Studioguy1
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Re: Comparing DAW's
2018/12/14 04:10:01
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There is irony in the above comparison for many reasons, but the main one for me is that having tried Samplitude, I found it to be kludgy, no user friendly and the sound was not anything to write home about to my ears. That is my take on the subject. I can think of several much better than Samplitude, but to my experience, Cakewalk handles my projects methodically, accurately and they sound damn good. nuff said.
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Soundwise
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Re: Comparing DAW's
2018/12/14 15:54:50
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bitflipper
Sorry, not buyin' it. The test is flawed. The three mixes are obviously not volume-matched (which you can confirm by the spectral displays), which is why the nulled version sounds like a quiet version of the original mix.
They are! Not in scientific manner, rather in an ordinary usage manner, i.e., the way most users would do it. That's why the guy says that he used stock settings and matched only levels, pan positions and plugin settings. We can speculate in the subject, saying "if you match pan laws..." or "if you change these settings...", or "if you rewrite code...", or "if you substitute developers..." and so on, but the reality is, if you take any DAW as it is and start recording/producing/mixing and during the process you decide to try another DAW because of its better UX, you won't care too much about matching all those minor adjustments, but will try to reach the desired quality level within your new DAW. On the other hand nobody really cares if any two DAWs sound the same or have some difference, because if there is a difference, it is not significant and can be safely ignored. It's the music that matters the most, not the tools.
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Jeff Evans
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Re: Comparing DAW's
2018/12/15 04:19:28
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☄ Helpfulby galeom 2018/12/15 12:26:40
I have explained this before but will again. While working for Roland back in 2007 or so selling the V Studio they provided with an amazing multi track recording session. (done on a completely different system.) The tracks are so pristine without a single plugin in sight you can get a fantastic sounding mix. This is master class in mic placement. The band was amazing too BTW. I mixed this session down on 4 DAW's. Logic, Studio One, Sonar and Pro Tools. I set a mix up with faders and only used a whole number for db settings eg -6db or -8 db etc.. Panning wise I uses only LCR and set all DAW's to C= -3db pan law. I used no plugins anywhere so just basically doing a summing test. I got a total null with any combination of two mix downs. So there you go. DAW's do not sound different. Oh and BTW I did a blind listening test in a room full of excellent engineers on great speakers and a nice sounding room. No one had any idea what DAW we were listening to. And for the Mixbus people I am not convinced Mix buss has a sound either. I mixed down a multi track sessions of my son playing drums in both Mixbus and Studio One. However I turned all dynamics and saturation off everywhere and used no EQ or dynamics in Mixbus. Same in Studio One. Got a perfect null with these two tracks as well. I have stopped using Mixbus now because of this test. What you are hearing is the result of other factors in Mixbus, not the so called sound of the engine itself. It does not have a sound! Everything else in a DAW however will affect the sound. Plugins, reverbs, time based things you name it. Not the actual summing engine though. Interesting though is the same engineer will arrive at exactly the same sound even if all the other elements in the DAW's are different.
post edited by Jeff Evans - 2018/12/15 12:09:58
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Soundwise
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Re: Comparing DAW's
2018/12/15 18:32:05
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Just an observation... People, who believe, that DAWs sound different usually try to prove it by making some video comparison, screenshots and whatnot, while people who are sure, that every DAW sounds the same usually tell stories and appeal to theory.  Just saying.
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Jeff Evans
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Re: Comparing DAW's
2018/12/15 20:48:22
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I was open to both sides of the argument. When I did the 4 mixes in the 4 DAW's I was even hoping I could hear something and almost disappointed there was nothing between them. It just comes down to summing engines. You cannot compare mixes on multiple DAW's and use all their plugins. That is just not a fair or reasonable test. Unless you are very precise with level settings, panning and pan laws you will never get a perfect null either.
So once you take all the plugins out of the equation you are just left with the bare summing engine test at the end of the day and what I found was they all sounded identical.
Specs i5-2500K 3.5 Ghz - 8 Gb RAM - Win 7 64 bit - ATI Radeon HD6900 Series - RME PCI HDSP9632 - Steinberg Midex 8 Midi interface - Faderport 8- Studio One V4 - iMac 2.5Ghz Core i5 - Sierra 10.12.6 - Focusrite Clarett thunderbolt interface Poor minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas -Eleanor Roosevelt
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Soundwise
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Re: Comparing DAW's
2018/12/16 08:31:43
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I've done such tests too and found that there is a measurable difference, but it's way below perceivable level, somewhere around dithering noise level. So I don't care about summing engine inaccuracy giving that difference. To me it's more about ease of use, workflow, overall user experience, price, support, bug fixes and upgrade policy.
