Confused Newbie

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Fredster66
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2012/03/23 11:42:49 (permalink)

Confused Newbie

 
Actually, I'm an old-school MIDI user who has seen the last of his Cakewalk Pro Audio 9 system bite the dust.  So in my quest for bringing my system into the 21st century, I want to use my old hardware MIDI modules along with softsynths found in today's recording software. 
 
Basic question #1:  Do I need a PCI soundcard to make the connection between the soft synth (and sound system) and my ears?  Or are there external USB devices, such as the Tascam US-1800 that will do the same thing?  I can't imagine all that data being squeezed through a USB connection.
 
Help?  Anyone?  Please?
 
Thanks..
 
 - Geezer Newbie
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12 Replies Related Threads

    Rimshot
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    Re:Confused Newbie 2012/03/23 12:10:41 (permalink)
    Hi, 
    You will need an interface for both midi and audio.  There are so many to choose from.  You can go internal, external with firewire or USB.  Have you looked online through music retailers for some ideas?  

    Rimshot

    Rimshot 

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    #2
    timidi
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    Re:Confused Newbie 2012/03/23 13:11:27 (permalink)
    PCI slots in newer computers are a dying breed. PCI-e is the new format.
    If you were using Pro audio, I assume you had a sound card (unless you were just doing midi).

    If you haven't upgraded since PA days, you probably have a steep purchasing curve ahead.

    But yes, lots of folks use USB devices. (I use PCI-e.)
    As is usually the case, the more you spend, the better, more stable, you get.


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    #3
    Guitarhacker
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    Re:Confused Newbie 2012/03/23 14:56:50 (permalink)
    Ahhhh... the old Cakewalk pro series.....   Time to move on now  that the old one has kicked the bucket. What a shock it was for me to come back to Cake after being away a few years from when my CWpro 8 bit the dust to my reintroduction to MC4 on a new lappy..... wow!  Needless to say a pleasant update. 

    I don't recommend Tascam as many folks seem to have some problems with them. Also avoid the all in one cord based  gizmo's like Uno...et al..... 

    I do like the USB external interfaces a lot. the USB midi/audio interfaces work well and migrate easily between desk tops and lappys. Don't worry over the USB connection being a bottleneck to the data..... USB handles it extremely well. The bottleneck is more likely to occur inside the computer with processing speed and RAM size being the limiting factor rather than the USB port.  With softsynths being processed inside the computer, as opposed to the modules you have now that process externally, that CPU power & speed and RAM are important, but still, it is amazing what can be done inside the box these days. There are easy ways around many of the problems that you might encounter.  

    Focusrite, Personus, and M-Audio are good brands to look at.   www.beaglesound.com is also a good site to check for options on cards & interfaces. 

    As far as midi modules, since midi is still midi, you can use them if you desire.... probably much the same way you did with PA9.  

    The new DAW will likely be MC6 or one of the X1 family of DAWs.  I have both the MC line and X1 essentials.  

    If you have not used softsynths, you will like them. So many really good sound options now with samples. 

    so... what are the specs on the current computer or are you going with a whole brand new set up? 
    post edited by Guitarhacker - 2012/03/23 14:58:34

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    #4
    sock monkey
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    Re:Confused Newbie 2012/03/23 15:28:20 (permalink)
    There nothing wrong with Tascam interfaces now under Windows 7 64 bit. It was poor drivers in the XP days that caused grief. For the money they are well built and have better than average pre amps. ------------------------------------------ You will find switching to a modern DAW a little overwhelming at first. You need to forget the way you had worked in the past. Like outboard gear.Soft synths will duplicate everything they did and probably better. I kept mine for a few years but it's now in a storage bin and will never see the light of day. Work flow will change . The MIDI editing is still about the same. Anyhow have fun. You might want to start out with the basic version of X1 and see how it goes. You can always upgrade.
    post edited by sock monkey - 2012/03/23 15:34:47

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    #5
    Fredster66
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    Re:Confused Newbie 2012/03/27 14:01:37 (permalink)
    Sooo, If I'm using a device like the Tascam US-1800, despite all of its happy audio i/o capabilities, it still has the circuitry to convert soft synth output into analog signals I can then plug into my (old) Mackie mixer?

    Also, while on the topic of Pro Audio, is there any way to convert the old MIDI files to work with Sonar?  :D  Asking a lot, I know...
    #6
    Zenwit
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    Re:Confused Newbie 2012/03/27 14:14:43 (permalink)
    Fredster66


    is there any way to convert the old MIDI files to work with Sonar?  :D  Asking a lot, I know...
    You don't have to convert anything.  Just import them into a midi track(s) in Sonar and you're off to the races.
     
