Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way?

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The Maillard Reaction
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2012/09/21 17:31:08 (permalink)

Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way?


Hi,
 I'm curious about take lanes in X2.

 Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way?

 Does X2 still use clip envelopes?

 Can you use Clip envelopes in take lanes and are they protected from the corruption that occurred sometimes when using Clip Envelopes in layers?

best regards,
mike


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    SvenArne
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/21 17:41:44 (permalink)
    No more layers just lanes. I like 'em, they seem less "brittle" somehow! No mishaps using clip evevelopes in lanes so far! 

    Overall, I think the X2 update should be right up your alley, Mike (as long as you can live with the whole SONAR X paradigm)! 





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    Mystic38
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/21 17:44:51 (permalink)
    SvenArne


    No more layers just lanes. I like 'em, they seem less "brittle" somehow! No mishaps using clip evevelopes in lanes so far! 

    Overall, I think the X2 update should be right up your alley, Mike (as long as you can live with the whole SONAR X paradigm)! 


    Sven.. I have been trying to use PRV for the take lanes but seem to see all midi content for all takes..... ie PRV is track based.. and not found a way to see just the take lane clip... any thoughts?

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    #3
    The Maillard Reaction
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/21 17:45:28 (permalink)

    Thanks for explaining about take lanes Sven.

    all the best,
    mike


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    SvenArne
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/21 17:53:17 (permalink)
    Mystic38


    SvenArne


    No more layers just lanes. I like 'em, they seem less "brittle" somehow! No mishaps using clip evevelopes in lanes so far! 

    Overall, I think the X2 update should be right up your alley, Mike (as long as you can live with the whole SONAR X paradigm)! 


    Sven.. I have been trying to use PRV for the take lanes but seem to see all midi content for all takes..... ie PRV is track based.. and not found a way to see just the take lane clip... any thoughts?

    Yeah, it does seem that the PRV is "global" for the whole midi track... To edit only a lane, you'll have to use the "notes" filter in the TV.





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    Mystic38
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/21 18:21:03 (permalink)
    SvenArne


    Mystic38


    SvenArne


    No more layers just lanes. I like 'em, they seem less "brittle" somehow! No mishaps using clip evevelopes in lanes so far! 

    Overall, I think the X2 update should be right up your alley, Mike (as long as you can live with the whole SONAR X paradigm)! 


    Sven.. I have been trying to use PRV for the take lanes but seem to see all midi content for all takes..... ie PRV is track based.. and not found a way to see just the take lane clip... any thoughts?

    Yeah, it does seem that the PRV is "global" for the whole midi track... To edit only a lane, you'll have to use the "notes" filter in the TV.


    Well that IS a bummer..as you cannot double click for full window or auto zoom to get decent height to edit.... manual track heights??....<gasp>

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    mudgel
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/21 21:27:36 (permalink)
    There are some settings available.
    I can double click a MIDI track and the PRV opens full screen for that track

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    ltb
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/21 21:40:22 (permalink)
    I can only open the lanes to a certain width. Anyone know how to expand them further?

    Too early to tell but think I prefer layers for my workflow. Wish both were available & had an option.



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    Mystic38
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/21 22:42:51 (permalink)
    mudgel


    There are some settings available.
    I can double click a MIDI track and the PRV opens full screen for that track


    Mike, that certainly works for tracks, but unless there is something hidden it doesnt for lanes...

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    derFunkenstein
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/21 22:47:19 (permalink)
    carl


    I can only open the lanes to a certain width. Anyone know how to expand them further?

    Too early to tell but think I prefer layers for my workflow. Wish both were available & had an option.

    Far as I can tell, they only go "yay" big.  Probably big enough for me, but it seems kind of arbitrary to have a limit.  They're already indented, so I don't get it.  It's not like you can't tell them apart.

    King Ben of Nopantsville
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    cornieleous
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/21 22:58:50 (permalink)
    Sounds like another feature that took a step forward and at least one back. OPTIONS AND FLEXIBILITY CAKEWALK. Stop painting users and yourselves into the corner with rigid implementations and half baked features.
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    mudgel
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/22 00:32:09 (permalink)
    Mystic38


    mudgel


    There are some settings available.
    I can double click a MIDI track and the PRV opens full screen for that track


    Mike, that certainly works for tracks, but unless there is something hidden it doesnt for lanes...
    You're right. The project I loaded didn't have layers, so no lanes. I didn't fully understand, but do now. Yes a silly limitation.


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    martinv
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/22 01:43:20 (permalink)
    Are you saying lanes can only be zoomed in so far vertically?

    I was sad that my ancient Mackie HDR2496 has a far more common sense simple yet efficient 'takes' implementation.  I admit I am biased from years of using that system.
    I'm hoping I like the Lanes in X2 as it seems more simmilar to what i'm used to.   
      
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    SvenArne
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/22 04:40:11 (permalink)
    Mystic38


    Well that IS a bummer..as you cannot double click for full window or auto zoom to get decent height to edit.... manual track heights??....<gasp>

    Can I ask what you're wanting to achive by exclusively PRVing midi take lanes? I can't see my self using the track lanes (on midi tracks) for anything other than slip editing. 





    #14
    Danny Danzi
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/22 06:47:40 (permalink)
    If you are having a problem opening up your track lanes, make sure "auto track zoom" is not ticked. You'll see it in the "view" next to options....not "view" near file/edit etc. They get big enough for me as long as that box is not ticked. Not sure they will be big enough for you guys though. Hope this helps.

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    SvenArne
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/22 07:09:35 (permalink)
    Danny Danzi


    If you are having a problem opening up your track lanes, make sure "auto track zoom" is not ticked. You'll see it in the "view" next to options....not "view" near file/edit etc. They get big enough for me as long as that box is not ticked. Not sure they will be big enough for you guys though. Hope this helps.