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dubdisciple
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Re: Comparing DAW's
2018/12/19 05:38:18
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I actually like mixbus but at the end of the day, it is just a good example of what happens when you stick a fairly intuitive saturation tool in every track. One could make a similar template in any DAW and season their own mixbus to taste
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azslow3
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Re: Comparing DAW's
2018/12/19 08:53:02
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Soundwise
Just an observation... People, who believe, that DAWs sound different usually try to prove it by making some video comparison, screenshots and whatnot, while people who are sure, that every DAW sounds the same usually tell stories and appeal to theory.
Just saying.
I have tried to find a good video how correctly compare DAWs. And you are right, I have found nothing. But there is in general more fake news/videos then proves why all that is fake  Soundwise
bitflipper
Sorry, not buyin' it. The test is flawed. The three mixes are obviously not volume-matched (which you can confirm by the spectral displays), which is why the nulled version sounds like a quiet version of the original mix.
They are! Not in scientific manner, rather in an ordinary usage manner, i.e., the way most users would do it. That's why the guy says that he used stock settings and matched only levels, pan positions and plugin settings.
We can speculate in the subject, saying "if you match pan laws..." or "if you change these settings...", or "if you rewrite code...", or "if you substitute developers..." and so on, but the reality is, if you take any DAW as it is and start recording/producing/mixing and during the process you decide to try another DAW because of its better UX, you won't care too much about matching all those minor adjustments, but will try to reach the desired quality level within your new DAW.
On the other hand nobody really cares if any two DAWs sound the same or have some difference, because if there is a difference, it is not significant and can be safely ignored. It's the music that matters the most, not the tools.
If you used to work with one pan law, bitrate, up-sampling, etc. in one DAW, it can be easier to start with the same settings in another DAW. People normally adjust the sit the first time they drive a new car, instead of claiming "that car is bad since the driver chair default position is unusable for me" dubdisciple
I actually like mixbus but at the end of the day, it is just a good example of what happens when you stick a fairly intuitive saturation tool in every track. One could make a similar template in any DAW and season their own mixbus to taste
Mixbus is Ardour DAW with added effects. These effects have "own sound", the DAW itself does not (the DAW is open source and the source never lie).
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Soundwise
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azslow3
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Re: Comparing DAW's
2018/12/20 23:35:31
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Soundwise
azslow3
If you used to work with one pan law, bitrate, up-sampling, etc. in one DAW, it can be easier to start with the same settings in another DAW. People normally adjust the sit the first time they drive a new car, instead of claiming "that car is bad since the driver chair default position is unusable for me"
On my side of the universe it's more like the text in bold, rather than what you described as a normal habit. Not sure why.
I till remember the universe with 2141 (AKA "DIY") May be I should make a DAW comparison guide video, illustrating what I have written before in this thread. For that need some music, a native speaker and time. My own performance and Russian accent will be too distracting from the topic... Fortunately I know people which can help with that. Lets see what I can do in 2019.
Sonar 8LE -> Platinum infinity, REAPER, Windows 10 pro GA-EP35-DS3L, E7500, 4GB, GTX 1050 Ti, 2x500GB RME Babyface Pro (M-Audio Audiophile Firewire/410, VS-20), Kawai CN43, TD-11, Roland A500S, Akai MPK Mini, Keystation Pro, etc. www.azslow.com - Control Surface Integration Platform for SONAR, ReaCWP, AOSC and other accessibility tools
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bitflipper
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Re: Comparing DAW's
2018/12/21 04:27:03
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☄ Helpfulby marled 2018/12/21 10:30:19
The biggest variable in my recording process is the amount of caffeine in my bloodstream. Too little, and I run the risk of forgetting to check my track interleave and then staring blankly at the screen wondering why an effect doesn't work right. Too much, and I rush through everything and next day wonder what I was thinking yesterday...where'd the snare go?
The point being that the most impactful variables for recording quality have nothing whatsoever to do with the DAW.
 All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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Grem
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Re: Comparing DAW's
2018/12/21 05:02:26
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bitflipper
The point being that the most impactful variables for recording quality have nothing whatsoever to do with the DAW.
Best quote of the thread.
Grem
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Soundwise
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Re: Comparing DAW's
2018/12/21 16:45:35
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Grem
bitflipper
The point being that the most impactful variables for recording quality have nothing whatsoever to do with the DAW.
Best quote of the thread.
I agree!
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pwalpwal
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Re: Comparing DAW's
2018/12/22 13:43:54
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Fog "father ted"
love me some father ted
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pwalpwal
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Re: Comparing DAW's
2018/12/22 13:51:29
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xmas special from season 1
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