Musikslayer
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Does X3 Studio stink?
Sorry for a loaded question, but it's brought me nothing but misery and I'd love to figure out why. I've been using Cakewalk since PA 9. PA9, Sonar 1/3/5/8.5, not so much as a hiccup. A thousand tracks, I'm a power user and a pro. Really, not one problem. In the year that I've had X3, it's been nothing but problems. I'm I the only one, is there a curse on my X3?
The biggest: I cannot get the prochannel eq settings to "stay", they flatline on pretty much every single project. I've asked here many times, no responses. Is there something I am doing to trigger this? The product is basically unusable at this point- I spend a half-hour with eq settings, the next time I open the project= gone. Flat lines, prochannel is still "on" but the eq is a flat line on EVERY track.
I don't wish to be melodramatic here, but do I need to use another program? It makes no sense. Any help would be great, I have an album that's about finished and I can't do it because of this damn eq problem. Thanks.
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John
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/15 09:54:57
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The answer to your issue is in your post. One thousand tracks is one heck of a lot. Too many for any DAW I know of. Most DAWs stream audio from disk. I think that number is excessive.
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Royal Yaksman
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/15 10:00:40
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Musikslayer
Does X3 Studio stink?
Depends what you rubbed on it, or dropped it in?...
Royal Yaksman HP Phoenix i7 3.9ghz 7600 - Roland Quad Capture - CbB - SD2 Metal Foundry/Roots Stix - NI Komplete 8 - Amplitube 3 & 4 - Addictive Drums 2 - Halion 6 - Izotope Musician Bundle - Waves Stuff - Melodyne Studio - AIR 3 - Revoice 3 - Sssshhhhh don't tell anyone but also Studio One 4 - Cubase 9.5 - Samplitude Pro X3 - FL Studio 20 - Mixbus 4 - Reaper 5 - And a big arsed pocket full of dreams (deceased or otherwise.)
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Musikslayer
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/15 10:38:47
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John
The answer to your issue is in your post. One thousand tracks is one heck of a lot. Too many for any DAW I know of. Most DAWs stream audio from disk. I think that number is excessive.
Sorry, I could have worded that a lot better. I was touting my experience in saying that I've done 1000 "projects" with Cakewalk over the years. My track count is usually less than 40. I've done all the diagnostics tests on my computer, it seems fine. I use Sibelius even more than Sonar, I have no problems and it's a fairly demanding program when loaded with orchestral samples. I don't have problems with anything else, just Sonar. Thanks for responding.
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JonD
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/15 10:42:39
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Do you have the latest update installed (X3e)? Also, how about O.S. updates?
post edited by JonD - 2016/01/15 10:57:33
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Kylotan
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/15 10:58:45
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I used X3e for quite a while. For me it was probably one of the best versions of Sonar/Cakewalk Pro Audio that I've had over the years. Stability wasn't as high as the old days and the shift from layers to take lanes in the X series messed up a lot of the way I had previously liked to work, but I don't recall having trouble with parameters not saving or any other data loss bugs.
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Musikslayer
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/15 11:37:39
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JonD
Do you have the latest update installed (X3e)? Also, how about O.S. updates?
X3e, Windows 10. Computer is a Quad core with 8 gigs ram. Other parameters like volume etc. seem to carry over. It's the eq, and I really can't figure it out. I've also had some corrupt tracks, several crashes, etc. I can deal with that but the eq is a real head scratcher. Is there any function that I'm unaware of that would zero out all eq settings and I'm somehow hitting it by mistake? Thanks.
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JonD
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/15 11:45:30
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I hate to suggest this, but you might consider trying a one-month upgrade to Sonar Plat/Pro. I believe it can exist side by side with your X3 installation. If the problem goes away, then, well, you have a decision to make.
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Anderton
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/15 11:50:05
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I wonder if there's some conflict with the older versions of SONAR that used the Sonitus EQs. It's been a while since I've used X3, but I seem to recall some issue with the X series about importing older projects that used the Sonitus EQ and what was necessary to port those over to the ProChannel.
That said, X3 was a solid release but I greatly prefer Platinum.