    -Danny

    My lanes are the same size no matter whether autozoom is on or off. I can see that some might find the vertical size limitation a bad thing, but they're big enough for my purposes. Plus it's kinda nice that the open up to a default "max" size, saves me a bit of deciding how big I need them to be 

    The whole deal is certainly a million times better than "layers" used to be!





    #16
    synkrotron
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/22 07:33:03 (permalink)
    SvenArne


    The whole deal is certainly a million times better than "layers" used to be! 

    Absolutely. No way I would ever want to see layers again. But each to their own.


    Drawing automation in those lanes is a breeze now, and editing them too, cut and paste, moving groups of nodes, the whole process is miles better.

    I'm also of the view that I wouldn't expect my MIDI tracks to be in take lanes. Just Audio tracks. And I'm am using one lane per automation parameter (which I think is the only way you can do it anyway).

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    Mystic38
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/22 07:41:47 (permalink)
    SvenArne


    Mystic38


    Well that IS a bummer..as you cannot double click for full window or auto zoom to get decent height to edit.... manual track heights??....<gasp>

    Can I ask what you're wanting to achive by exclusively PRVing midi take lanes? I can't see my self using the track lanes (on midi tracks) for anything other than slip editing. 


    I actually record midi performances... so may do several takes of one section and of course a take may need some editing... and the inability to do so effectively makes take lanes relatively useless and leaves me back with recording takes in sequential tracks

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    ltb
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/22 08:26:59 (permalink)
    Danny Danzi


    If you are having a problem opening up your track lanes, make sure "auto track zoom" is not ticked. You'll see it in the "view" next to options....not "view" near file/edit etc. They get big enough for me as long as that box is not ticked. Not sure they will be big enough for you guys though. Hope this helps.

    -Danny

    Thanks Danny,

    No, it's not that I just can't get them any wider.

    Of course I might be missing something since it's new but so far lanes are limiting, slowing down my audio editing track workflow.
    i.e. doing very precise editing between audio clips across 5 or so lanes plus the volume nodes way above/ below really slows editing down.

    Along with that my other problem is similar to the previous first X1 or 8.5 release- 'jerky' windows..IIRC there was a bug fix/ patch for it eventually.
    Goes to the top / bottom when expanding tracks in tv. Expanding PC jerks the screen viewing area left or right, always having to scroll back to the desired area.
    I'm guessing this may have something to due with all the crashes people are reporting simply by moving around in views or PC.


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    SvenArne
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/22 08:27:55 (permalink)
    Mystic38


    I actually record midi performances... so may do several takes of one section and of course a take may need some editing... 
    So you need to edit a lane while keeping overlapping lanes invisible? I can kinda understand that, but I always wait with the editing until my comp is finished. The take lanes will be of great help to me, for slip editing the takes and then going into the PRV for the whole track for deep midi editing.


    Shouldn't be too hard for the Bakers to make the PRV lane-specific though, now that we got the nice little icon up in the right-hand corner of every clip. Keep pushing bro!





    #20
    synkrotron
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/22 08:29:52 (permalink)
    Hi Mystic, have you watched Seth's video yet? He showed the inline PRV in take lanes. Could this be what you are after?

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    Mystic38
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/22 09:00:26 (permalink)
    synkrotron


    Hi Mystic, have you watched Seth's video yet? He showed the inline PRV in take lanes. Could this be what you are after?
    Synk,
    I took another look at it as i remember being really excited about this feature but in hidnsight it is quite misleading..
    Since the PRV is track view, and they have a single take, then the PRV shows that single take (as it is the entire contents of the track)... however if you add multiple takes they all show up as overlapping midi events.. "hide muted clips" does nothing, even when the take lanes are muted..
     
    EDIT: see below post 24
    post edited by Mystic38 - 2012/09/22 09:30:24

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    SvenArne
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/22 09:02:13 (permalink)
    Mystic38

    "hide muted clips" does nothing, even when the take lanes are muted..
    I think this only applies to notes having been muted inside the PRV, not entire clips that you've muted in the TV.





    #23
    Mystic38
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/22 09:28:09 (permalink)
    ok, I finally have some sort of working method..

    a. in PRV mode select "hide muted clips"
    b. Select all take lane to be hidden using ctrl click (blue square indicates next to take # is lit)
    c. right click on clip header and select clip mute




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    #24
    SvenArne
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/22 09:33:18 (permalink)
    Mystic38


    ok, I finally have some sort of working method..

    a. in PRV mode select "hide muted clips"
    b. Select all take lane to be hidden using ctrl click (blue square indicates next to take # is lit)
    c. right click on clip header and select clip mute

    Not exactly practical, though... I'm sure they'll get around to implementing lane-specific PRV if enough people ask for it!





    #25
    Mystic38
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/22 09:43:42 (permalink)
    SvenArne


    Mystic38


    ok, I finally have some sort of working method..

    a. in PRV mode select "hide muted clips"
    b. Select all take lane to be hidden using ctrl click (blue square indicates next to take # is lit)
    c. right click on clip header and select clip mute

    Not exactly practical, though... I'm sure they'll get around to implementing lane-specific PRV if enough people ask for it!

    I agree, but at this point simply relieved to be able to take advantage of the take lanes..:)
     
    I trust that logically this is a bug.. after all,  if you go to a clip in a take lane and click "show in PRV" logic would dictate that its the take you want to see.. not the entire track!..lol

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    #26
    SvenArne
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    Re:Did "take lanes" replace "layers" or does X2 let you work either way? 2012/09/22 09:49:57 (permalink)
    Sure, I'll report it as a bug!





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