DAW Motherboard Swap

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SonicExplorer
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2017/08/10 03:40:53 (permalink)

DAW Motherboard Swap

Guys, I know this asking a lot to predict, but thought I'd toss this out there....
 
Any idea if I would be able to swap out a motherboard without Windows XP freaking out in some way?  Licensing, etc?   Here is the exact scenario:
 
Intel DG41RQ vs. DG41WV boards with the following differences:
- Intel P4 E5500 vs. E5700 CPU's
- DDR2 vs. DDR3 RAM
- FSB speeds a bit different.
- One board has a floppy controller but no IDE, the other has IDE controller but not floppy.
- One board has PCIe x 1 connector, the other does not.  This however is not used.
 
Everything else the same, right down to chips onboard - audio, GPU, etc.
 
Basically, these are the same series boards with same series CPU.  And NIC would always be disabled BTW.

Any guess as to what would happen if these motherboards were swapped out?  Would XP transparently adjust to the swap and tolerate it, or would it flip out and/or reject the license?
 
Sonic
 
post edited by SonicExplorer - 2017/08/10 05:17:34
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    Sanderxpander
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/10 04:00:43 (permalink)
    If it's an OEM version of XP I don't think it'd work.
    #2
    SonicExplorer
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/10 05:18:30 (permalink)
    Sanderxpander
    If it's an OEM version of XP I don't think it'd work.

     
    It is not OEM, regular license.
    #3
    patm300e
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/10 11:30:00 (permalink)
    Good XP motherboard replacement instructions with pictures:
    http://www.theeldergeek.com/replace_motherboard.htm
     
    Good luck! and do back up all those projects, documents, etc.  Just in case!
     

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    Jim Roseberry
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/10 13:13:15 (permalink)
    If you're making a significant change to the hardware, you'll most likely need to re-authorize Windows.
    Doesn't matter if it's an OEM copy of "Full version"...

    Best Regards,

    Jim Roseberry
    jim@studiocat.com
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    #5
    abacab
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/10 19:44:16 (permalink)
    You will need to clean install XP due to the new motherboard. 
     
    Due to the hardware differences, Windows will likely barf if you just try to boot from your original installed drive.  If you want to attempt it without a clean install, make a clone of the original drive first.  If it fails to boot correctly, it may corrupt your configuration on disk.  Or you might get lucky, and boot, but it could be a headache as well with some glitches.  A nice fresh install would result in the best performance.
     
    Then use the MS phone authorization system with your OEM or full license to re-activate.

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    Sanderxpander
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/11 06:11:48 (permalink)
    Jim Roseberry
    If you're making a significant change to the hardware, you'll most likely need to re-authorize Windows.
    Doesn't matter if it's an OEM copy of "Full version"...

    But an OEM copy can generally not be reauthorized on a new mobo, right?
    #7
    fireberd
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/11 10:54:01 (permalink)
    But an OEM copy can generally not be reauthorized on a new mobo, right?
     
    Yes and no.  I've swapped motherboards, different motherboard vendor, in Win 7 that had an OEM version and I had to contact Microsoft but they authorized it.  I did the same thing on another Win 7 system (went from a Gigabyte to ASRock) and that one "self" authorized.  Both of the OEM version OS's were purchased "retail".  However, I've seen cases with a vendor OEM (e.g. Dell, HP, etc) where Microsoft wouldn't reauthorize.  

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    abacab
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/11 11:39:50 (permalink)
    Sanderxpander
    Jim Roseberry
    If you're making a significant change to the hardware, you'll most likely need to re-authorize Windows.
    Doesn't matter if it's an OEM copy of "Full version"...

    But an OEM copy can generally not be reauthorized on a new mobo, right?



    Never ran into any roadblocks with either Win XP OEM or Win 7 OEM.  Online activation always failed, but just used the phone activation method and all was good.  I think you get a few activations this way ... but if you do it too often, I've heard you might get blocked.

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    Sanderxpander
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/11 12:19:13 (permalink)
    Huh, I guess I've never tried phone authorization, I understood OEM meant "tied to the system" which I assumed to imply mobo. I wonder if they have a number over here or if I'd need to use the US one. Thanks, I learned something!
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    Jim Roseberry
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/11 13:13:09 (permalink)
    Sanderxpander
    Huh, I guess I've never tried phone authorization, I understood OEM meant "tied to the system" which I assumed to imply mobo. I wonder if they have a number over here or if I'd need to use the US one. Thanks, I learned something!



    As long as it's the same machine being repaired/upgraded (not being moved to a second physical machine), you're fine.
     
    If Windows gives a BSOD with the new hardware, the OP can use something like Acronis Universal Restore.
     

