Does this chorus work?

Howdy all.  I'm pretty new to songwriting still and I'm not sure if this chorus works.  
 
I was going for a dark, sludgy kind of thing to start, then want to let the verses build to a brighter, happier chorus.
So my question is does this chorus work, or is it 'too happy' for the rest of the track?
 
I have also listened to this song about 8 million times and have no idea if the mix is working, so any comments on that would be great as well.
 
https://soundcloud.com/cy...arkness-falling-down-2
 
new version here (wee changes to biggify pesky choruses)  https://soundcloud.com/cy...arkness-falling-down-3
 
Thanks a bunch!

Well hell.  If that doesn't sound like a chorus, I"m in bigger trouble than I thought!

I love your voice, its coming onto a Chris Cornell sound!
 
It is quite hard to make out here what the actual chorus is and where. Im guessing that it was the section with the more melodic chords etc. I loved it, but then I like more sweet sounding stuff, it just needs a differentiation, a quickfix would be the addition of a higher harmony and maybe add another guitar at a higher octave and.... maybe even a running hihat to help it stand out??!!
 
it started out average but I was loving this track by the end.
 
Cian

Listening again I can hear a line trying to be a chorus as the tonality goes major. But, as is, it is just 2 lines in the song. 
Maybe build into it by repeating the "when you said" like 2 or 3 times rythmically  (shorter notes though).
And at least double the length of the "chorus". I say this cause you want a "chorus" which by definition is more of a sing-a-long type thingy.
 
I wouldn't get hung up on whether it sounds chorusy or not though except for maybe educational benefits. It is what it is.
 

Actually, I like this song as is because it's NOT formulaic.  You had the vision to do it in a manner that's not the usual way, for many people.  It does remind me somewhat of Soundgarden or Chris Cornell, and they made a good living at breaking the mold.  I'd turn the vocal up a notch or two because your voice is the highlight of this song, though the instrumentation is quite good, too.  I do admire people who break a few rules from time to time.

This feedback is great.  Like many of you I live in a music bubble, with no one to bounce with.  
 
Lynn:  Thanks. I was going for a somewhat unpredictable thing, but I still wanted there to be a clear chorus that was larger and tonally brighter.  
James and Whack:  Thnks.  James, your idea to strip down the verse a bit is dead on.  I think I may give this a go.
Timidi:  Thanks for the insights. I think you got me listening like I hadn't heard it 100 times before, and that ain't easy!
Speedtom:  You nailed it with the phrase "chorus blooms in the way it deserves".  That is exactly what I am going for with the way the verses build to the chorus.  I think I just built the "prechorus" up too much, and left no where to go for the actual chorus.
 
You all rock.
 
 
 

Timidi has a point:
"I wouldn't get hung up on whether it sounds chorusy or not though except for maybe educational benefits. It is what it is."
 
It sounds great and fits in the song really nice. Call it a B-part or whatever. It doesn't matter as long as it sounds good. Nice voice you have there!

I too thought the "chorus" was there at 1:10 ish... I didn't really hear it repeat further along....although it might have. I'd need to listen and become familiar with the song to pick that out.
 
I like the song...and think it works for that genre as unstructured as it seems to be. Of course, some genre's are more prone to needing to comply with structure standards.... country for example and classic rock.
 
As I see things (through my country colored glasses) a chorus should have a melody that is noticeably different from the verses and it should also have a rise in energy and note range as well.  If the verses are busy, you make the chorus a bit more laid back and vice versa. I also feel that a listener should be able to know and understand from listening, that they are in a verse or in a chorus at any given point in the song. It was pretty much impossible for me to determine this in your song.... I kept trying to figure it out.... I did pick up the change at 1:10 and thought OK... chorus.... but then I got "lost" again.
 
Don't beat yourself up over this issue. These are just the way I see things in song structure. My songs tend to be very structured. You should always know where you are when listening to something I wrote. That may be good or bad, but it's how I write.

Hey I like this one!  I am in agreement with Lynn on this one.  I like it when rules and convention are tweeked a bit.  Guess that is why I liked the early electric Blues, early R&R, and early Punk.  I enjoyed this number and ya, I agree, your vocals are very good!!

sven450
Funny story:  You guys are all really awesome in your compliments about the singing.  I, on the other hand, was about to scrap the whole thing because I couldn't get it the way I wanted.  The vocal track on this song is actually the scratch track that I recorded with an sm58 sitting at my computer with the monitors blaring two feet away.
 
Afterwards, I kept trying to re-record the vox with my "real" mic and preamp, and I just couldn't get it.  I ended up just keeping the scratch track and doing a lot of slip editing to get rid of all the bleed from the monitors.  From there it was lots of eq and compression and all that jazz.  Just cracks me up that the BS take of me sitting there in my jammies with a beer in one hand belting in front of the cranked monitors actually is what works in the song.  Weird.
 
BTW, and took the totally disparate advice of everyone, and mainly went with the "if it works don't overthink it" idea.  I did make some little changes to the two choruses to "biggify" them a wee bit.  It is subtle, but just maybe it will help people find those pesky choruses (now easily located at 1:10 and 2:29!!)  
 
https://soundcloud.com/cy...arkness-falling-down-3
 
Thanks again everyone.
 
