Recording Acoustic Drums, Need Help!!

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XxBoRGxX
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2007/04/30 04:46:25 (permalink)

Recording Acoustic Drums, Need Help!!

Alright, I am not 100% sure if this is the forum to post on. I am ordering microphones for my drum set and also a Sonar program. I was wondering if anyone could help explain to me what I will have to do. I know how to set up mics for my kit, but what do I need to buy to plug the mics into, and then how do I get that to my computer to record the tracks on my PC. My band's guitarist has one of those pod things and has been riffing through it, onto his computer. Would I just need something like a pod with more channels?

Thanks Ahead of Time,

Borg
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    CJaysMusic
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    RE: Recording Acoustic Drums, Need Help!! 2007/04/30 05:32:11 (permalink)
    since your going to be using mic's, your going to need a soundcard or audio interface/mixer with probably atleast 8 mic pre's. you probably looking at a card or interfce thats going to cost $500 to almost $1500. These are the good ones you should be looking at, RME, Motu, and Lynx. Do not skinp on this item. It is one of the most import things in your signal chain.
    Cj

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    yep
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    RE: Recording Acoustic Drums, Need Help!! 2007/04/30 09:48:05 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: XxBoRGxX

    Alright, I am not 100% sure if this is the forum to post on. I am ordering microphones for my drum set and also a Sonar program. I was wondering if anyone could help explain to me what I will have to do. I know how to set up mics for my kit, but what do I need to buy to plug the mics into, and then how do I get that to my computer to record the tracks on my PC. My band's guitarist has one of those pod things and has been riffing through it, onto his computer. Would I just need something like a pod with more channels?

    Thanks Ahead of Time,

    Borg

    There are a ton of ways to deal with this, and finding the best technique will require a certain amount of trial-and-error, since the room you record in and the specific balance of kit pieces affects the recording quite a bit.

    To answer your basic question, yeah, you would want a multi-input sound card (oftne called an "audio interface") with enough inputs for all the mics (prolly an 8-input one is good). There are a lot of options in every price range.

    Something like a Presonus firestudio will have built-in mic preamps so you can just plug your mics in and go. Something like a MOTU 828 mkII will require you to have some seperate mic preamps, which could come from an inexpensive mixer or from something like a Mackie Onyx or a Behringer Ultragain. If money is no object you could purchase an RME fireface soundcard and an assortment of premium outboard preamps and have absolutely world-class sound quality...

    Here is so0me advice I posted elsewhere on this forum about shopping for soundcards:

    Most of the soundcards people discuss on these boards have respectable sound quality for the price range and low latency (as long as you steer clear of USB 1.1-- USB 2 is fine).

    That said, here are some of the other things that really make a difference within a given price range:

    1. Extra features. Some sound cards have all kinds of cool auxilliary features, such as integrated software-controlled mixers or onboard effects, or built-in limiters on the preamps or insert jacks so you can use an outboard compressor or whatever. These can be a lifesaver if you need them, or a big waste of money if you don't, and may complicate the operation fo the soundcard for the stuff you need to do every day. It's better to buy a soundcard that does the things you need it to do really well, than to pay for a lot of potentially confusing features that you don't need.

    2. Number and type of outputs. Extra outputs are a handy thing to have, especially if your soundcard has internal mixing/routing capabilities. The ability to have all your inputs constantly connected to say, a hardware tuner can be surprisingly useful. And as your studio and ambitions grow, the ability to listen to one version of the mix while your singer or whoever hears a different version in her headphones starts to become indispensible. Having more than one set of headphone outputs is also convenient if you want to keep things small and simple. And if you ever want to use hardware effects during mixdown, you pretty much have to have extra outputs.

    3. Number and type of inputs/preamps. Most pro and semi-pro soundcards these days seem to come with two mic/instrument preamps and a bunch of line inputs. If you already have preamps that you're happy with, then those built-in preamps are pretty useless, although they don't hurt anything. If you don't have and don't plan to buy additional preamps, then the line inputs are practially useless for most conventional recording applications. But keep in mind that chances are very good that if you stick with this long enough to actually be using 8 or ten inputs simultaneously, you'll probably pick up some specialized outboard preamps. Preamps should include phantom power. Ribbon mics require better-than-average preamps, usually outboard ones with high gain and variable impedance.

    4. Portability and swappability. Chances are pretty good that some point down the road, you'll want to record someplace else. With laptops getting better and cheaper every day, buying a soundcard with a simple and easy firewire or USB 2 connection makes a lot of sense, all else being equal.

    5. Ease-of-use and "hidden" compatibility issues. When you find a soundcard that looks like it has what you want, run a quick search on the forums and message boards to see what kinds of complaints/issues people are having with it. Some soundcards don't get along with some chipsets, some soundcard drivers seem particularly finicky or buggy, and so on. Every soundcard always has SOMEBODY complaining about something, but what you really want to look out for is long and/or repeated complaints about similar problems from experienced users that don't have a clear fix.