    There are lots of good audio / midi interfaces (USB type, firewire etc..) out there for less than $300.  Go to the Cakewalk store and look at the Roland / Cakewalk stuff to get some good ideas for starters.
     
    Scratch that last suggestion.  They don't have any hardware in the "store" anymore.  Here is a link to a Roland product that can get you up and running for a low price. 
     
    http://www.rolandus.com/products/productdetails.php?ProductId=1166&ParentId=104
     
    The suggestions of the other posters for Presonus, M-Audio and other brands are equally valid.  Check them all out.
     
    Good luck!

    post edited by Zenwit - 2012/03/27 14:21:20

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    #7
    timidi
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    Re:Confused Newbie 2012/03/27 15:09:08 (permalink)
    Fred. your .wrk files will open fine in Sonar (with maybe a few hiccups). mostly level changes on any audio tracks from PA if you used envelopes.

    As far as external synths vs. soft synths. Hmm. I still use my JV1080 and TR-rack as they just feel better.
    I can't the same subtletese out of most soft synths. Sort of like the difference of hitting a drum with a drumstick or a 2X4.

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    #8
    haiser
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    Re:Confused Newbie 2012/03/28 23:37:18 (permalink)
    I do like the USB external interfaces a lot.   I kept mine for a few years but it's now in a storage bin and will never see the light of day. 


    #9
    chuckebaby
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    Re:Confused Newbie 2012/03/29 00:13:33 (permalink)
    sounds like me.i did the same thing,i jumped from pro audio 9 right to sonar home studio,to sonar x1.
    may i suggest you demo x1 first to see if its a little too much.because it is a great leap from where we came from,you might find sonar home studio 7 xl a little more like pro audio 9, as i did so it was easier to make the transition to x1if all your going to be doing is midi recording you can get away with buying a midi usb controler for about 20-30 bucks(m-audios midi uno usb will do fine for now then you can get asio for all to sweep the latency under the carpet.
    that is the less expensive way to go(just for demoing purposes)the more legit way is buying an audio interface for your computer.dont forget to read the reviews,the last thing you want is to buy a 200+ dollar interface and have it not work with your set up,so do some homework first.

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    #10
    Cactus Music
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    Re:Confused Newbie 2012/03/29 11:49:05 (permalink)
    And to answer your question about plugging it all in to your mixer, Yes you can either route the outputs of the interface back through the mixer. or directly to the monitor amp or active speakers. I like using a mixer as it gives me a panic control. It also gives me full control over any monitoring levels going both in and out. Depends on your mixers routing of course. I'm playing all my old Atari MIDI files. There are a few set up's like re setting Program changes. But MIDI is the same stuff it always was. Try the TTs-1 for getting used to soft synths. It is the GM multi channel synth and replaces almost every sound module ever built.

    Johnny V  
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    #11
    Fredster66
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    Re:Confused Newbie 2012/03/30 23:36:57 (permalink)
    Thanks for all the advice.  It's truly invaluable.  I can plug in my old wrk files!  Oasome!

    Someone I forget who once said "Ambivilance is the key to flexibility."    So here I am, stuck between the old hardware synth world and the new softsynth one.  I don't really need any new synths at this point (I have 7 rack mounted ones - hence the need for a mixer).  On the other hand, one or two may croak before I do.  

    So now I'm the proud owner of a Tascam US-1800 with all its spiffy i/o and interfaces.  I downloaded Producer X1 trial and gave it a spin.  The midi seems to work fine with the Tascam.  Then I got lost in all the bells and whistles.  Never could get the softsynth to work, but didn't put that much time into it, either. 

    So, is there an upgrade path from "Essentials" to "Producer?"  Sooner or later I'd like to think I'd have a use for all that sonic capability, but right now just need to get some tracks layed down. 

    Thanks again..

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    #12
    Cactus Music
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    Re:Confused Newbie 2012/03/31 19:23:51 (permalink)
    Well your a brave one. Most of use slowly progressed through the yearly upgrades to end at Sonar 8.5 and now X1 which is a ride on a rocket ship compared with what you had. The MIDI part however has seemed to be unchanged since way back when. Just more and better soft synths. Took me 3 years to get over how I used to work with the Atari KCS and event list editing. All is good now. The Atari has gone to the recyclers to have it's 500 MB hard drive re used?? Soft synths are fairly easy to do once you get the hang of it. Create a fresh MIDI track, Insert the synth and make sure to assign the output of that track to that soft synth.

    Johnny V  
    Cakelab  
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    #13
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