Helpful Reply"Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product

Page: 123 > Showing page 1 of 3
Author
AdamGrossmanLG
Max Output Level: -62 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1436
  • Joined: 2014/07/13 03:40:34
  • Status: offline
2016/06/04 14:49:56 (permalink)

"Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product

so now that Cakewalk is "Committed To Awesomeness", I thought maybe we can add our ideas here for parts of the product that are just cumbersome and archaic.
 
Hopefully the bakers will see this thread.

I will start the list off with:
 
1.  ACT
2.  Drum Maps
 
#1
jfcomposer
Max Output Level: -90 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 29
  • Joined: 2015/01/27 15:55:04
  • Location: Nashville
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/04 14:55:54 (permalink)
3.  Staff view.  
#2
AdamGrossmanLG
Max Output Level: -62 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1436
  • Joined: 2014/07/13 03:40:34
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/04 14:59:35 (permalink)
jfcomposer
3.  Staff view.  




yup - another good one.
#3
bz2838
Max Output Level: -83 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 366
  • Joined: 2010/10/16 14:44:50
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/04 15:01:02 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby SilverBlueMedallion 2016/06/04 15:19:42
4. Chord Track
 

Purrrfect Audio:  Intel i7 7700k (Kabylake), 32Gig DDR4/2133, Windows 10x64 Pro, USB RME Babyface, Sonar Platinum Current
#4
AdamGrossmanLG
Max Output Level: -62 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1436
  • Joined: 2014/07/13 03:40:34
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/04 15:02:49 (permalink)
bz2838
4. Chord Track
 




yes - i would love to have a chord track... and maybe it can 'auto-detect' the chords either from audio or midi.
#5
msorrels
Max Output Level: -70 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1025
  • Joined: 2003/11/08 02:04:59
  • Location: Pittsburgh, PA
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/04 16:35:25 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby SilverBlueMedallion 2016/06/04 18:41:06
Plugin manager
 
It really falls down handling the 2036 plugins Cakewalk thinks I have, since I install 32/64/vst2/vst3 of everything for flexibility.  That constant reloading of everything when you just open the properties on a plugin makes it so painful to use it isn't funny.  Not to mention the extreme load times switching between the categories.  The UI is also very unproductive with it's bizarre excluded UI handling options and of course the whole menu editor is painfully unusable.
 

-Matt
 
#6
Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
Cakewalk Staff
  • Total Posts : 6475
  • Joined: 2003/11/03 17:22:50
  • Location: Boston, MA, USA
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/04 18:27:58 (permalink)
I'm curious what tasks you perform in plugin manager and why it's important to you. It's a tool that one normally only uses to create new layouts.
post edited by Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk] - 2016/06/04 19:06:45

Noel Borthwick
Senior Manager Audio Core, BandLab
My Blog, Twitter, BandLab Profile
#7
AdamGrossmanLG
Max Output Level: -62 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1436
  • Joined: 2014/07/13 03:40:34
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/04 18:37:45 (permalink)
Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
I'm curious what tasks you perform in plugin manager and why it's important to you. It's a tool that one normally only uses to create new layouts. 
 




Well for me anyway, I don't perform much "tasks" but it does take a long time to load the list of plugins.  
#8
CSW
Max Output Level: -87 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 156
  • Joined: 2015/02/14 11:03:26
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/04 18:43:47 (permalink)
msorrels
Plugin manager
 
It really falls down handling the 2036 plugins Cakewalk thinks I have, since I install 32/64/vst2/vst3 of everything for flexibility.  That constant reloading of everything when you just open the properties on a plugin makes it so painful to use it isn't funny.  Not to mention the extreme load times switching between the categories.  The UI is also very unproductive with it's bizarre excluded UI handling options and of course the whole menu editor is painfully unusable.
 


IMO the Sonar plugin manager is one of the best out there.   There are some minor interface ergonomic issues but it's really versatile. Little tweeks to the interface would be good. 
#9
CSW
Max Output Level: -87 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 156
  • Joined: 2015/02/14 11:03:26
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/04 18:45:07 (permalink)
Drop down menus while selecting or creating tracks, sends , buses and routing stuff to include middle mouse button scrolling would be nice.
 