    6. Age of the soundcard and upgrades. Soundcards, like everything else in audio, continue to shoot up in quality while dropping in price. At some point in time, you will probably want to replace whatever you get. Higher-quality, specialized cards from well-respected manufacturers such as MOTU, M-Audio, and Apogee tend to hold their "ebay value" quite well, and can often be re-sold two or three years later for close to the original purchase price. "beginner" cards and "do-it-all" cards with lots of bells and whistles tend to lose their value faster as newer models come out with more bells and whistles. In any price range, sound quality tends to hold its value better than extra features do.

    As you look for advice, keep in mind that most people have not really used very many soundcards, even experienced or professional users. When people say "I have such-and-such and it's awesome," that may be the only soundcard they've ever used on a day-to-day basis, other than built-in ones that came with a computer. By the same token, magazines and professional reviewers may be able to compare more soundcards, but they probably haven't tested those soundcards on lots of different systems. A soundcard that they fell in love with on their custom-built audio supercomputer may have tons of angry users out there who can't get it to work with HP office machines and so on. So lean towards trusting the magazines/pro reviewers for information on sound quality and features, and check the message boards and online forums for information on reliability and compatibility.

    Cheers.
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    Joe Bravo
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    RE: Recording Acoustic Drums, Need Help!! 2007/05/01 17:28:04 (permalink)
    You know, when you're first starting with all this DAW stuff it really helps if you have a good book with some photos and diagrams so you can actually see what certain interfaces look like etc. There's a bunch of them on the market now; I would browse through a few at the bookstore if I were you. You can get a lot of information on-line, but so much of it is either incorrect (too darn many teenagers on the internet with websites!), poorly laid out, or lacking in visuals that I would stick with a good book if it were me, at least to get started with.
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    Thomas Campitelli
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    RE: Recording Acoustic Drums, Need Help!! 2007/05/01 20:32:32 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: XxBoRGxX
    Alright, I am not 100% sure if this is the forum to post on. I am ordering microphones for my drum set and also a Sonar program. I was wondering if anyone could help explain to me what I will have to do. I know how to set up mics for my kit, but what do I need to buy to plug the mics into, and then how do I get that to my computer to record the tracks on my PC. My band's guitarist has one of those pod things and has been riffing through it, onto his computer. Would I just need something like a pod with more channels?

    Thanks Ahead of Time,

    Borg


    I would tread carefully in these waters. Based on what you said in your post, you are probably a bit new to recording. This being the case, are you sure you need Sonar? Sonar starts at $300 and goes to $500 for the Producer version. That's a lot of money to spend if you don't know what a mic preamp is. Note, I am not being dismissive or confrontational here. There's a ton of things to learn if you just want to make a bad-sounding recording, let alone a good one.

    Consider one of Cakewalk's other programs, such as Sonar Home Studio. You may want to look into Reaper. It's free for evaluation purposes, and between $40 and $200 depending on how you use it. Do as much research as you can before you buy. This is an expensive hobby.

    Thomas Campitelli
    http://www.crysknifeband.com
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    jacktheexcynic
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    RE: Recording Acoustic Drums, Need Help!! 2007/05/01 23:05:07 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: Thomas Campitelli
    ORIGINAL: XxBoRGxX
    Alright, I am not 100% sure if this is the forum to post on. I am ordering microphones for my drum set and also a Sonar program. I was wondering if anyone could help explain to me what I will have to do. I know how to set up mics for my kit, but what do I need to buy to plug the mics into, and then how do I get that to my computer to record the tracks on my PC. My band's guitarist has one of those pod things and has been riffing through it, onto his computer. Would I just need something like a pod with more channels?

    Thanks Ahead of Time,

    Borg


    I would tread carefully in these waters. Based on what you said in your post, you are probably a bit new to recording. This being the case, are you sure you need Sonar? Sonar starts at $300 and goes to $500 for the Producer version. That's a lot of money to spend if you don't know what a mic preamp is. Note, I am not being dismissive or confrontational here. There's a ton of things to learn if you just want to make a bad-sounding recording, let alone a good one.

    Consider one of Cakewalk's other programs, such as Sonar Home Studio. You may want to look into Reaper. It's free for evaluation purposes, and between $40 and $200 depending on how you use it. Do as much research as you can before you buy. This is an expensive hobby.


    some good advice there. cakewalk is pretty good about upgrading from different versions to sonar so if you start out with home studio you can upgrade to sonar for less than buying sonar outright (if you don't already own registered cakewalk software): hs 6, $139, upgrade to sonar 6 producer $349 from home studio = $488.

    my gear buying advice is always the same - don't buy something unless you know why it will help you improve your recordings. yep's list of soundcard features is a good place to start on that front but you need to make sure you understand the basics before shelling out the cash.

    - jack the ex-cynic
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