SvenArne
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Clicks that actually make it onto the recording!
Hi SONAR forum, long time no see!
I'm having problems today with digital sounding clicks like I'm running out of CPU power. Only this time the clicks are actually printed to the track when recording! The project is a sketch with no plugs running apart from a few ProChannel compressors/EQ, so I got loads of CPU headroom. I've tried different recording chains and going both digital and analog into my BabyFace so it seems the clicks originate within either the interface/driver or SONAR.
I've been a Cakewalk user for more than 20 years so I've had my problems with clicks, but I've never experienced them being recorded before! Any suggestions? I downloaded the update 2017.02 yesterday, is there any use trying to roll back?
Sven
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Rob[at]Sound-Rehab
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Re: Clicks that actually make it onto the recording!
2017/03/09 11:36:31
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Probably no help to you, but I had similar issues in fall with Sonar & MOTU. Back then I contacted both companies: Cakewalk, well actually Noel himself, replied that they would help but they have no MOTU rigs in house, hence cannot follow-up. MOTU eventually provided a much better driver, so the issue has gone here ...
However, since you are now getting something similar with RME, which seems to be Cakewalk's number 1 interface for testing, you should have a fair chance that they can reproduce your issues ...
My suggestion would be to see if you can reproduce that after a reboot and possibly also with a new project. If so, get Cakewalk involved. I wouldn't be surprised if Noel himself gets on the case as something like this is either very deep in the audio engine or in the audio driver (which with RME is let's say a lot less likely than with any opther company).
Afterwards I would try to rollback and give it another try, should be quick. Also, what's the status with win10 updates? Are you current or some months behind?
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The Maillard Reaction
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post edited by Caa2 - 2017/03/11 12:47:50
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jpetersen
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Re: Clicks that actually make it onto the recording!
2017/03/09 18:08:49
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Can you see them in the audio when you zoom all the way in?
Are they gaps, clipping or waveform inversion?
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bitflipper
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Re: Clicks that actually make it onto the recording!
2017/03/09 18:35:38
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It's probably originating in the audio interface. Do you maybe have the clock source set to S/PDIF?
 All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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konradh
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Re: Clicks that actually make it onto the recording!
2017/03/09 19:16:36
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Caa2 mentioned the buffer and that occurred to me. I set my ASIO buffer really low when tracking to avoid latency, and then high when mixing to avoid noises and other issues.
That said, BitFlipper may have the answer for you.
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amiller
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Re: Clicks that actually make it onto the recording!
2017/03/09 19:41:34
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bitflipper
It's probably originating in the audio interface. Do you maybe have the clock source set to S/PDIF?
Yep, been there, done that. 
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tlw
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Re: Clicks that actually make it onto the recording!
2017/03/09 21:08:08
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I've always found that clicks and pops related to the audio buffer not being large enough generally end up recorded. And not just with Sonar but other DAWs as well.
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SvenArne
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Re: Clicks that actually make it onto the recording!
2017/03/09 22:37:34
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Thanks for your replies guys!! Rob[atSound-Rehab]
[...] My suggestion would be to see if you can reproduce that after a reboot and possibly also with a new project. If so, get Cakewalk involved.
I've tried different project files now and it's reproducible as in this is the state of my DAW at this point (cannot reliably do a take more than 20 seconds long with out getting a click)..!
Also, what's the status with win10 updates?
Current! Caa2
The only times I have had digital interrupts in my recording I found that using a larger sample buffer worked ok.
ASIO buffer size doesn't seem to matter! jpetersen
Can you see them in the audio when you zoom all the way in?
Are they gaps, clipping or waveform inversion?
Square clipping! bitflipper
It's probably originating in the audio interface. Do you maybe have the clock source set to S/PDIF?
Yeah, sync error is pretty much what it sounds like, but the issue arose while recording analog into the BabyFace using the interface clock. I then tried recording through my Audient (connected and clocked via S/P-DIF) but the result is the same! tlw
I've always found that clicks and pops related to the audio buffer not being large enough generally end up recorded. And not just with Sonar but other DAWs as well.
Sorry, but this is not my experience! I've never expected CPU/bus-related hiccups to end up on the audio file. Sven
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SvenArne
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Re: Clicks that actually make it onto the recording!
2017/03/09 22:57:40
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Thank's for the replies guys!!
I made big a post quoting and replying to each and one of you, but it disappeared after editing... So I'm boiling it down since I'm typing on my iPad now...
-I'm on current Win 10 and the issue is persistent across projects, even running an empty project with only one track.
-The waveform shows square clipping
-ASIO buffer size makes no difference, but in my experience such buffer related clicks never get printed to file anyway!
-Sync error is pretty much what it sounds like, but the problem arose while recording analog into my interface using the internal clock. I later tried recording through my Audient (connected and clocked via S/P-DIF) but that made no difference...
I think I will try updating the RME driver tomorrow, haven't done that ina while...
Sven
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jpetersen
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Re: Clicks that actually make it onto the recording!
2017/03/09 23:26:58
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SvenArne
-The waveform shows square clipping
So it's in the audio waveform. Were you aware of hitting the limit whilst recording? Buffer adjustment will fix gapping, but not clipping.
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SvenArne
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Re: Clicks that actually make it onto the recording!
2017/03/09 23:43:09
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Definitely way below 0 dBFS. The clicks are not amplitude related. Unless I misunderstood your reply?
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bitflipper
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Re: Clicks that actually make it onto the recording!
2017/03/10 00:08:31
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Take a close look at the waveforms and describe the visual appearance of the clicks. That may provide a clue as to their source. Clocking issues will show up as narrow spikes, dropouts or sudden level changes. Overdriving the ADC may present itself as waveform peaks abruptly going to the opposite polarity. Both can sound the same. The latter is different than overdriving the interface's preamps, which won't result in clicks. The third possibility is buffer overruns due to too-small input buffers. That'll result in pretty obvious dropouts that last a millisecond or two. I guess a fourth (distant) possibility is a broken interface.
All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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Unknowen
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Re: Clicks that actually make it onto the recording!
2017/03/10 02:23:10
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Its a long forgotten option ;) a few weeks ago, and you didn't say what Win ver. you are using but a win 10 update had many reinstalling audio drivers. Also if you're on a laptop you will need to Re Deactivate your onboard sound card.
*If you uninstall the onboard audio, reboot will reinstall them.
Peace!
Hay look, Somethings are not locked in stone... lol 3/18/2019
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