#10
CSW
Max Output Level: -87 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 156
  • Joined: 2015/02/14 11:03:26
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/04 18:46:15 (permalink)
To be able to delete a send in 2 clicks without having to go into the drop down and select delete would be great
 
#11
AdamGrossmanLG
Max Output Level: -62 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1436
  • Joined: 2014/07/13 03:40:34
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/04 18:48:46 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby msorrels 2016/06/04 21:51:04
To be able to rename the VSTs and have them stick would be nice
#12
Sanderxpander
Max Output Level: -36.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3873
  • Joined: 2013/09/30 10:08:24
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/04 19:24:46 (permalink)
To have a cascaded sends destination menu would be great. Like, hardware outputs, buses, sidechain inputs, aux tracks, patchpoints. After having inserted a bunch of buses and sc capable plugs it gets pretty cumbersome to scroll to select what I need. Even just my 18 outputs interface (and then mono and stereo) makes a sizable list.
#13
John T
Max Output Level: -7.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 6783
  • Joined: 2006/06/12 10:24:39
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/04 19:33:49 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby SilverBlueMedallion 2016/06/04 20:02:33
Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
I'm curious what tasks you perform in plugin manager and why it's important to you. It's a tool that one normally only uses to create new layouts.


Something I think would really improve this, would be an automatically populated "new" category in custom layouts. So when installing a new plugin, it by default appears in "new" in the insert plugin right click menu, until you chose to manually put it somewhere.
 
Another obvious improvement would be saving an updated layout. At the moment, you go in, add your new plugin to your layout, press the save button, get a "this file already exists, replace y/n" menu and so on. This could all be made a lot snappier and use far fewer clicks.

http://johntatlockaudio.com/
Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
#14
promidi
Max Output Level: -66 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1220
  • Joined: 2014/11/21 18:46:39
  • Location: South Australia
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/04 19:37:45 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby SilverBlueMedallion 2016/06/04 20:02:47
My three bucks worth:

1) MIDI sends (No I don't want to use Hubi's Loopback MIDI Driver)
2) A decent routing diagram.
3) Better multiple controller handling in PRV (no - don't tell me to use automation - CC's can be more flexible)
4) Horizontally scalable automation curves
5) Automation curves clips

Ok, that's five bucks

Windows 10 64bit fully patched, 16 gig ram . 
PCR-800 Controller.  (Working in Win 10 1809 64bit)
CPU: i5 4670. 
Video: Nvidia GTX560ti (latest drivers).
Audio IF: Focusrite 2i2 2nd Gen

Internet always on.

Software
: Cakewalk by Bandlab (2018.09 B29)
ASIO mode. 24bit 48khz 256 samples 
Rapture Pro, AAS GS2, VS-3, EP-4, VA-2, Chromophone 2, Z3TA+ 2, Addictive drums 2, Addictive Keys, Mpowersynth (latest), Iris 2, GPO5, Sampletank 3,
#15
abacab
Max Output Level: -30.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 4464
  • Joined: 2014/12/31 19:34:07
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/04 20:06:48 (permalink)
promidi
My three bucks worth:
2) A decent routing diagram.
Ok, that's five bucks




OK, I vote +1 for a routing diagram :-)

DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ... 
#16
msorrels
Max Output Level: -70 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1025
  • Joined: 2003/11/08 02:04:59
  • Location: Pittsburgh, PA
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/04 21:32:05 (permalink)
Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
I'm curious what tasks you perform in plugin manager and why it's important to you. It's a tool that one normally only uses to create new layouts.




If you had 2000+ plugins you'd be running the manager a lot more often too.  Seriously though, a great number of plugins have issues with VST3, which require disabling the VST3 version.  It's also fairly common for updates to have issues and require figuring out why a plugin isn't showing up inside Sonar - while the plugin manager is weak it's still faster than regedit.  I also have to rename a number of NI plugins since there is no way to tell which version is which with some of the Kontakt plugins.  Sonar loves to lose the renames so I end up with 3 copies of Kontakt 5 instead of the more detailed name with the number of output channels.
 
The layout controls I would use all the time if they scaled up to handle the number of plugins I have. I bought the MenuMagic app to try and help, but it's not really up to handling that many plugins either.
 
Recent releases of Sonar have also begun doing a crazy enumerating all my plugin registry entries the first time I right click on a audio or MIDI clip.  At first I thought Sonar was hung, eventually it finishes walking the entire registry and brings up the right click menu.  Only does it the first time after Sonar is started.  I think this "feature" was added around January.  Not sure it's 100% related to the Plugin Manager but it is really annoying.  Only figured out it was plugin scanning because I ran Sysinternals Procmon and watched it enumerate every single plugin on the first right click on a clip.
 
I still have DX 32-bit plugins (using a 32-64 wrapper) that I bought in the 90's installed and working.  I pretty much refuse to give up any software lightly.  I get the impression no one at Cakewalk has ever used Sonar with more than a few dozen plugins.
 


