Can't seem to find proper hook up for input...

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Stonecold
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2013/08/07 22:25:42 (permalink)

Can't seem to find proper hook up for input...

Using MC5 LE, with Toshiba laptop, Vista 32, onboard sound Realtech HD Audio, Yamaha E-423 USB keyboard.
 
Can't get software to recognize keyboard .. I've installed Yamaha midi/USB driver WDM, and I've tried go use it but MC5 says the Relatech isn't compatible with WDM, so I've tried MME, but that doesn't work either .. should I uninstall the Yamaha driver? If so, what driver would I use for the keyboard?
 
If possible I'd like to get this to work as is, if not, I'll do whatever I have to, new laptop, with Win 7 or 8, external soundcard/interface, whatever, I like the keyboard so I won't change that.
 
I've used ProTools with MBox in the past, thought I'd try something different, can you help me get this to recognize my Yamaha E-423 and record pure Yamaha? Or do I have to use soft synths?
 
Any help would be appreciated.
 
Also, I'm getting Vocal and Guitar tracks automatically when I try to open an audio track, can I clear these tracks out of track view? HOw?
 
Thanks 
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    Guitarhacker
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    Re: Can't seem to find proper hook up for input... 2013/08/08 08:13:17 (permalink)
    Greetings and welcome.
     
    To get rid of tracks you don't want I think you only have to right click on a blank part of the inspector  part of the track and select DELETE from the drop down. I do this all the time to rid the project of unwanted tracks. Midi or audio, both work the same to delete.
     
    MC5-LE is a stripped down version of MC5. However, I would think it would still recognize the USB inputs.
     
    I'm going to make this next statement based on your comment that ....  "If possible I'd like to get this to work as is, if not, I'll do whatever I have to, new laptop, with Win 7 or 8, external soundcard/interface, whatever, I like the keyboard so I won't change that."
     
    So..... Get the full version on MC6 (touch is most recent) and purchase a nice USB audio/midi musical interface .... M-Audio, Presonus, Focusrite.... , and be sure it can run ASIO drivers right out of the box. Get an interface, not a gimmick box that includes a mixer or a guitar POD integrated with the interface..... straight up solid interface is what you want.  So...for about $300 you get MC6 and a new interface and that should resolve the problems. Plug the keyboard into the interface (5 pin did midi connection) and you are ready to rock.
     
    Using a full version of MC and a solid interface will let you do what you want with ease, and the DAW gear becomes transparent in the recording process..... you can concentrate on the music, not working the gear.
     
    While Cakewalk does have certain minimum computer specs, you should be OK with any modern computer as the basis for your studio. I have an old Dell lappy with a duo core, running Vista, and my main desktop DAW is an i3 quad core running XP/32.  The minimum specs are guidelines so that the DAW runs smoothly and efficiently. I have run some Cake products (many years ago) on a sub-spec machine. It took a little longer to "think" before it did something but the playback and recording was generally smooth as you would want.
     
    Hope this helps
     
    post edited by Guitarhacker - 2013/08/08 08:21:12

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    57Gregy
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    Re: Can't seem to find proper hook up for input... 2013/08/08 09:48:09 (permalink)
    Welcome to the forum.
    The Yamaha USB MIDI input will be listed under 'Audio Devices', I think. Is that what you're selecting?

    Greg 
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    #3
    Stonecold
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    Re: Can't seem to find proper hook up for input... 2013/08/08 13:49:02 (permalink)
    OK thanks for help w/deleting tracks..
     
    Still can't get keyboard to register within track .. keyboard seems to be working with computer alright, but I'm not seeing audio devices in MC5 .. gives me Realtech HI Def spkrs for output and Realtech STereo Mix for input .. no options .. I've used ProTools and MBox before, used to have a set up but some kind soul broke into my storage while I was living on a boat last summer and stole everything I had .. so I thought I'd try something different .. but if I can't get this thing to work I'm a little reluctant to spend for MC6 .. might just be compounding my problems with this laptop. With ProTools, just hook up hardware, install disk, plug in USB kybd and you're off to the races. I don't like these configuration nightmares with computer ... I'm already seriously frustrated with this .. any suggestions would
    be well received, but if I have to purchase something, I think I'll go back to ProTools.
     
    Thanks
    #4
    scook
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    Re: Can't seem to find proper hook up for input... 2013/08/08 14:12:30 (permalink)
    A quick scan of the manual indicates the keyboard only sends MIDI down the USB cable. If that is the case it will not show up as an audio device, only a MIDI device. The only audio available from the keyboard other than the integrated speakers is from the phones/output jack.
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    Guitarhacker
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    Re: Can't seem to find proper hook up for input... 2013/08/08 15:08:25 (permalink)
    Good point....
     
    If you are using the USB output on the keyboard to a USB in on the computer,  it will be listed as a midi device and you would need to find the Yamaha midi device and point it to that track..... then use a softsynth to play the music back
     
    OR
     
    If the keyboard is sending AUDIO from the audio out to the computer, that would be masquerading as the sound card in the list. Point the realtec to an AUDIO track and hit record and play.... you will record the audio not the midi in that case.
     
    No matter what DAW software you use, there is a learning curve...and having the right hardware is critical. You did say that you would buy what you needed to get it working.... correct?