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pwalpwal
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/15 12:03:18
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Musikslayer
JonD
Do you have the latest update installed (X3e)? Also, how about O.S. updates?
X3e, Windows 10. Computer is a Quad core with 8 gigs ram.
Other parameters like volume etc. seem to carry over. It's the eq, and I really can't figure it out. I've also had some corrupt tracks, several crashes, etc. I can deal with that but the eq is a real head scratcher. Is there any function that I'm unaware of that would zero out all eq settings and I'm somehow hitting it by mistake? Thanks.
is it one of the known issues with x3 maybe? see http://forum.cakewalk.com/Outstanding-Issues-as-of-X3E-UNOFFICIAL-m3009969.aspx for the list
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John
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/15 12:17:18
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OK I didn't have any noticeable problem running X3 Producer especially after e update. Be sure you have all the updates for X3 Studio and report back.
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pwalpwal
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/15 12:25:11
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John
OK I didn't have any noticeable problem running X3 Producer especially after e update. Be sure you have all the updates for X3 Studio and report back.
he stated he's on x3e - i don't think there were any more updates after that?
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Wookiee
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/15 12:28:30
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Does your user profile in windows belong to the Administrator group?
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Musikslayer
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/15 14:26:31
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Thanks for all the responses. A quick google says I'm not the only one that has encountered this problem. The only tangible advice I read was to do a manual vst scan and look for any failed ones, I did that and there were none. Only one project is a transfer from 8.5, the rest were started in X3. X3 was a fresh install on a new computer, so there are no other Versions of Sonar on it. My wife has been unemployed for 2 years, so the "buy the next one" won't happen right now. Besides, it's one of those areas that's, umm, kinda weird.  Ye olde "sorry the product you bought from us doesn't work, spend more money" is always a tough sell. I realize that all sorts of variables come into play, but the machine is clean and I don't use a lot of plug-ins. Maybe, somehow the "manual vst scan" produced a miracle, I guess I'll find out. Wookiee
Does your user profile in windows belong to the Administrator group?
I assume so, I'm the only user/owner of the computer. Isn't that automatic in Windows 10?
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Dean Capper
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/15 16:33:40
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I have seen this happen to X3 users who have also installed the X3 web trial. The ProChannel EQ included in the trial comes from X3c, and updating to X3e sometimes doesn't overwrite it. This results in EQ settings not persisting like you're describing. A clean install is the sure-fire fix. A shorter solution would be to remove the PCS-GlossEQM.dll file from C:\Program Files\Cakewalk\Shared Utilities\Internal then re-run the X3 installer and the X3e update. (The dll file should be version number 1.2.2.323 in the Properties > Details.) That will ensure that the correct version is installed and that your presets persist correctly.
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Musikslayer
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/15 17:31:54
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Dean Capper [Cakewalk]
I have seen this happen to X3 users who have also installed the X3 web trial. The ProChannel EQ included in the trial comes from X3c, and updating to X3e sometimes doesn't overwrite it. This results in EQ settings not persisting like you're describing. A clean install is the sure-fire fix.
A shorter solution would be to remove the PCS-GlossEQM.dll file from C:\Program Files\Cakewalk\Shared Utilities\Internal then re-run the X3 installer and the X3e update. (The dll file should be version number 1.2.2.323 in the Properties > Details.) That will ensure that the correct version is installed and that your presets persist correctly.
Thanks! I didn't use the trial, but my PCS-GlossEQM.dll is 1.2.2.246 I deleted the .dll, re-ran the X3e patch, and my replacement .dll is still 1.2.2.246. Should I try the clean install next?
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rbecker
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/15 17:37:11
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Wookiee
Does your user profile in windows belong to the Administrator group?
This may have been passed over amid all the replies. I recall reading somewhere that running X3 as administrator can make things go more smoothly. I have my X3e set to always open as administrator. You do that by right clicking on the X3 desktop icon, go to properties, in the shortcut tab go to advanced, then check "run as administrator". May not help, but this is easy and worth a try.
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Paul G
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/16 10:42:41
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When I was on X3 I had to throw it in the washer at least once a week. Sorry, couldn't resist! 