-Matt
 
#17
Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
Cakewalk Staff
  • Total Posts : 6475
  • Joined: 2003/11/03 17:22:50
  • Location: Boston, MA, USA
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/04 23:32:26 (permalink)
Thanks for the update. We'll look into your reports.
 
FYI: We have about 4000 plugins installed on our test machine. I have close to 1400 plugins on my work machine (with waves plugins installed)
post edited by Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk] - 2016/06/05 00:05:41

Noel Borthwick
Senior Manager Audio Core, BandLab
My Blog, Twitter, BandLab Profile
#18
promidi
Max Output Level: -66 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1220
  • Joined: 2014/11/21 18:46:39
  • Location: South Australia
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/05 03:08:05 (permalink)
Oh, I just thought of another one (The plugin manager discussion reminded me)

Is it possible for the "add track" button to have an option to use the synth plugin layout as defined by the plugin manager rather than list plugin by manufacturer?  It must be bedlam for you guys who have 2549 plugins to try find the one your after using the "add track" button in it current format.

Windows 10 64bit fully patched, 16 gig ram . 
PCR-800 Controller.  (Working in Win 10 1809 64bit)
CPU: i5 4670. 
Video: Nvidia GTX560ti (latest drivers).
Audio IF: Focusrite 2i2 2nd Gen

Internet always on.

Software
: Cakewalk by Bandlab (2018.09 B29)
ASIO mode. 24bit 48khz 256 samples 
Rapture Pro, AAS GS2, VS-3, EP-4, VA-2, Chromophone 2, Z3TA+ 2, Addictive drums 2, Addictive Keys, Mpowersynth (latest), Iris 2, GPO5, Sampletank 3,
#19
msorrels
Max Output Level: -70 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1025
  • Joined: 2003/11/08 02:04:59
  • Location: Pittsburgh, PA
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/05 04:59:19 (permalink)
You can't really use the add track button with that many plugins really.  I just use the Plugin Browser window.  Its filter search is quick and easy. 
 
Other places in Sonar with a popup menu listing plugins are also equally worthless.  The Plus button in the Synth panel has a greyed out list of instruments (which seems to be related to the number of plugins at least for me, see this post for details and even steps to reproduce it http://forum.cakewalk.com/FindPost/3365094 ).  Oddly enough the Insert->Soft Synth menu item does work but the popup menu it generates is epic and unusable.
 
The original post wasn't about bugs though, but rather areas of Sonar that are long in the tooth.  I'd argue that the Cal language also needs to be either brought up to snuff or a more modern and complete scripting language, like Lua, added.  There are so many things I'd love to be able to do in Sonar that I can't without a better scripting system.

-Matt
 
#20
taccess
Max Output Level: -80 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 534
  • Joined: 2015/01/11 19:14:36
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/05 05:41:23 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby SilverBlueMedallion 2016/06/05 11:46:10
My quick 4 bob
A) Add track + in track view to allow custom plugin list
B) synth rack to follow track names and track numbers
C) some type of global routing map of sends
D) event list - the ability to ctrl select two events then edit one event and it changes both events to the same edit .

Thanks cakewalk

z800 Dual x5690
NvME 256gb 950Pro / Win10
LSI  MegaRaid
Nvidia 450 GTS
96GB 1366MHZ
RME Babyface
#21
John T
Max Output Level: -7.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 6783
  • Joined: 2006/06/12 10:24:39
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/05 07:16:25 (permalink)
For what it's worth, the problem Msorrels is having sounds familiar, and I don't think it's got anything to do with the number of plugins.
 
I got very similar behaviour a while back from a messed up install of some Waves plugins, and I remember discussing it on the forum, and somebody else saying they'd had the same problem and giving the solution.
 
Sorry, can't remember the exact details.

http://johntatlockaudio.com/
Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
#22
dlesaux
Max Output Level: -70 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1034
  • Joined: 2009/09/13 09:25:18
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/05 07:18:20 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby SilverBlueMedallion 2016/06/05 11:46:19
The Drum Map manger needs a more simplified and intuitive workflow. Perhaps Cakewalk could collaborate with other manufacturers to have them ready to load? I have multiple ezDrummer kits but hate having to create a new drum map to make them useable in Sonar.

