Adding Program Changes in tracks

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ryedowitz
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2008/01/08 08:05:42 (permalink)

Adding Program Changes in tracks

Hello all,
I tried to add a program change in the middle of a track in Sonar PE7. I'm using the Dimension LE soft synth and I added the program change using the EDIT>BANK/PATCH change. Sonar does add the program change but I can't actually get it to change the patch. Also, I can't figure out how to choose the patch I want since there's no option to see a list of the actual patches available in Dimension LE. This seems like it should be simple. Any ideas?
Regards,
Rob
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10 Replies Related Threads

    CKR
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    RE: Adding Program Changes in tracks 2008/01/08 08:50:41 (permalink)
    Hi Rob,

    I have been wondering myself if it is possible.
    My gues is that it can't be done with a VST plugin. If you have a large patch that needs to load in the middle of your song its going to cause a glitch for a few seconds to load before it will continue.
    I am under the impression it can only be done with and external midi devices (sound modules) where you can choose patch changes on the same channel.
    I think you will have to load another instance of the actual VST plugin to choose a different patch in your song.

    Regards
    Conrad
    #2
    techead
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    RE: Adding Program Changes in tracks 2008/01/08 18:18:20 (permalink)
    Dimension family does not recongize patch change or bank select.
    #3
    ryedowitz
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    RE: Adding Program Changes in tracks 2008/01/08 21:42:04 (permalink)
    Thanks for your reply, Conrad.
    I expected that there must be a way to do it, but your logic makes sense- It does seem that the software can't do a program change instantaneously like a "real" synth can. I love working with the software synths but that is a step backward if it can't be done. I've been putting program changes in the middle of tracks for the full 20 years or so that I've been messing with MIDI...
    Rob
    #4
    ryedowitz
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    RE: Adding Program Changes in tracks 2008/01/08 21:44:15 (permalink)
    So it's true, there's no way to do what I was asking. What then, is the recommended workaround? Do I have to keep adding more synths to the song? Kind of a bummer if that's the case...
    Thanks,
    Rob
    #5
    DayDrumFour
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    RE: Adding Program Changes in tracks 2008/01/08 23:13:55 (permalink)
    Dimension family does not recongize patch change or bank select.


    Bummer.

    Even DS864, a Project5 sampler, responds to patch change commands.

    Looking to upgrade to DimensionPro. This is not a deal-breaker, it just make me wonder if there are other synths that can do it.

    I have authentic analog drum machine samples.
    #6
    CKR
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    RE: Adding Program Changes in tracks 2008/01/09 02:29:06 (permalink)
    Hi Rob,

    http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2891964
    http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2431533

    Found these links on KVR. It seems possible but there is all sorts of problems eg. can only use up to 127 patches. If the VST has all its patches in one bank, you can only use the first 127 or 128. There is an option with some VST's to create groups of banks of 127 patches. The question is where to find the controller number to choose that bank and I'm wondering if you should create an instrument defenition file? If I find anything will let you know.

    conrad
    post edited by CKR - 2008/01/09 02:48:41
    #7
    techead
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    RE: Adding Program Changes in tracks 2008/01/09 18:23:05 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: DayDrumFour

    Dimension family does not recongize patch change or bank select.


    Bummer.

    Even DS864, a Project5 sampler, responds to patch change commands.

    Looking to upgrade to DimensionPro. This is not a deal-breaker, it just make me wonder if there are other synths that can do it.

    It is an issue of practicality. Program change and Bank Select are for synths that have everything preloaded into RAM (ie older hardware synths). You can't really do that with huge Dimension samplesets--you wouldn't have enough RAM for more than a small number of patches; and the "change" time loading direct from disk would be horrendously long. If it were streaming audio from disk that might be another matter.
    #8
    lawapa
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    RE: Adding Program Changes in tracks 2008/01/09 23:40:52 (permalink)
    If your RAM falls short in a project and it can with many tracks and large sample sets a work around is to bounce to track to free up RAM space/Archive the midi/audio track for edits and go.

    Running several instances of Dpro should not bog down you system if you have the RAM to load the samples.

    Techead has it right. This is not a backwards limiting factor. Patch/bank changes are for rinky tink GM synths where the full patch might max out at few kilobytes and does not involve sample sets. Dimension is not a GM compatable synth but has a midi matrix that is to die for. This is real control over almost everything.

    For me Dimension is a forward thinking sampler built around a live performance spec, solid as a rock and has Perks that if you use them give great control in a small footprint.
    #9
    ryedowitz
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    RE: Adding Program Changes in tracks 2008/01/10 21:48:37 (permalink)
    Thanks for the feedback. I just added another 2GB of RAM so hopefully I'll be good with adding more instances of the synth. It is a really good synth.
    Rob
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    techead
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    RE: Adding Program Changes in tracks 2008/01/10 22:18:55 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: ryedowitz

    Thanks for the feedback. I just added another 2GB of RAM so hopefully I'll be good with adding more instances of the synth. It is a really good synth.
    Rob

    By the way, Dimension is good at managing its memory use. That is to say, if you load 5 instances of Dimension into tracks in your host and then load the same piano patch in all 5 instances then Dimension overall only loads the piano multisamples once--the 5 instances share the same multisample memory.
    #11
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