Configuring VST Instruments & Channels

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Johnbee58
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2016/02/22 11:21:44 (permalink)

Configuring VST Instruments & Channels

I have Sonar X3 Studio.
I would like some help configuring VST instruments so that I can use just one instance of a player but with multiple tracks. Up to now, I've been loading them as "Simple Instrument Tracks" and if I want to use say, 4 horns, that takes up lots of memory. The other day I tried using the MONO configuration with Miroslav Philharmonik and Garritan Jazz & Big Band 3 with the setup on multiple channels with just one instance of the instrument (I don't remember how it's worded and I'm not at my DAW now, but you know what I mean).   It loaded 32 channels as Miroslav (or Garritan).  When I chose the Stereo configuration it loaded 16.  This makes sense to me, but the channels did not have record arm buttons on them.  Just the Mute & Solo buttons and another button I guess for monitoring, but no Record Arm button.  Could somebody please explain this.  I'd really like to use it this way, but I cannot find any instruction manual or tutorial for it.  I'm tired of my projects using more memory than necessary.
 
Thanks
John B.

Lenovo Core i5 4460 Desktop PC (Windows 8 64 bit), Focusrite Scarlett 6i6, Nektar LX61 Keyboard MIDI Controller, Avantone Pro CV-12 tube condenser microphone, JBL LSR308 8" active monitor speakers.  Cakewalk by Bandlab, Reason 7,
NI Session Strings Pro, NI Strummed Acoustic Guitar, Miroslav Philharmonic, Auturia DX7 V, Garritan JABB 3, EZ Keys, EZ Drummer.
 
 "I will create music the way I want to whether a million people are listening or no one is listening."   Dan Fogelberg, Singer/Songwriter-1951-2007
#1

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    bitflipper
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    Re: Configuring VST Instruments & Channels 2016/02/22 12:29:14 (permalink)
    Simple Instrument Tracks are specifically for non-multi-timbral synths and samplers. In order to be simple, it has to make some assumptions, e.g. one MIDI channel and one stereo output. It's just not a good fit for people who use multi-timbral virtual instruments.
     
    When you insert the synth/sampler, un-check the Simple Instrument Track option. It's not always possible to know in advance how many of the synth's outputs you'll end up using, but that's OK. You can just choose to create a single audio track initially and add more later if necessary.
     
    In terms of reduced memory usage, the benefit is actually small. With a sampler, most of the RAM taken up is for samples, not the player. It can actually force greater memory usage because you lose the ability to freeze each voice separately. I typically combine instruments that are likely to be frozen or bounced together, such as strings, brass and percussion, and use separate instances for stuff I'm likely to work on for a while, such as lead instruments.
     
    If RAM conservation is important to you, you'll get a better return by investigating what memory-management features your instruments provide. Most of them have at least a couple options for reducing memory usage, such as specifying the pre-load buffer size or purging unused samples. Superior Drummer gives you a choice between 16- and 24-bit samples, with the former option resulting in a dramatic reduction in memory requirements.


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    #2
    sonarman1
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    Re: Configuring VST Instruments & Channels 2016/02/22 12:53:58 (permalink)
    You can only record the midi tracks and not the audio track thats routed to the soft synth. You have to create a midi track and set its output to the required soft synth. If it's multi timbral you should also set the channel and then record it. It's pretty simple.
    post edited by sonarman1 - 2016/02/22 13:08:35
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    Jeffiphone
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    Re: Configuring VST Instruments & Channels 2016/02/22 13:45:52 (permalink)
    Don't wanna hijack the thread, but are you saying that I can use one instance of a synth and have that synth produce numerous different sounds simultaneously on separate tracks?
     
    What I've been doing is using a separate instance of a synth for each sound I want.
     
    Example:
     
    Insert z3ta as simple instrument track
    Find a sound I like, say a pad or whatever
    Record the part
     
    Insert another instance of z3ta on another track as simple instrument track
    Find a sound I like, say an arp
    Record the part.
     