    Best Regards,

    Jim Roseberry
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    #11
    abacab
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/11 13:23:45 (permalink)
    Sanderxpander
    Huh, I guess I've never tried phone authorization, I understood OEM meant "tied to the system" which I assumed to imply mobo. I wonder if they have a number over here or if I'd need to use the US one. Thanks, I learned something!



    The OEM licenses I used were obtained without hardware, intended for system builders.  Can usually be found online at places like Newegg or Amazon.
     
    Never tried it with an off the shelf OEM PC license.  But that would be difficult to upgrade mobos in anyway, compared to a custom built system, due to the typical proprietary case form factors used by OEMs.
     
    When the online activation fails, you can use the manual offline method. 
     
    To activate Windows 7 using the phone:
  • Select the Start button, right-click Computer, select Properties, and then select Activate Windows now.
  • Choose Show me other ways to activate.
  • Type your Windows 7 product key, and then select Next.
  • Select Use the automated phone system. You may be asked for an admin password or to confirm your choice.
  • Select your location (or the location nearest you) from the drop-down list, and then select Next.
  • Call one of the available phone numbers listed. An automated system will guide you through the activation process. 
    https://support.microsoft...ting-microsoft-windows

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    abacab
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/11 13:37:19 (permalink)
    Jim Roseberry
     
    If Windows gives a BSOD with the new hardware, the OP can use something like Acronis Universal Restore.
     



    The OP is working with XP.  Would that still be a good option for an unsupported Windows OS?

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    Jim Roseberry
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/11 14:05:05 (permalink)
    I believe Acronis Universal Restore is compatible with WinXP.
    It's been a while since I've used XP... so someone correct me if I'm wrong.  
     
    The OP can also manually uninstall components... and shut the machine down.
    When migrating the OS to the new hardware, Windows will then load necessary drivers.

    Best Regards,

    Jim Roseberry
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    abacab
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/11 14:48:33 (permalink)
    I've never had any luck upgrading hardware without a clean install of Windows. I've been building PCs since Win 95/98.
     
    Last time, I even tried using the Microsoft sysprep method of moving Windows 7 Pro to a new motherboard.
    https://technet.microsoft...cc721940(v=ws.10).aspx
     
    What is Sysprep?

    The System Preparation (Sysprep) tool prepares an installation of Windows for duplication, auditing, and customer delivery. Duplication, also called imaging, enables you to capture a customized Windows image that you can reuse throughout an organization.

     
    It failed, apparently because the Win 7 version I had installed was pre-SP1, with SP-1 applied after original install.  That turned out to be unsupported for sysprep.  A couple of days wasted and I still had to clean install.
     
    That brings up probably the greatest new feature in Windows 10.  It has a new Windows hardware abstraction layer that allows hardware changes without even blinking.  I have heard several recent success stories of motherboard swaps that went without a hitch! 

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    fireberd
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/11 14:59:36 (permalink)
    I had Win 10 Pro (with "Digital Entitlement") on my old DAW system.  I built a new system and moved the OS drive (a Samsung 850 EVO 500GB) from the old PC to the new one.  Booted up and Win 10 did what it needed to do including installing the new hardware drivers and I was up running on the new system, activated with the Digital Entitlement, in short order.  
     
    I did have to reauthorize a couple of plug-ins but nothing else.

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    Jim Roseberry
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/11 15:25:50 (permalink)
    abacab
    I've never had any luck upgrading hardware without a clean install of Windows. I've been building PCs since Win 95/98.



    I prefer a clean install.
    There are cases where I'll migrate.
    ie: My main studio DAW undergoes hardware changes on a regular basis.  
    I generally keep the OS clean/lean... and have little trouble migrating Win10.  
     

    Best Regards,

    Jim Roseberry
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    #17
    abacab
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/11 15:32:21 (permalink)
    Jim Roseberry
    abacab
    I've never had any luck upgrading hardware without a clean install of Windows. I've been building PCs since Win 95/98.



    I prefer a clean install.
    There are cases where I'll migrate.
    ie: My main studio DAW undergoes hardware changes on a regular basis.  
    I generally keep the OS clean/lean... and have little trouble migrating Win10.  
     




    Agreed.  A hardware migration is supposed to be completely transparent with Win 10 now.  I'll probably get to test that out on my next hardware upgrade! 

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    Jim Roseberry
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/11 15:58:31 (permalink)
    This last migration, the Microsoft agent wanted a receipt for the copy of Windows.  
    I'm like... uhhh... I've got the copy right in front of me (jewel-case and all).
    Had to take a picture of the Install Code... and leave that on the desktop for the agent to authenticate. 
    Minor annoyance... but all was fine.  
     