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Musikslayer
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/16 11:45:46
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rbecker
Wookiee
Does your user profile in windows belong to the Administrator group?
This may have been passed over amid all the replies. I recall reading somewhere that running X3 as administrator can make things go more smoothly. I have my X3e set to always open as administrator. You do that by right clicking on the X3 desktop icon, go to properties, in the shortcut tab go to advanced, then check "run as administrator". May not help, but this is easy and worth a try.
Thanks. I've tried it but it will take time to tell. I'm at a loss as to how buggy X3 studio is for me, I can't even begin to describe it. It's terrible. I've always been a big Cakewalk fan, but it's just bad and there's not much I can do about it.
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jpetersen
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/16 11:51:58
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Very strange one. Never had that problem. I still have X3e installed and worked with it on 2 full CD projects. I also import projects from Sonar 8.5.3 that use Sonitus EQ and the Sonitus EQ imports correctly with it's settings intact as a DXi plug-in. I can add ProChannel EQ if I wish, both co-exist in the same track and do not lose their settings. The only difference I can see is I use Win 7 64bit SP1, you use Win 10. Edit: I am the sole user of the PC and have given myself admin rights. It is possible to open an application with elevated rights (Right-click, "Run as Administrator"). This was only ever necessary to register DimPro. Apart from that, I have always just opened Sonar by double-clicking the desktop icon, or a project file.
post edited by jpetersen - 2016/01/16 12:07:41
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Musikslayer
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/16 12:16:13
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jpetersen
Very strange one. Never had that problem.
I still have X3e installed and worked with it on 2 full CD projects.
The only difference I can see is I use Win 7 64bit SP1, you use Win 10.
So you have X3e Studio or Pro? Not that there should be much of a difference besides the bundled software, but I'm curious if this is more "Studio" related than "X3e" related. I had Windows 8 until recently, same behavior. As I said above, this was a clean install on a new machine.
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jpetersen
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/16 12:40:30
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Pro. I don't think Studio had the ProChannel. Does it happen if you start a clean, "Normal" project, single audio track, pull up a node on the EQ, then close and re-open? I ask because I wonder if a plug-in may be crashing on save before the prochannel EQ save code is reached. So perhaps it's worth a try removing all plug-ins from the ProChannel (including from the Master and Metronome busses - why does the Metronome bus get plug-ins by default, for heaven's sake! :) ) I am puzzled that this bug should even be possible without other more dramatic things happening. But sometimes programmers are lazy and put a try-catch around code without doing any error handling in the catch part. So it can crash and you will never know.
post edited by jpetersen - 2016/01/16 12:54:30
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MandolinPicker
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/16 12:51:31
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If your Windows machine is connected to the internet, you might try disconnecting from the net and start shutting some things off (antivirus, wifi adapter, various background services that you don't need when disconnected from the net - just keep track of what you turn off so you can turn it back on once you connect back to the 'net). Before I took mine offline, the wifi driver would cause all kinds of headaches - and it was a fluke we found it. Might be worth a try if everything else comes up short.
The Mandolin Picker "Bless your hearts... and all your vital organs" - John Duffy "Got time to breath, got time for music!"- Briscoe Darling, Jr. Windows 8.1, Sonar Platinum (64-bit), AMD FX 6120 Six-Core, 10GB RAM
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jpetersen
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/16 13:52:38
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Why on earth should that prevent saving (or recovering) only the project-specific ProChannel EQ settings?
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kevinwal
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/16 14:41:14
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jpetersen
Why on earth should that prevent saving (or recovering) only the project-specific ProChannel EQ settings?
