Helpful ReplyDetails on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration

Page: 12 > Showing page 1 of 2
Author
bigboi
Max Output Level: -85 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 260
  • Joined: 2004/03/12 00:30:41
  • Status: offline
2012/02/25 18:19:34 (permalink)

Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration

I know that the new release is supposed work better with our systems.  i did not get to see the live streaming event.  Can someone give me the details on how it is going better integrate?  New features for us?

I7 920, 8 gigs ram, Newest gigabyte motherboard, 100 gig ssd for operating system and program files, 1 TB 7400 rpm for storage, Full V-Studio system, 2x Motu 2408 MKIII, 2x Motu 24 I/O, Maschine, Kore 2, Virus TI2, Korg m3, Novation Supernova, Novation D-station, Mo Phatt, Elektron Machine Drum, MicroKorg XL, Arturia Origin, Korg Triton, Roland jv2080-completely expanded, Avalon 737SP, 3 Sony premiere monitors, 2 event 20/20 studio monitors, Autotune AVP1, TC Helicon Voiceworks, 1 TC Electronics Powercore 6000, 1 Powercore Firewire
#1
Crg
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 7719
  • Joined: 2007/11/15 07:59:17
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/02/25 21:25:28 (permalink)
Don't have any yet. Have you checked the X1D page?

Craig DuBuc
#2
LANEY
Max Output Level: -64 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1350
  • Joined: 2010/12/11 20:27:13
  • Location: USA
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/02/26 16:11:42 (permalink)
They showed a couple of new commands with control button and track or another one to insert tracks and do some other stuff new to X1d and vs-700 and they said there would be more. Guess we have to wait to find out all of the new commands.



i7/16GB ram
Win 7 x64
SONAR Platinum Producer x64
VS-700 C&R

Octa-Capture and VS-100 for live recording
#3
don4777
Max Output Level: -85 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 264
  • Joined: 2004/06/06 17:21:38
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/05 21:04:52 (permalink)
Well - X1d is out.  Has anyone else tried the integration with VS-700C?  I am finding lots of things that aren't working properly and wondered if it is just me and something strange with my configuration.  Some of the things I have found so far...

- Although I can adjust many of the parameters in the ProChannel's FET Compressor (Softube) there is no adjustment for Ratio.  Strangely there are adjustments for Sidechain and Lookahead which don't appear on screen for the PC version.  The values displayed on the VS-700 do not match the PC display.  For example, Output 20dB on the PC is displayed as 1.0dB on the VS-700C.

- On the Quad Curve EQ there doesn't appear to be anyway to change the EQ type.  It comes up defaulting to "Hybrid" - although the VS-700 says it is "Pure" or "??".

- Concrete Limiter: The values on the VS-700C display are worlds apart from those on the PC display.

- PC4K S-Type Channel Compressor:  Threshold goes from 0 to -30dB on the PC display, and 0dB to 1.0dB on the VS-700C display.  The Ratio goes from 1.00:1 to Inf:1 on the PC display, and from 0.0:1 to 1.0:1 on the VS-700C.

I'm sure there are many other problems and little annoyances.  I am running V700 firmware 1.31 and Windows X64 Driver Version 2.0.0.

There is certainly a lot to like with X1d but it doesn't look like the VS-700C integration was rigorously tested.

Is anyone else seeing the same things.

Don

#4
Dyonight
Max Output Level: -80 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 529
  • Joined: 2009/02/02 13:28:52
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/07 09:45:54 (permalink)
The resonsiveness of the select button through tracks and busses have been greatly improved.  That was one of my main problems and this has been adressed.

I don't have the softube bundle but I've experienced everything else you describe.

I would add that the labels on the console for all prochannels modules on tracks have disapeared after using Sonar for a while.  Have not rebooted Sonar but felt this was strange.  The labels on the buss still apeared but when I switched to track the labels disapeared.  I tryied swapping thourgh the pages thinking I was on an empty one with no luck.

Still no matching labels/layout for the EQ on the console... I thought that would have been a good timing to do this...