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    abacab
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/11 16:10:33 (permalink)
    I guess that there might be a few variations to the process, based on whether you already had a digital license for Windows 10, or whether you have a product key from a retail package.
     
    https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/12440/windows-10-activation
     
    Activating Windows 10 after a hardware configuration change
    If you made a significant hardware change to your device (such as replacing the motherboard), Windows 10 might no longer be activated and you might see the activation error codes 0x803f7001 or 0xC004C008. If you're running Windows 10, version 1607 or later, and added your Microsoft account and linked it to the digital license on your device, you can use the Activation troubleshooter to reactivate Windows. For more info, see Using the Activation troubleshooter.
    If your Original Hardware Manufacturer (OEM) changed the motherboard for you, your PC should reactivate automatically or you should be provided with a replacement product key. If you see the Activation error “Unable to reach Windows activation servers” then follow the steps in this additional help article.

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    Sanderxpander
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/11 18:19:39 (permalink)
    Jim Roseberry
    Sanderxpander
    Huh, I guess I've never tried phone authorization, I understood OEM meant "tied to the system" which I assumed to imply mobo. I wonder if they have a number over here or if I'd need to use the US one. Thanks, I learned something!



    As long as it's the same machine being repaired/upgraded (not being moved to a second physical machine), you're fine.
     
    If Windows gives a BSOD with the new hardware, the OP can use something like Acronis Universal Restore.
     

    I guess a new motherboard seemed like a new machine to me. You'd wonder where they draw the line, but I guess that's why there's a guy on the other end of the phone.
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    Jim Roseberry
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/12 16:14:47 (permalink)
    FWIW, They have to allow for a component failure/replacement.
    If your 3-year old motherboard fails (and the only replacement is a new/different model), that could also mean new CPU and RAM.  As long as the license is only used on a single machine, you're good-to-go.

    Best Regards,

    Jim Roseberry
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    Sanderxpander
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/12 22:31:23 (permalink)
    So as long as I keep the same case I'm ok? My systems are in a constant state of upgrading. I've used the same case and, two data drives and the DVD drive and monitors for the last three systems. I guess I've been on XP, Win7 and Win10 now so it doesn't really matter that much but it's a strange philosophy to me.
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    Jim Roseberry
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/13 16:15:39 (permalink)
    I'm in the same boat with my personal main studio DAW. 
    It's upgraded/expanded on regular basis... 
     
    I don't think about it so much as "dependent upon using the same case".  
    It's a single machine... no different than if it were a high-performance race car.
    The engine might change, be rebuilt, or enhanced... but it's a singular entity.
    If I change the case (which is more rare), it's still that single machine (my main studio DAW).
    That one Windows license is only installed on a single machine.
    If my main studio DAW was rebuilt into two separate physical machines, that's where a new license is necessary.

    Best Regards,

    Jim Roseberry
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    Sanderxpander
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/13 18:25:35 (permalink)
    But that would also break the terms of a regular single Windows license, right?
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    Jim Roseberry
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/13 19:07:43 (permalink)
    Sanderxpander
    But that would also break the terms of a regular single Windows license, right?



    As long as the install (license) is on a single machine... you're good-to-go.
    If you try to migrate it to two simultaneous machines, you've violated the license.

    Best Regards,

    Jim Roseberry
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    #26
    Sanderxpander
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/13 19:32:56 (permalink)
    I know, we were just discussing the difference between regular and OEM license, where I thought OEM was tied to hardware and regular is allowed to be moved. Both are for a single machine I thought.
    #27
    abacab
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/13 20:18:52 (permalink)
    Sanderxpander
    I know, we were just discussing the difference between regular and OEM license, where I thought OEM was tied to hardware and regular is allowed to be moved. Both are for a single machine I thought.



    You know, I hear what you are asking, but even Microsoft has been sending mixed signals about this subject.  It appears that they may even be looking the other way from their official terms.
     
    I recall the days when you were supposed to buy a piece of hardware to go with an OEM Windows license key, so it was in apparent compliance of being tied to some hardware.  Such as a disk drive or motherboard, etc.
     
    But in recent years there has been a flood of legitimate resellers selling Windows licenses only, no hardware purchase required.  The resellers are clearly getting them direct from Microsoft, so there is no doubt Microsoft knows this is going on.  MS could easily put a stop to the over the counter OEM license trade, but they don't ... why?

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    #28
    Sanderxpander
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/13 20:47:36 (permalink)
    Well I personally thought that was because they got tied to the mobo id. Whereas you can move a "regular" Windows license to a new system. Apparently that distinction in practical sense only existed in my mind, although Microsoft may have intended it that way at some point.
    #29
    SonicExplorer
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    Re: DAW Motherboard Swap 2017/08/13 22:01:21 (permalink)
    Thanks everybody for the replies.  Sounds like the only assured way to swap boards with XP would be to do a fresh reinstall.
     
    Final DAW hardware obstacle is selecting hard drives.  Starting a new thread....
     
    Sonic
    #30
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