 

hehe, what a story. Maybe I should try this method of singing, too!
 
I will listen to the new version later, for I am at work right now. Looking forward to it!

I wont load for me :(  But from the point of view of going from dark verse to bright chorus,the idea is good...it all depends on what story you are telling !!!

sven450
Funny story:  You guys are all really awesome in your compliments about the singing.  I, on the other hand, was about to scrap the whole thing because I couldn't get it the way I wanted.  The vocal track on this song is actually the scratch track that I recorded with an sm58 sitting at my computer with the monitors blaring two feet away.
 
Afterwards, I kept trying to re-record the vox with my "real" mic and preamp, and I just couldn't get it.  I ended up just keeping the scratch track and doing a lot of slip editing to get rid of all the bleed from the monitors.  From there it was lots of eq and compression and all that jazz.  Just cracks me up that the BS take of me sitting there in my jammies with a beer in one hand belting in front of the cranked monitors actually is what works in the song.  Weird.
 
BTW, and took the totally disparate advice of everyone, and mainly went with the "if it works don't overthink it" idea.  I did make some little changes to the two choruses to "biggify" them a wee bit.  It is subtle, but just maybe it will help people find those pesky choruses (now easily located at 1:10 and 2:29!!)  
 
https://soundcloud.com/cy...arkness-falling-down-3
 
Thanks again everyone.
 
 

I find it real hard to do "real" takes anymore. Pretty much everything I've done in the last 10 years is scratch tracks. Well, at least from the original inspiration while I'm in the zone.
I blame it on, like you said, listening 100 times. And, time going by. At that point, you're just trying to replicate what is. So, why bother. I try to keep that in mind so to at least have clean tracks to work with.
 
Goes along with the feeling , to me, that once something is recorded, it's dead. It's not alive anymore. Before it's recorded it has vision and hope and possibilities. After, not so much. So, it's good to finish a tune before you hit record.

There was some good useful feedback from the previous posters as well as consensus on the vocal talent. Great example of what a forum can do for you. I was inspired by the positive vibe to give the song a listen and had a slightly different take that may help round out the previous suggestions. 
 
1. There are no rules. Conventional song structures "work" for a reason, but I find my favorite songs (including Beatles) -don't- follow a convention. That  being said, you were looking for some ideas, always a great thing to do. 
 
2. My interpretation of your request was to find a way to create more "contrast" between the "verse" and "chorus". Typically this might be desirable if you are looking to make the song more "interesting" by providing a greater range of "emotional dynamics". (Don't mean to get too academic here, but we're stuck using words.) The "dynamics" can be achieved in the ways previously mentioned (such as make the verse more "versie") Another couple of arrangement options to think about are; 
- change up the instrumentation for verse or chorus to enhance the "contrast". I.e. perhaps some arpeggio guitar lines in a higher register to "lighten" it a bit. Might help to change the rhythm guitar sound, or mix in a cleaner tone track. 
- some shift in the percussion (repeating a good point made before on the high hat)
- consider widening the sonic stage with b/u vox panned wide left and right + delay, etc
 
3. Glad to hear you're finding that performance is trumping gear. Truly the essence of any good song, and a welcome relief from all the gear happy discussions elsewhere. I finally learned that -any- piece of gear is just a tool with a certain sound, and if it works, it works. Marketing can often get in the way of how something actually sounds. Does not matter how much it cost. 
 
It might be interesting to try another song with the same approach. You may be on to something. 
 
4. And then again, you're goal may be to maintain that driving grinding type of groove throughout, in which case you might want to think about working on some variations in the drum grooves. 
 
5. And yes, highlight the vocals. That's the "hook", if you care. 
 
keep at it. 
 

equality
Get Nirvana vibes from this. Distinct chorus or not, who cares as long as the tune is good? And it is. As pointed out, your vocal is also great and expressive, great for this genre. Put on some vocal harmonies on the chorus parts if you want to put the spotlight on it. It's not too happy either. Funny, I had just the reciprocal problem with this song and still have with chorus dark and merky while the verses were too happy: https://app.box.com/s/sggt67fi7by0bv9mu5wj
 

Cool song, and it is the perfect inverse of my problem!  But for you at least the vocal in the chorus is singing about dark stuff, so it sort of make sense to have the chorus darker, but yeah, big discrepancy there.  Nice solo!

Yes!  It absolutely works.  No doubt.  This is the best tune I've heard all night (and I just got done fawning all over Batsbrew's Moonshine, you should check that one out if you haven't already). 
 
Man..this song has that off-thing going on in both the verses and chorus, it totally works.  At the last second that chorus has that commercial quality on that line "..what I'm gonna do" and "...falling down around me and you". 
 
Your voice fits very well, and I like the off melodies you're going for all throughout...damn good writing and singing.
 
And now I just listened to Happiness Is A Warm Gun...I'm a John Lennon / Beatles nutcase!  You just did that?  I can't believe I just heard one of my favs from the white album remade like that...wow...you kick ass man.  Totally got my respect.