Sonar Platinum (Latest monthly update) / Roland A300-pro / AMD FX-8350 / Firepro V4900 / 16gb ram / RME HDSPe MadiFx
#5
John T
Max Output Level: -7.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 6783
  • Joined: 2006/06/12 10:24:39
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/07 10:51:51 (permalink)
I am somewhat disappointed with the ProChannel implementation. I'm going to mess with it a bit more and see what I think, but yeah, lots of weird labelling and mapping.

http://johntatlockaudio.com/
Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
#6
Dyonight
Max Output Level: -80 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 529
  • Joined: 2009/02/02 13:28:52
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/08 00:35:07 (permalink)
Concerning the display that disapear on the channel strip in track view, it's a weird combination of activating the eq and messing with the high/low shelf. Not shure at all and I've not been able to "trigger" it but I'll try for shure.  It happened again tonight.

post edited by Dyonight - 2012/03/08 00:37:08

Sonar Platinum (Latest monthly update) / Roland A300-pro / AMD FX-8350 / Firepro V4900 / 16gb ram / RME HDSPe MadiFx
#7
auricle
Max Output Level: -81 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 492
  • Joined: 2007/02/25 09:36:32
  • Location: English expat in Moscow/Russia
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/09 02:48:18 (permalink)
Any more findings about the mapping in X1D? I am thinking of getting a V 700 C the main reason being the communication with the pro channel. If this doesnt work properly then I'll have to rethink.
#8
kday
Max Output Level: -86 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 206
  • Joined: 2011/01/02 04:06:50
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/10 06:18:32 (permalink)
Could we please get somebody from Cakewalk to confirm these issues and if this will be fixed? These bug issues cannot be left in this condition if this is a relevant issue.
#9
Seth Perlstein [Cakewalk]
Moderator
  • Total Posts : 2084
  • Joined: 2008/07/17 04:38:03
  • Location: Los Angeles, CA
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/11 04:53:58 (permalink)
Here's the knowledge base article which lists the changes and fixes in X1d's VS-700c integration ...

http://www.cakewalk.com/Support/kb/reader.aspx/2007013277

SP
#10
John T
Max Output Level: -7.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 6783
  • Joined: 2006/06/12 10:24:39
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/11 10:43:24 (permalink)
I've no wish to be rude, and I hope this is taken in the spirit of honest criticism in which its meant. I think X1d is, on the whole, an excellent update. But the v700 implementation looks like little more than a box ticking exercise. To give just one example of many: on the pc4k channel compressor, instead of the the enable button being on a button, and being on the fourth of the EQ / SEND buttons, like all the previous modules, enable is a *knob*. And to switch between the two states - on and off - you have to twist the knob and it changes values between 0.0 and 1.0, flipping from on to off at some arbitrary point. I mean, what? There are many other such bizarre mapping choices throughout the modules. Also, the EQ has lost its global enable / disable control from the v700. So that's one that's actually got *worse*. Really incredibly disappointed with this.
post edited by John T - 2012/03/11 10:46:58

http://johntatlockaudio.com/
Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
#11
Seth Perlstein [Cakewalk]
Moderator
  • Total Posts : 2084
  • Joined: 2008/07/17 04:38:03
  • Location: Los Angeles, CA
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/11 13:19:29 (permalink)
John T


I've no wish to be rude, and I hope this is taken in the spirit of honest criticism in which its meant. I think X1d is, on the whole, an excellent update. But the v700 implementation looks like little more than a box ticking exercise. To give just one example of many: on the pc4k channel compressor, instead of the the enable button being on a button, and being on the fourth of the EQ / SEND buttons, like all the previous modules, enable is a *knob*. And to switch between the two states - on and off - you have to twist the knob and it changes values between 0.0 and 1.0, flipping from on to off at some arbitrary point. I mean, what? There are many other such bizarre mapping choices throughout the modules. Also, the EQ has lost its global enable / disable control from the v700. So that's one that's actually got *worse*. Really incredibly disappointed with this.

You know you can globally remap the modules, just like plugins, right?


