Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask

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Katie_Katie
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2011/04/02 08:16:24 (permalink)

Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask

Ya gotta love the some of the sound bites from the news sometimes.
 
CNN reported a Southwest flight where the cabin developed a rupture about 1 foot wide and 3 to 4 feet long.  So, the pax could see straight to the sky. 
A full on decompression resulted, ox masks were deployed.  No doubt a terrifying experience.
 
Luckily, all aboard are fine.   The plane diverted and landed at a military field.
 
So, here is the quote from the FAA.
 
"We do not know the cause of the decompression"
 
 
So, I'm thinking....although I'm not an aeronautical engineer, my first guess would be the 3 foot hole in the cabin is a likely candidate....duh.
 
Maybe he could have stated that just a bit differently.

Katherine  

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    Jonbouy
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/02 08:20:51 (permalink)
    A bit like...

    "We have lost one engine, but relax, there is enough power in the remaining one to take us to the scene of the crash".

    "We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles.
    In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
    #2
    trimph1
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/02 08:35:56 (permalink)
    MMMM..methinks the PR guy needs a bit of a hand there...

    The space you have will always be exceeded in direct proportion to the amount of stuff you have...Thornton's Postulate.

    Bushpianos
    #3
    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/02 08:42:56 (permalink)

    "a Southwest flight where the cabin developed a rupture about 1 foot wide and 3 to 4 feet long."

    It was the fat guy's fault.


    #4
    bapu
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/02 12:49:20 (permalink)
    mike_mccue


    "a Southwest flight where the cabin developed a rupture about 1 foot wide and 3 to 4 feet long."

    "It was bapu's fault.  He's a Stupid Face." ~Mooch


    #5
    UbiquitousBubba
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 09:10:18 (permalink)
    I wasn't even on the plane.  I'm thinking the flight crew served Strammy's favorite vindaloo and there was an inevitable build up of a gas pocket.  Most likely, that hole in the ceiling was the only thing that saved the passengers.
    #6
    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 09:11:47 (permalink)
    ROFL


    #7
    Tap
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 11:47:44 (permalink)
    Mike ..... I think ROFL maybe the cause for the rupture in the cabin.

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    #8
    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 11:59:09 (permalink)
    Well, I am rather over sized. :-)


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    MNorman
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 13:31:35 (permalink)
    Actually, will be interesting to see where the cause of the decompression (and many aero engineers would equate the event with the root cause of the event) lies.  Keeping aging aircraft safe to fly is on a lot of folk's plates right now - lots of people make their entire careers out of it.  Hopefully, the inevitable finger pointing will give way to actionable lessons.  Southwest has been fined recently for not performing fatigue inspections on their planes.  On the other hand, with the exception of that 5x1 foot hole, the aircraft held together nicely, and injuries were liimited to one (a flight attendant with minor injuries).
    #10
    MNorman
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 13:34:32 (permalink)
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    bapu
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 13:34:53 (permalink)
    MNorman


    their planes.  On the other hand, with the exception of that 5x1 foot hole, the aircraft held together nicely, and injuries were liimited to one (a flight attendant with minor injuries).

    Great!


    Not everyone got their peanuts then?


    #12
    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 13:35:18 (permalink)
    I thought about materials fatigue being a factor but at 15 years age that particular plane seems relatively new.

    I'm imagining dwindling budgets for thorough inspection is related to the fact that the first notice of the *problem* was the incident.

    best regards,
    mike
     


    #13
    MNorman
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 13:36:34 (permalink)
    You haven't flown in a while, have you?  :-)
    #14
    bapu
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 13:38:36 (permalink)
    MNorman


    You haven't flown in a while, have you?  :-)

    Not sure if you meant me.


    FWIW, I flew Southwest just this past February. I got lots and lots of peanuts on that flight. *


    *for free



    post edited by bapu - 2011/04/04 13:41:37
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    MNorman
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 13:38:45 (permalink)
    Well, am not privy to this particular incident, but water intrusion, corrosion, and metal fatigue are issues that typically aren't just limited to 20+ year old aircraft...
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    Beagle
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 13:39:42 (permalink)
    bapu


    MNorman


    their planes.  On the other hand, with the exception of that 5x1 foot hole, the aircraft held together nicely, and injuries were liimited to one (a flight attendant with minor injuries).

    Great!


    Not everyone got their peanuts then?


    When's the last time you flew?  you don't get peanuts anymore!  least not unless you pay for them!

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    #17
    MNorman
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 13:39:53 (permalink)
    They must have recognized you.
    #18
    bapu
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 13:40:58 (permalink)
    Beagle


    bapu


    MNorman


    their planes.  On the other hand, with the exception of that 5x1 foot hole, the aircraft held together nicely, and injuries were liimited to one (a flight attendant with minor injuries).