Peace!
Daniel

Sonar Platinum - 2017.10 and PreSonus Studio One 3.5.5
Windows 10 64 bit
Studiocat Skylake Desktop PC with Intel i7 6700k processor @ 4.20 GHz / 16G RAM 
Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 Audio Interface and Cakewalk UM-2G Midi Interface

Check out my website
#23
dcumpian
Max Output Level: -34 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 4124
  • Joined: 2005/11/03 15:50:51
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/05 07:18:50 (permalink)
Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
I'm curious what tasks you perform in plugin manager and why it's important to you. It's a tool that one normally only uses to create new layouts.




Primarily, that's exactly what I use it for. Unfortunately, it is very difficult to know which plugins are in a layout with the current design. It would really help if, when a layout is loaded in Plugin Manager, that missing plugins were colored or somehow identified (maybe even something as simple as a filter).
 
I do understand you want to move away from custom layouts to using the browser, but a good layout makes finding relevant plugins easy. Also, all of the "add FX" menus still use the layout paradigm.
 
Regards,
Dan

Mixing is all about control.
 
My music:
http://dancumpian.bandcamp.com/ or https://soundcloud.com/dcumpian Studiocat Advanced Studio DAW (Intel i5 3550 @ 3.7GHz, Z77 motherboard, 16GB Ram, lots of HDDs), Sonar Plat, Mackie 1604, PreSonus Audiobox 44VSL, ESI 4x4 Midi Interface, Ibanez Bass, Custom Fender Mexi-Strat, NI S88, Roland JV-2080 & MDB-1, Komplete, Omnisphere, Lots o' plugins.    
#24
scottfa
Max Output Level: -81 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 453
  • Joined: 2005/04/23 06:25:47
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/05 10:12:59 (permalink)
ACT
Drum Maps
Reorganization of menus. Ex. Insert measures  is in the Project menu, not the Insert menu....
 
I actually went for the lifetime updates figuring that Cakewalk HAS to improve a lot of issues like  ACT, Notation etc if it hopes to compete in the Mac world. They have to be better than the competition to get sales in that environment.

Intel I7 2600K (OCed to 4.0)
Gigabyte Ga-Z68X-UD3H-B3
16G Corsair 1600  Memory 4 sticks
1 SSD, 1WD 650 SATA and 1 Samsung 1G SATA    
Steinberg MR816X 
Mackie R800 Adat to the Steinberg
Windows 10 64 bit     
Sonar Platinum Lifetime
UAD-2  Solo
#25
Sanderxpander
Max Output Level: -36.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3873
  • Joined: 2013/09/30 10:08:24
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/05 10:33:25 (permalink)
Non-destructive midi quantization (a la Logic), including quantize strength. Better midi over dubbing (automatic clip merge as an option).

A way to easily map a sample to a trigger note/step sequencer (a la FruityLoops or Live's Simpler), drag and drop from an audio track or the browser would be great. I do have Battery and obviously there's Session Drummer but it makes for a somewhat cumbersome workflow compared to those other examples.

An easier way to access external samples in Drum Replacer.

AudioSnap placing transient markers at the correct spot at least 95 percent of the time.
#26
scook
Forum Host
  • Total Posts : 24146
  • Joined: 2005/07/27 13:43:57
  • Location: TX
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/05 10:40:14 (permalink)
Why not include everything else mentioned here? While they are at it fix all the bugs (real and perceived) too. I fail to see the point of this thread but if it makes some one happy, fine by me.
#27
pwalpwal
Max Output Level: -43 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3249
  • Joined: 2015/01/17 03:52:50
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/05 11:00:36 (permalink)
scook
Why not include everything else mentioned here? While they are at it fix all the bugs (real and perceived) too. I fail to see the point of this thread but if it makes some one happy, fine by me.
well, it would be awesome if they clarif d that commitment somehow, but it's hardly unexpected, the most tangible part of the huge announcement was the Mac alpha... Go figure!

just a sec

#28
pwalpwal
Max Output Level: -43 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 3249
  • Joined: 2015/01/17 03:52:50
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/05 11:03:12 (permalink)
Actually, an updated eula should clarify all these ridiculous questions!

just a sec

#29
scook
Forum Host
  • Total Posts : 24146
  • Joined: 2005/07/27 13:43:57
  • Location: TX
  • Status: offline
Re: "Commitment to Awesomeness" - Upgrading/Replacing Archaic Parts Of The Product 2016/06/05 11:05:45 (permalink)
pwalpwal
Actually, an updated eula should clarify all these ridiculous questions!

I can agree with part of that statement
#30
Page: 123 > Showing page 1 of 3
Jump to:
© 2025 APG vNext Commercial Version 5.1