SP
#12
John T
Max Output Level: -7.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 6783
  • Joined: 2006/06/12 10:24:39
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/11 13:27:42 (permalink)
I didn't know that, no. How do you do it?

http://johntatlockaudio.com/
Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
#13
John T
Max Output Level: -7.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 6783
  • Joined: 2006/06/12 10:24:39
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/11 13:31:41 (permalink)
That would pretty much deal with my only objection (though I still think the defaults are, um, interesting:) ). But I can't work out how to change it.

http://johntatlockaudio.com/
Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
#14
Seth Perlstein [Cakewalk]
Moderator
  • Total Posts : 2084
  • Joined: 2008/07/17 04:38:03
  • Location: Los Angeles, CA
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/11 13:49:06 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby tonydean 2015/03/23 20:55:36
John T


That would pretty much deal with my only objection (though I still think the defaults are, um, interesting:) ). But I can't work out how to change it.

Ah, you will love this! And I agree the defaults are a bit wacky, but remapping is a big part of ACT and is key to streamlining workflow, IMHO.


First, make sure the VS-700c's Channel Strip Control is in EQ mode and that you have the desired PC module that you want to remap selected and controlled by the VS-700c.

Then, select the VS-700c from the list of available control surfaces in SONAR's Control Bar ACT Module (will show by default if only one control surface connected to SONAR). 

Next, using your mouse in SONAR, click the ACT Learn button in that ACT Module once so that it is blue (this is the button labelled ACT).

Then, also using your mouse in SONAR, move the controls in the PC module in series that you want to map to the VS-700c. You can do one, two, or any number you wish.

Next, move the knobs on the VS-700c in series that you want to control the parameters that you moved in the PC module. 

For example, if you want to map the PC4K Expander/ Gate's knobs from left to right across the top four VS-700c knobs, move those four PC4K knobs first with your mouse and then move the four VS-700c rotaries in series from left to right.

Finally, click the ACT Learn button again in SONAR's Control Bar to take it out of lean mode. You will see a popup window telling you that you remapped x parameters with y controls. Click Yes to confirm the remapping or click No to cancel it and try again.

Now your PC module is remapped, and you can continue to remap controls in that PC module one at a time, or in groups. And the mapping is permanent so that whenever you open that particular module it will always be mapped like that, even after you restart SONAR, your computer, etc.

BTW, this is the same method for remapping plugins and synths, and it works with any ACT controller.

HTH.

SP
#15
listen
Max Output Level: -79 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 593
  • Joined: 2008/09/12 06:07:55
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/11 14:28:28 (permalink)
Thanks for the personalized walk through instructions - I will no longer be intimidated to do it....

- Listen -
FOH Mixer & Recording Studio Manager
Nothing but the grace of God - mggtg.



VS 700C - R / CONSOLE 1 / NEVE PORTICO 5017 / TASCAM UH-7000 / SONAR PLATINUM  / REASON RECORD 9 / VMP 2 / UREI 7110's / UA LA-610 MkII / AUDIENT ASP 880 / CREATION STATION 450 V 5 WINDOWS 10 / HOME 64 - BIT / SKYLAKE CORE i7 (i7 - 6700, 4 CORES/8 THREADS)
#16
John T
Max Output Level: -7.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 6783
  • Joined: 2006/06/12 10:24:39
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/11 14:31:41 (permalink)
Thanks Seth, that's excellent information. Never thought of doing it that way, I was trying to work out where the equivalent of the plug in window ACT buton would be.

http://johntatlockaudio.com/
Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
#17
John T
Max Output Level: -7.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 6783
  • Joined: 2006/06/12 10:24:39
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/11 14:33:10 (permalink)
You do realise what you've done though? I was in the Real Users' Complaint Gang briefly, but now I'm back with the Fanbois. Getting picked last for team sports, not invited to the kegger... it's terrible.

http://johntatlockaudio.com/
Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
#18
Seth Perlstein [Cakewalk]
Moderator
  • Total Posts : 2084
  • Joined: 2008/07/17 04:38:03
  • Location: Los Angeles, CA
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/11 14:48:41 (permalink)
John T


Thanks Seth, that's excellent information. Never thought of doing it that way, I was trying to work out where the equivalent of the plug in window ACT buton would be.

Ah, right. Plugins do have an ACT Learn button built-in to their GUI, but PC Modules do not, hence the need to use the global ACT Learn button in the Control Bar. I prefer all of my mappings to match the layout of the module/ plugin (control 1 = Knob 1 from left to right, etc.) so I usually remap to taste. 