    Great!


    Not everyone got their peanuts then?


    When's the last time you flew?  you don't get peanuts anymore!  least not unless you pay for them!

    Answered.
    #19
    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 13:41:17 (permalink)

    "You haven't flown in a while, have you?  :-)"



    2 weeks ago... but I really dislike commercial flying.

    I can see that you've already spotted me as a Kapton conspiracy theorist. :-)

    I grew up in Miami where a lot of my dad's buddies were old Eastern guys.

    One of my school friend's dad is long retired but still consults to FAA for engineering forensics.



    My dad owned a 1946 7AC that he personally kept in better than new condition.

    The old timers used to come out and drool when he'd land on their grass strips for a glass of ice tea.


    :-)



    post edited by mike_mccue - 2011/04/04 13:43:57


    #20
    bapu
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 13:42:56 (permalink)
    mike_mccue



    "You haven't flown in a while, have you?  :-)"



    2 weeks ago... but I really dislike commercial flying.

    I can see that you've already spotted me as a Kaptan conspiracy theorist. :-)

    I grew up in Miami where a lot of my dad's buddies were old Eastern guys.

    One of my school friend's dad is long retired but still consults to FAA for engineering forensics.



    My dad owned a 1946 7AC that he personally kept in better than new condition.

    The old timers used to come out and drool when he'd land on their grass strips for a glass of ice tea.


    :-)

    So you got peanuts then?


    #21
    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 13:45:05 (permalink)
    I did, 2 bags in fact.

    Both made of freshly squeezed alminumized polyester.



    I think.


    #22
    Beagle
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 13:51:11 (permalink)
    Southwest is still giving away FREE peanuts????

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    MNorman
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 13:53:30 (permalink)
    Nah, Mike, that was a poke jab comment directed at the Lord of A(m).  But, the fact that there are lots of 40's and 50's vintage aircraft actively flying out there, says the cycle of fatigue inspections and repair can be done safely. 
    #24
    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 13:57:17 (permalink)
    I was/am perfectly willing to defer to your expertise on this subject but yes, it was my impression that the 15 year 737 in question isn't very old when compared to the "fleet".

    I'm glad to think I wasn't too mistaken.

    all the best,
    mike


    #25
    Katie_Katie
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 14:15:39 (permalink)
    MNorman

    ... But, the fact that there are lots of 40's and 50's vintage aircraft actively flying out there, says the cycle of fatigue inspections and repair can be done safely. 


    With one notable exception - pressurization.  The 40' and 50's vintage aircraft do not suffer the fatigue caused by pressurization cycling.   For instance, the venerable DC-3.  Still out there, in service, with paying pax every day.  But, no pressurization.  It is another reason the B-52 will be flying well into this century.  Although it does have a small pressurized area, the majority is not.  Most modern commercial aircraft go through 6 or more cycles per day, some even more.  Things wear out, rivets stretch, seal leaks happen. 

    Katherine  

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    MNorman
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 14:27:32 (permalink)
    Nope, you're absolutely right, it isn't.  In 2006, the average age of a commercial aircraft was a little over 12 years:

     http://www.bts.gov/publications/transportation_statistics_annual_report/2008/html/chapter_03/table_03_01_01.html

    Many are well over 20, and many military aircraft expected to fly over 40:

    http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_average_life_expectancy_for_a_commercial_Aircraft

    As the above addresses, it isn't just age, but numbers of bending cycles (for the fuselage, pressurizations, for the landing gear, landings, etc).  Corrosion also can play a role, as can inappropriate fasteners (as in the Titanic), maintenance errors, etc. 

    But, consider that in 2009, the fatal accident rate for U.S. Scheduled Airline flilghts was about 1 per 17 million flight hours (50 deaths):

    http://www3.ntsb.gov/aviation/Table1.htm

    In terms of driving safety, this is the equivalent of driving over 540 years (25K miles per year, avg 40 mph = 625 hr/year) without a fatality.  When someone says flying is safer than driving, it's a pretty large understatement...
    post edited by MNorman - 2011/04/04 14:30:30
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    Jonbouy
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 14:31:17 (permalink)
    Flying is perfectly safe.

    It's hitting the ground that does most damage.

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    In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
    #28
    Katie_Katie
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 14:37:24 (permalink)
    Jonbouy


    Flying is perfectly safe.

    It's hitting the ground that does most damage.
     
     
    The difference between a crash and a landing is perspective.  For a crash you require injuries or property damage (other than your plane) or, most importantly, witnesses.
     
    If you have non of the above, no matter how bad,  it is a landing.  And that is how you fill out the NASA form.  

    Katherine  

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    MNorman
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    Re:Coffe, Tea or Ox Mask 2011/04/04 14:38:13 (permalink)
    Ahh, you've seen a carrier landing than...
    #30
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