Dithering mode for bouncing vs exporting...

Hi Ambient,
I'm not sure if it's right or wrong, but I export my audio to a Master 2-track file UNDITHERED, in my case 24-bit due to hardware limitations.  I then use iZotope Ozone5 to master that track and utilize the dithering facility in it to master my CD track or mp3...to 16-bit/44.1Hz.

Dithering is quite nebulous to me also, but the iZotope Ozone manual on "Dithering" is available for downloading, and I can't imagine having more to say about the subject than what you will find in that manual.

The Sonar Power! book by Scott Garrigus also has some good advice on the subject.

Good luck!

Ambient: If you are going to just do a quick project mix out of Sonar to burn to CD or whatever, pow-r 3 is what I use. Why? Because the help files gave the best description for that option. LOL! Supposedly some people can actually hear the difference each dithering option gives you. I never really tried it to see for myself, but when exporting out of Sonar for quick ideas or whatever, that's the one I use.

Now if I'm going to master something, what Tony told you is how I go about it also. The reason being, you should master your tunes in the bit and sample rate they were recorded in and dither/convert sample rate last. So you'd want to come out of Sonar like that as well with no dithering options enabled. Once you master the song, then you do that stuff.

Dithering basics: in a nutshell without getting deep into the science end of it, when you reduce a bit rate without dither, the numbers don't jive and it gives you errors. Most people will not hear these errors but some claim they can. The errors can come by way of sound degradation or even distortion....so they say. I've never heard it when I've chosen NOT to dither something for quick ideas. When you dither, it supposedly adds in a little random distortion but it de-correlates it and rounds out the errors and any distortion will be inaudible.

Another way to put it in simpler terms: You have a 24 bit file. You change the bit rate to 16 without dithering....numerically speaking, (if you choose to look deeper into the science) it will be wrong math wise. Dithering corrects the math when you reduce a bit rate.

Do we need to dither? I'll be brutally honest here. Personally, the jury is still out for me. I hear no difference with these supposed errors. Do I dither? Yeah, but only because everyone else does and I don't hear it degrading my audio...so I do it too even if I can't hear what it's actually doing. I have pretty good ears and get hired for jobs based on my exceptional hearing. However, I cannot tell the difference between a file 16 bit dithered and a 16 bit undithered wave file. If someone CAN, I would love for them to show us what and how to listen for it.

Hope this helps a bit but that's how I've always understood dithering.

-Danny

If you are not dithering down the audio to a different bit depth or Hz value, why would the dither option be there?

To confuse you:)


The bounce feature could and is useable for your master if you're mastering in Sonar.

Thank you for all the info! Can anyone clear up the language in the help file? I am loosely quoting what I can remember, but under disadvantages for POW-3, it says that it is not recommened for "succesive bounces e.g. bouncing, freeze". What does that mean?

bit
Danny: go ahead and use "dither down". I will not think less of you, my friend. However, given your reputation here (and on other forums) as an educator and patron saint of noobs, you might want to aim for semantic accuracy when possible, for their sake.

Point taken....no more dither down if I've said it (which I don't think I do, but I'll be paying attention to my habits lol) as what you say makes total sense looking at it that way. It's nice to know you would have given me a free "non-annoyance" pass though, so I thank you for that. :)

-Danny

In Reaper, the Lame Codec used to create MP3 does not need to be dithered...   I can totally create mp3's from 32 bit waveforms no problem..   

However!!

Many of the digital distributors, ( I've recently started distributing my tunes to the download stores, ) and many of the distributors want 16 bit wav files.

So..  What's a guy to do?  Dither.   And know what it is.

My favorite type of dither is Pow r1.  Because, I need a favorite type of dither, and thats it.  I'm also into triangular, and I quite like Pow r3 as well.  

Unfortunately, I hear no difference..   But maybe I would in a completely tuned, perfectly silent, absolutely sound proofed mastering studio.

That's that..  Choose 1 and go with it.


Dither is supposed to be applied after the mastering stage,  when converting a high bit wav to a 16 bit wave.  If you are using dither throughout your projects, on various audio parts, that is screwing you up, "big time!"