Clock/Jitter Question

So I'm reading through the latest Tape Op and I see this ad by Bob Ludwig for the Apogee Big Ben. The ad (supposedly quoting Bob) says "The Big Ben makes an audible improvement in even the most high-end recording/mastering chain and it can make a tremendous improvement in otherwise mediocre gear." Earlier in the magazine there's an interview with Lucas van der Mee (w/ Apogee) where he states "Some of the audible results of jitter are a flatter soundstage, a certain fuzziness in the top end and a less pronounced center".

This got me thinking. Could it be that a lot of the differences in quality between different systems is NOT:

* Sonar vs. any other program
* Minor sample rate differences (i.e. 88.2 vs. 96k)
* Dither pattern

...but rather may be due to a less-than-predictable clock source inside of the traditional Intel/AMD-based PC? On this same line of thinking, is there any information about the specifics of how the timing works in Sonar? Right now my timing masters are the Layla analog 1-2 channels, but is it reasonable to think that an external clock would really have that significant of a difference?

Of course the reason why I'm asking is that while my DAW is a monster of a box, I do feel like the soundstage could be bigger and individual pan positions could be better pronounced. Couple this with the raging "Mac vs. PC" debate and, well, I figure it's worth polling the experts here.

As a secondary question, who here is using an external clock and are you pleased with the results?

I didn't know about that analyzer. I've downloaded it and will be checking it out later. Thanks Mike!

ORIGINAL: danhazer

... I have yet to hear a converter or clock that causes there to be a clear 'night and day' type difference.

Thanks,
Dan

The "night and day" story I remember hearing is on the old Mackie Digital 8 mixing console. The users report that adding the clock card and using an external clock makes a very noticeable difference even to a non-audiophile person. It may depend on how bad the existing one is.

The other issue is how many devices you are trying to get working from the same clock. If it's more then two an external clock can make the system more stable and sound better. The other cool thing about an external clock is that you can power on and off any device without bringing the entire system down. As long as your master clock is going all the other deivces will keep passing audio.

Also, some newer devices have clock signal "repair" technology built in and in this case adding an external clock to them may not make a difference unless you can turn off the repair process. Digital audio (and video for that matter) interfaces are dicy. There are more things that can go wrong then with analog and the worst of it is that there is no good way to verify how good your connection is. All digital audio interfaces are single direction and non error checking so you have no way of knowing if you have a problem or not till it gets bad enough to hear it.

ORIGINAL: TheFingers

All digital audio interfaces are single direction and non error checking so you have no way of knowing if you have a problem or not till it gets bad enough to hear it.

Maybe I'm just misunderstanding what you're saying: have you checked out RME Steady-Clock technology? I thought you had a FF800. Maybe look here:

http://www.rme-audio.com/english/techinfo/steadyclock.htm

I'm not taking about firewire, that's not an audio only interface, it's a computer interface. I'm talking about "digital audio" interfaces like SPDIF, TDIFF, ADAT, AES/EBU, Toslink, MADI, etc. They are all single direction and non error checking. The bits go down the line and you just have to trust (hope) they all get there.

The Fireface 800 (if you use it's analog inputs and outputs) keep all that inside the box so you don't have to go out over "digital audio" interfaces. And the connections to the computer is bi-directional and error checking (somewhat). It's not the same as having more then one digital device like a digital mixer, hard disk reocrder, sound card, etc. that all have to work off the same clock and trade audio over "digial audio" lines. That is where the clock can do some good. The RME is a all in one deivce that has it's own clock.

Again some of the new clock signal repair technology like Steady-Clock or S-Lock in the Grace m902 headphone amp throws the external clock thing into question if you can't turn it off. It's going to try to "fix" a clock signal that should already very good unless you have a bad word clock cable. Who knows what you end up with after that ?