    So in the end, I wind up with 5 or 6 instances of z3ta.
     
    If I can do this using only one instance of the synth, that would be awesome! And this is done using different midi channels? (I've never messed with midi channels, so forgive my ignorance).
     
    Can anyone provide a step by step on how to do this?
     
    Thanks!
     
     

    Acer with i7 processer - Sonar Platinum 64bit - Windows 10 64 bit - Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 (2nd Gen) -
    #4
    sonarman1
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    Re: Configuring VST Instruments & Channels 2016/02/22 14:09:17 (permalink)
    Jeffiphone No! U can't do that on z3ta coz its not a multi timbral vst. Some vst's are multi timbral and they have multiple channels inside them. While using them you can create midi channels for each channels and record them from single instance. Few third party multi channeled vst's are omnisphere, kontakt, battery, etc. As for as Cakewalk plugins Session Drummer 3 has multi outs. But you won't need multiple midi channels to record coz they are just Drum sounds. U can trigger all the channels from single midi track. Let me say a simple way for you to understand. Go to the track view simply right click and click insert from track templates 》Soft synth track templates 》 SessionDrummer 3 and load a template and mess around with it.
    post edited by sonarman1 - 2016/02/22 14:24:13
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    Jeffiphone
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    Re: Configuring VST Instruments & Channels 2016/02/22 14:16:16 (permalink)
    Aaah. Ok. Multi-timbral is the key. The TTS is like that if I recall. Same for my EZ Drummer 2 and other drum synths.
     
    Thanks Sonarman. That clears it up.
     

    Acer with i7 processer - Sonar Platinum 64bit - Windows 10 64 bit - Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 (2nd Gen) -
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    sonarman1
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    Re: Configuring VST Instruments & Channels 2016/02/22 14:19:29 (permalink)
    If you find yourself using multiple instances of z3ta in your projects and hate the idea of loading them again and again, there is a simple solution for you. I do it always for some of my favourite plugins. Create 8 instances of z3ta and put them all in a task folder. Save the folder as a track template. Next time you load a project just load the track template. You Will load all the 8 instances ready to record in a single click. Try doing it yourself or else let me create a track template and send you.
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    Johnbee58
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    Re: Configuring VST Instruments & Channels 2016/02/22 14:33:14 (permalink)
    Jeffiphone-What you're doing is what I'm doing.
     
    Bit flipper-When I use Miroslav Philharmonik, if I run more than two instances of the engine and I save and get out of it, I cannot re open the file except for going into Safe mode and excluding the instrument from loading.  I wonder if this is some kind of problem that IK Multimedia needs to help me with.  I have no problem with any other virtual instrument, but I presented this problem on another thread on this forum last week and somebody suggested setting up MP multi timbrally.  I don't think it's a Sonar issue because I also use Garritan Jazz & Big Band 3 and NI Session Strings and they don't freeze, but they do slow things up a bit.
     
    JB

    Lenovo Core i5 4460 Desktop PC (Windows 8 64 bit), Focusrite Scarlett 6i6, Nektar LX61 Keyboard MIDI Controller, Avantone Pro CV-12 tube condenser microphone, JBL LSR308 8" active monitor speakers.  Cakewalk by Bandlab, Reason 7,
    NI Session Strings Pro, NI Strummed Acoustic Guitar, Miroslav Philharmonic, Auturia DX7 V, Garritan JABB 3, EZ Keys, EZ Drummer.
     