There may be things going on in a functional area that has nothing to do with ProChannel EQ (or even in a process outside of Sonar completely) that only manifests itself to you there, no doubt caused by a wildly implausible chain of interactions. Since in this case it seems that many other folks have not seen your specific problem and the fix provided by a Cakewalk associate has apparently not helped, and given that you are experiencing a number of issues in a product that most would agree was the most stable of the pre-Platinum X series releases, I would suspect a system issue of some kind. In that spirit I would check the Windows Event Log for any curious failures or messages. Failing that, disable any devices/device drivers like internal audio or even Wi-Fi (as has been suggested) to eliminate them as sources of trouble. Whatever you do, do one thing at a time, preferably with a reboot in between steps, and evaluate the outcome. I wish you good luck! PS: By the way, one thing that would really help is to make a short screen-capture video of you demonstrating the issue from a new project. Unlikely as it may seem, there may be some procedural issue in play here that will become obvious to those more experienced with the X series when seen in a video.
post edited by kevinwal - 2016/01/16 14:59:30
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Musikslayer
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/16 17:09:47
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Thanks for the responses. The problem with any sort of "turn this plug off" diagnostics is that it seems almost random in timing. I'll open a project every day for a week and work on it, then one day it sounds rough so I look at the eq and it's flatlined. I can turn off a plug and when all is fine the next day, it doesn't tell me much because it might be 2 weeks before the eq zeros out. It's hit many projects but I don't think all of them.
According to Dean Capper above, I don't have the correct .dll for Prochannel. Nor do I know how to get it: when I deleted mine and re-did the X3e update, I ended up with the same "wrong" .dll again.
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jpetersen
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/16 18:19:02
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There's no ProChannel-specific dll in C:\Program Files\Cakewalk\SONAR X3 Producer, so we can ignore that. OK, it's random - or, to be more precise, it is not clearly repeatable. And it does not occur in all projects, but we cannot be sure of that because all might fail given time. And when it fails, it always flatlines the ProChannel EQ on ALL tracks, not just some tracks. I'm assuming you have thought what the ones that fail have in common. There really has to be something that is causing it (sorry for stating the obvious).
post edited by jpetersen - 2016/01/16 18:31:59
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Musikslayer
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/16 19:15:29
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Thanks for responding. jpetersen
There's no ProChannel-specific dll in C:\Program Files\Cakewalk\SONAR X3 Producer, so we can ignore that.
Do you happen to know what the .dll version is in X3e anything? Mine is 1.2.2.246, Dean Capper said it should be 1.2.2.323. I have no idea if that matters, it's all I have to go on at the moment. OK, it's random - or, to be more precise, it is not clearly repeatable.
And it does not occur in all projects, but we cannot be sure of that because all might fail given time.
And when it fails, it always flatlines the ProChannel EQ on ALL tracks, not just some tracks.
I'm assuming you have thought what the ones that fail have in common. All that seems correct. All eq-gone to flat line. Nothing sticks out as common or uncommon, my projects are really, really similar. They are all audio (at this point), very few plugs, all shipped with Sonar. I use the Nomad Factory reverb (ouch) and few few others. Boost 11 on the master, which I'll take off before I export for mastering. I'm not sure how many projects are affected, it would be hard to tell at this point. I eq-ed one this morning. Just opened it: EQ is flat. It's insane. It's unusable.
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tenfoot
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/16 19:17:46
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jpetersen
There's no ProChannel-specific dll in C:\Program Files\Cakewalk\SONAR X3 Producer, so we can ignore that.
It was Dean Capper from Cakewalk who suggested that you might have the wrong dll, so I would suggest if it is still incorrect and you can't find the right one it is certainly worth following up with him.
Bruce. Sonar Platinum 2017-09, Studio One 3.5.3, Win 10 x64, Quad core i7, RME Fireface, Behringer X32 Producer, Behringer X32 Rack, Presonus Faderport, Lemure Software Controller (Android), Enttec DMXIS VST lighting controller, Xtempo POK.
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Musikslayer
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Re: Does X3 Studio stink?
2016/01/16 19:24:18
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tenfoot
jpetersen
There's no ProChannel-specific dll in C:\Program Files\Cakewalk\SONAR X3 Producer, so we can ignore that.
It was Dean Capper from Cakewalk who suggested that you might have the wrong dll, so I would suggest if it is still incorrect and you can't find the right one it is certainly worth following up with him.
Thanks, I plan to. I'll file a fancypants report and all. I'm trying to make sense out of it and I can't: the X3e update gave me a "new" .dll that's exactly the same as the old one. I'm at a loss as to how that can be. How bout this: Does anyone here use X3e? If so, could you do me a huge favor and check what version of the Prochannel .dll you have?? Thank you.
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