I know it can take a bit to remap all of your modules exactly how you want, but once its done, its done. And if you ever screw up a mapping, just remap over it. No harm, no foul.


SP
#19
John T
Max Output Level: -7.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 6783
  • Joined: 2006/06/12 10:24:39
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/11 15:09:31 (permalink)
Don't mind a bit of setup and customisation, just didn't know you could do it. Maybe that's a good FR, actually, a little ACT button as standard on the PC modules.

http://johntatlockaudio.com/
Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
#20
John T
Max Output Level: -7.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 6783
  • Joined: 2006/06/12 10:24:39
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/11 15:53:01 (permalink)
What I can't figure out is how to clear a knob or button, if I don't want it to do anything at all any more. Any ideas anyone?

http://johntatlockaudio.com/
Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
#21
John T
Max Output Level: -7.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 6783
  • Joined: 2006/06/12 10:24:39
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/11 17:32:38 (permalink)
Hmm. I've just re-done the mappings, and then closed and re-opened Sonar, and they've reverted to the default mappings. Is there a step I've missed where you explicitly save them?

http://johntatlockaudio.com/
Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
#22
John T
Max Output Level: -7.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 6783
  • Joined: 2006/06/12 10:24:39
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/11 17:51:19 (permalink)
Hmmm... not just PC modules either, same problem for regular plug-ins. I've obviously got something set up wrong. Any idea what it could be?

http://johntatlockaudio.com/
Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
#23
Seth Perlstein [Cakewalk]
Moderator
  • Total Posts : 2084
  • Joined: 2008/07/17 04:38:03
  • Location: Los Angeles, CA
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/12 12:40:09 (permalink)
John T


Hmmm... not just PC modules either, same problem for regular plug-ins. I've obviously got something set up wrong. Any idea what it could be?

The mappings don't change and save until you complete the process by clicking 'Yes' in the popup window. Without that step the mappings will not take effect.


SP
#24
John T
Max Output Level: -7.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 6783
  • Joined: 2006/06/12 10:24:39
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/12 12:51:14 (permalink)
That's not the problem. Have done that and it works as I've set it for the remainder of that session. But if I close and restart sonar, everything goes back to default. 

http://johntatlockaudio.com/
Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
#25
sarmad_dehnadi
Max Output Level: -89 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 84
  • Joined: 2006/12/02 14:07:15
  • Location: Tehran-Ira
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/18 08:38:49 (permalink)
I love this thread.!!!!
#26
Dyonight
Max Output Level: -80 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 529
  • Joined: 2009/02/02 13:28:52
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/24 22:50:11 (permalink)
Also interseted. Waiting for the outcome of this discussion!

Thanks Seth by the way;)

Sonar Platinum (Latest monthly update) / Roland A300-pro / AMD FX-8350 / Firepro V4900 / 16gb ram / RME HDSPe MadiFx
#27
John T
Max Output Level: -7.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 6783
  • Joined: 2006/06/12 10:24:39
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/24 23:57:02 (permalink)
For the record, I got my problem sorted out. Some kind of installation issue, I think, but once I deleted all the files in this folder - C:\Users\*** user name ****\AppData\Roaming\Cakewalk\ACT Data - then Sonar rebuilt all the relevant data and all was well.

http://johntatlockaudio.com/
Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
#28
John T
Max Output Level: -7.5 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 6783
  • Joined: 2006/06/12 10:24:39
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/24 23:59:39 (permalink)
Following on from that: now I've got the PC modules mapped how I like them, I'm currently finding the v700 / x1 combination mind blowingly brilliant. I wish v700 updates didn't lag behind general updates the way they have done over the last year, but in fairness, when they've caught up, they've been very impressive.

http://johntatlockaudio.com/
Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
#29
Mully
Max Output Level: -60 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 1545
  • Joined: 2004/09/15 02:08:05
  • Location: Adelaide, Oztralia
  • Status: offline
Re:Details on Sonar X1D and vstudio 700 integration 2012/03/27 08:04:19 (permalink)
Thanks for the update John... looking forward to getting back into audio with this update! Cheers...

ASUS H270, i7-7700, JLM BA & 1290, LA2A Opto4, loads of guff.
#30
Page: 12 > Showing page 1 of 2
Jump to:
© 2024 APG vNext Commercial Version 5.1