     "I will create music the way I want to whether a million people are listening or no one is listening."   Dan Fogelberg, Singer/Songwriter-1951-2007
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    sonarman1
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    Re: Configuring VST Instruments & Channels 2016/02/22 14:34:14 (permalink)
    Yea TTS is multi. It has 16 channels but only 4 outputs. Next time you load TTS don't create a Simple instrument track. In the Insert soft synth options dialog box check Midi source, Synth track folder and All synth Audio Outputs: Stereo. Now create 15 more midi tracks using insert multiple track's. Set the outputs of all the channels to TTS AND set all the midi tracks to different channels from 1- 16 respectively. Place it all in a track folder. Customise the colours and track icons if necessary. Save the track folder as track template. Next time u want to use TTS Just load from track templates in a single click and bang on! U are ready to make music.
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    sonarman1
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    Re: Configuring VST Instruments & Channels 2016/02/22 14:43:14 (permalink)
    Insert synth options and track templates are something that I love abt sonar. The Insert soft synth automatically routs every input and output for you when you load. With In few clicks you are ready to go. In someother DAW it with take atleast 10 mins to set up a multi timbral inst. What's so awesome is that you can do it all in 2 sec if saved as track templates. And your creative spark would definitely go away with out making use of these amazing features.
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    Johnbee58
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    Re: Configuring VST Instruments & Channels 2016/02/22 19:19:23 (permalink)
    I'm still a bit confused.  Could somebody please give me a step-by-step?
    Thanks
     
    John B.

    Lenovo Core i5 4460 Desktop PC (Windows 8 64 bit), Focusrite Scarlett 6i6, Nektar LX61 Keyboard MIDI Controller, Avantone Pro CV-12 tube condenser microphone, JBL LSR308 8" active monitor speakers.  Cakewalk by Bandlab, Reason 7,
    NI Session Strings Pro, NI Strummed Acoustic Guitar, Miroslav Philharmonic, Auturia DX7 V, Garritan JABB 3, EZ Keys, EZ Drummer.
     
     "I will create music the way I want to whether a million people are listening or no one is listening."   Dan Fogelberg, Singer/Songwriter-1951-2007
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    declan
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    Re: Configuring VST Instruments & Channels 2016/02/22 21:04:26 (permalink)
    I have Miroslav CE but rarely use it, so Miroslav 2 might work differently now, and this is a bit tedious but it will work:
     
    Go to the synth rack and insert it.  The Insert Synth Options menu pops up.  Make sure the Simple Instrument track box is NOT checked.  Make sure the Midi Source, All Synth Outputs (either mono or stereo), the Synth Property Page , and Synth Rack boxes ARE checked (I'd advise checking the Synth Rack Folder box is checked when using any multitimbral instrument is checked too).   Click OK.
     
    8 audio tracks and 1 midi are created.  Drag the midi track to track 1.  Right click on the midi track and select clone, then enter how many Repitions (midi tracks) you want (probably 7), Starting Track 2.
     
    Click on track the 1st midi track and load something into the 1st slot in Miroslav.  The input can be Omni, the output should be Philharmonic-1.  In the Inspector make sure the Channel is set to Midi Channel = 1:Philharmonic.  You should hear it, or there's a different problem
     
    Then load another sound in to the second slot Miroslav and then click on Channel 2 in Sonar, and in the Inspector change the Midi channel to  Midi Channel = 2:Philharmonic.  You should hear the new instrument.
     
    I'd go ahead and repeat the routing with midi tracks 3-8 then save as a track template.  It works fine here.
     
    Good luck.
     
     
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    Johnbee58
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    Re: Configuring VST Instruments & Channels 2016/02/22 21:19:29 (permalink)
    Thank you so much, declan!
    I will print these instructions out and use them next time I work with my DAW.  If I have any further questions I will let you know.
     
    John B.

    Lenovo Core i5 4460 Desktop PC (Windows 8 64 bit), Focusrite Scarlett 6i6, Nektar LX61 Keyboard MIDI Controller, Avantone Pro CV-12 tube condenser microphone, JBL LSR308 8" active monitor speakers.  Cakewalk by Bandlab, Reason 7,
    NI Session Strings Pro, NI Strummed Acoustic Guitar, Miroslav Philharmonic, Auturia DX7 V, Garritan JABB 3, EZ Keys, EZ Drummer.
     
