hotter in the perf monitor. It is hard to tell exactly by how much since I rarely see more than a pixel or two height in the perf monitor bars.
Not sure how accurate the perf monitor is really since if you go to Task Manager | performance, it seems to indicate more usage than perf monitor (from non-Sonar processes ?) and the core usage seems more even.
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auto_da_fe
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/08 14:36:27
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I too have finally seen my core usage on core 1 stop hitting the roof by playing with the "MixThreadCount" AND set the Enable set threaded ideal processor to False (1)
My performance test is always with the jumbo projects (47 track etc.) that Sonar used to ship with upgrades. These always ran a little glitchy, stop and start delays etc. Now they run awesome.
While there may be reasons why this should not work, all I can say is it has worked for me. Hip Hip Hooray !
Thanks !
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jimkleban
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Re: CPU - Core 1 Maxing Out
2016/02/08 16:33:53
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Glad I was able to help (even though I don't know what I am doing). All I know is I wanted to make music on my DAW and even though I had a killer machine, it wasn't performing the way I needed it to.
I started thinking that the OS was doing a lot of stuff in the background to support SONAR audio and apparently I didn't leave enough CPU for the OS to do its thing.
This worked for me and glad to see I was able to share this with some others that it also has worked for.
Jim
The Lamb Laid Down on MIDI www.lldom.com Studio Cat Custom i7 with Thunderbolt (wonderful system built and configured by our own Jim R) Apollo Duo (via TB) UAD Quad UAD Duo WIN 8.1 x64 with 32 GB Ram 4 SSD for programs and sample libraries Splat (latest version)
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