    My website & music: www.herbhartley.com

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    Stonecold
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    Re: Can't seem to find proper hook up for input... 2013/08/10 04:56:06 (permalink)
    Hey Guys,
     
    Thanks for the responses ... yes, I tried to map it to MC5 as a midi device, but no success .. however, I was looking for a registration in the volume indicator in record mode to show it was seeing the keyboard, maybe I need to select a soft synth and then it will see it? I need to spend some more time with it, and what I'd like is good documentation .. I dunno .. with ProTools, I didn't have a problem mapping it and using it as a controller .. ??
     
    Yes, I will purhase a solution, part of the problem is I want to upgrade hardware and OS, before I start throwing money at a sequencer. so I'm treading water a little here. I kinda backed into this MC5 install, thought I'd give it a try, so I'll continue to try to get it working and see what I can do with it..
     
    The keyboard is showing up in my computer, but I'm not sure how I can point it at MC5 as a midi device, seems to me I tried that, but I'll look into it again, MC5 definitely isn't seeing it, its only seeing the output of the Realtech ... I'll see if I can get it working.
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    Guitarhacker
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    Re: Can't seem to find proper hook up for input... 2013/08/10 09:17:04 (permalink)
    If computer see's the keyboard, simply click on the track inspector for a MIDI track. In the input options, the keyboard should be in the list. Select it.
     
    Then yes, you will need a softsynth to get that midi track to play back music.
     
    You go into the AUDIO track and insert the chosen soft synth in the FX bin and select a patch or an instrument sample..... then you select the midi track you want as the input to the synth.....
     
    Path should be.....keyboard> interface/sound card> computer> midi track> audio track
     
    IF you choose the INSERT SYNTH option, all the connections are made for you between the two tracks (midi & audio) and all you do is choose the input (keyboard) from the list and select the patch/sample in the synth GUI.
    post edited by Guitarhacker - 2013/08/10 09:18:28

    My website & music: www.herbhartley.com

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    #8
    Stonecold
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    Re: Can't seem to find proper hook up for input... 2013/08/10 13:36:57 (permalink)
    Thanks Guys for your patience. I seem to have sailed into this about half aware of what I was trying to do ...
    I have full recognition and access to soft synths .. actually pretty simple once you see it. So mission accomplished with this thread. I'm going to post another.. appreciate your feedback. 
    #9
    Stonecold
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    Re: Can't seem to find proper hook up for input... 2013/08/10 14:09:59 (permalink)
    I thought I was through with this, but now have a problem with latency. When I strike the piano key, it takes half a second for the sound to hit my ear, meanwhile I've moved on, so the latency is driving me nuts .. I actually play piano some and there is no way I could record using this .. what am I missing? Is there a way around this, or is this just my red headed stepchild AMD system? I have a sneaking suspicion regarding this ... funny, I know execs at both Intel and AMD, so I thought I'd give an AMD system a try ... I'll never buy another AMD system .. lots of software companies don't have the bucks to spend testing their products against all hardware and they go for the sweet spots in the market, which means Intel. Even Avid doesn't test against AMD, and if you have issues, no support.
     
    Anyway, I would really appreciate your feedback on latency issues since I play keyboard and this is a huge issues to me.
     
    Thanks
    #10
    scook
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    Re: Can't seem to find proper hook up for input... 2013/08/10 14:20:31 (permalink)
    Latency is cause by two things, audio setting and certain plug-ins. I would imagine in this case, the problem is your audio settings. Unfortunately using the built-in sound chip practically guarantees high latency. Getting an interface designed for DAW use is the solution. In the interim you could try ASI04ALL a wrapper for your existing audio driver. It has been reported to improve performance of internal sound chips.
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    Guitarhacker
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    Re: Can't seem to find proper hook up for input... 2013/08/11 09:17:28 (permalink)
    As Scook said, yes....
     
    With a factory card... usually a cheap chip on a motherboard.... latency is high.... half a second is not unusual.
     
    You can experiment with the various driver modes..... MME usually works OK.... you can also try ASIO4ALL to see if it will do any better.... it's basically trying to fool the software and sound chip into working together.....
     
    You can adjust the latency settings and buffers... to see if that helps.....
     
    But the ultimate solution that works best is to purchase a USB external sound card/ musical interface and set it up as the sound card for the studio software. It's what all of us here who record on a regular basis have done.
     
    AMD, I don't believe is the cause of the problems..... get a good interface and I think you will see that to be true. Most music stores allow a 30 or 45 day no questions asked full refund so get an interface and set it up using ASIO drivers and I think you will be pleasantly surprised at the AMD system
     
    As a work around.... try muting the track output so you don't hear the latency and turn the volume up on the keyboard itself and play in sync to the other AUDIO tracks....if they happen to be synth tracks, simply freeze them first turning them into audio tracks (temporarily). Then, freeze the synth and play it back.   The latency is generally only in the synth's ability to process the midi to audio in the sound card's chip in real time. Freezing takes the "real time" aspect away. You can easily unfreeze to edit. See if that works until you get a decent interface.
    post edited by Guitarhacker - 2013/08/11 09:25:05

    My website & music: www.herbhartley.com

    MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW   
    Focusrite Firewire Saffire Interface


    BMI/NSAI

    "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer 
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