     "I will create music the way I want to whether a million people are listening or no one is listening."   Dan Fogelberg, Singer/Songwriter-1951-2007
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    Kylotan
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    Re: Configuring VST Instruments & Channels 2016/02/23 04:12:41 (permalink)
    Bear in mind that you may not save much memory this way, if the memory usage is coming from the samples, not the sample player. For this reason, I tend to only use multiple instruments in one instance if I intend to layer them - i.e. I might load a choir and a string section into Kontakt on 2 channels because I want to trigger them both simultaneously from 1 MIDI channel.

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    Johnbee58
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    Re: Configuring VST Instruments & Channels 2016/02/23 08:54:09 (permalink)
    Kylotan
    Bear in mind that you may not save much memory this way, if the memory usage is coming from the samples, not the sample player. For this reason, I tend to only use multiple instruments in one instance if I intend to layer them - i.e. I might load a choir and a string section into Kontakt on 2 channels because I want to trigger them both simultaneously from 1 MIDI channel.


    Yes.  I appreciate that observation.  Bitflipper said the same thing.  I never considered that it was actually the samples that used so much more memory.  I suspect all of my sample libraries (including the main offender, Miroslav) are 16 bit except my newly aquired Trillian Bass Module, which I suspect is actually 24 bit (if anybody else here uses that please verify that for me, but I know it has a "lite" mode, though).  I brought this up because about a week ago I posted a thread complaining about Miroslav.  I have the "Classic" addition that I got 4 years ago (but updated since).  It's the "Lite" version and I only paid about $30.00 for it at the time.  On my last project I used just a simple string quartet (1 violin, 2 violas, and 1 cello) on a little lick on the last verse.  I loaded a new instance for each and after I worked out the parts I saved them.  These were the only 4 parts on the project, as my modus operandi is to make every separate part a separate project, then export those parts as WAVs and import the WAVs into a final project to mix. 
     
    Well, even with only four parts in this project I could not open the Sonar project file for this.  It came up like it was loading for about 5 seconds and then just froze.  I could start a new Sonar project or a previous one with no trouble, but the project with the 4 Miroslav parts just locked.  I can't access it to this day.  I have to open the project in Safe Mode and reload the instruments. 
     
    As I said above, maybe it's an IK Multimedia (Miroslav manufacturer) issue. I have to look up my serial number to contact them.  I only have this situation with MP, and it has happened on previous projects where I used it. No other plugin gives me this trouble, but I still have to make the separate project per part because even with a Core i5 I have to watch my memory usage and loading an all WAV project take up considerably less system resources than a MIDI/Audio mix and it's best to have everything WAVs at the end anyway, at least to store them.  But I always keep the MIDIs in case I ever get better sample libraries someday.
     
    John B.
    post edited by Johnbee58 - 2016/02/23 09:12:24

    Lenovo Core i5 4460 Desktop PC (Windows 8 64 bit), Focusrite Scarlett 6i6, Nektar LX61 Keyboard MIDI Controller, Avantone Pro CV-12 tube condenser microphone, JBL LSR308 8" active monitor speakers.  Cakewalk by Bandlab, Reason 7,
    NI Session Strings Pro, NI Strummed Acoustic Guitar, Miroslav Philharmonic, Auturia DX7 V, Garritan JABB 3, EZ Keys, EZ Drummer.
     
     "I will create music the way I want to whether a million people are listening or no one is listening."   Dan Fogelberg, Singer/Songwriter-1951-2007
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    bitflipper
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    Re: Configuring VST Instruments & Channels 2016/02/23 13:34:35 (permalink)
    I have no inside information regarding Miroslav or IKM instruments in general, but have observed that SampleTank3 benefits from running a single multi-timbral instance much more than Kontakt does.
     
    I think that just reflects the relative maturity of Kontakt, which has had more time to figure out efficiencies that were not IKM's initial priority (given the excruciatingly long development time that led customers to wonder if ST3 would ever happen at all). I would be surprised if Miroslav doesn't get more efficient in future versions. Until then, it's going to work better as a single instance, especially for the larger instruments.


    All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. 

    My Stuff
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