How to make something sounds from above/below (using EQ)

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DreamzCatcher
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2008/09/11 23:18:51 (permalink)

How to make something sounds from above/below (using EQ)

I want to know if it possible at all to make something sound totally from above using EQ (and maybe a compressor too) only.

it's obvious that 'low' means down, 'mids' mean middle and 'highs' means up, but this is kinda tricky...because even if I leave only the highs it still doesn't sound from above...

are there specific known frequencies that can emphasize the sound's position?

any other thoughts/tips are welcome.

important note: I try to control individual sounds, unlike in the mix which is easier to do because we can use an instrument to emphasize other instrument's position in the space.
post edited by DreamzCatcher - 2008/09/11 23:20:10

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    droddey
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    RE: How to make something sounds from above/below (using EQ) 2008/09/12 00:17:55 (permalink)
    It would depend very much on a vertical speaker alignment and the person being at just the right ear height relative to the speakers, and probably a near field type of configuration. I have those conditions, well I used to now I have the speakers on their sides, and I would commonly get that effect.

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    DreamzCatcher
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    RE: How to make something sounds from above/below (using EQ) 2008/09/13 00:55:03 (permalink)

    "Don't forget to imagine."
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    nostredummass
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    RE: How to make something sounds from above/below (using EQ) 2008/09/13 01:12:53 (permalink)
    Not sure if anyone here has ever tried SpinAudio 3dPanner Studio
    Placed on each individual audio track, it can help to place each instrument "spacially" in a 3 dimensional context (up/down-forward/backwards).
    While a couple of people have told me they find a loss of sound quality, I love the freedom it gives me to separate and differentiate each instrument.
    I use it with a stereo expander/contractor to limit each instruments' "width"
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    DreamzCatcher
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    RE: How to make something sounds from above/below (using EQ) 2008/09/13 02:11:39 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: nostredummass

    Not sure if anyone here has ever tried SpinAudio 3dPanner Studio
    Placed on each individual audio track, it can help to place each instrument "spacially" in a 3 dimensional context (up/down-forward/backwards).
    While a couple of people have told me they find a loss of sound quality, I love the freedom it gives me to separate and differentiate each instrument.
    I use it with a stereo expander/contractor to limit each instruments' "width"


    I have Wave Arts Panorama
    but I also like to know if there are specific harmonics/frequencing that can help to improve it (perhaps I need to boost/cut/notch widely/narrowly) ?

    I also noticed that phasing can help to do this, any formal approval ?

    please give me some tips

    "Don't forget to imagine."
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    Philip
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    RE: How to make something sounds from above/below (using EQ) 2008/09/13 06:05:17 (permalink)
    "Above/Below" may require psychological factors, vs. EQ factors.

    "Tweets" may sound above ... as may "wind".

    Certain low bass sounds may 'appear' omnipresent (above and below).

    (...Just a thought)

    Philip  
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    Beagle
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    RE: How to make something sounds from above/below (using EQ) 2008/09/13 08:01:05 (permalink)
    you might be able to get something workable out of the SONITUS SURROUND FX. it's a 3D sound FX, so you might could find some setting that will make it sound like that clip is above you.

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    Rbh
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    RE: How to make something sounds from above/below (using EQ) 2008/09/14 01:01:16 (permalink)
    Location of sounds from above and below have mostly to do with how sound reflects in the outer shapes of the ear above and below the main opening of the ear canal. There's very fine time delay and reflections in how your ears are shaped for that kind of location.
    I don't think it would be trivial to simulate something of that sort using sources located on a plane normal to the average listening position.

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    Middleman
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    RE: How to make something sounds from above/below (using EQ) 2008/09/14 01:44:14 (permalink)
    As a part of the human race your brain is wired to hear left and right but with the help of walls you can track up and down, you immediately move your face towards where you think the sound is coming from re-orienting your ears so that the sound is facing you, whether that be up in the sky or down in a well.

    Speakers are left and right with the tweeter on top and the woofer on the bottom. So let's walk through this. You can simulate far right and far left by centralizing a sound in the stereo field then putting some reverb or delay out to the left or right. That would trick the ears into thinking a sound is coming from far left or right. To make a sound appear above, (I am not sure how far above with only two speakers), but anyway... On the primary sound try cutting all the bass up to about 500-600Hz, keep it panned in the middle and dry. Add a reverb or delay and cut everything below say 1000HZ in this as well. That keeps the sound at least mostly up in the tweeters with the effect a little higher possibly. Make sure you use a mono reverb or delay, not stereo version this will keep it behind the source in the same direction. Keep it bright. This should get you close but there is something else you can try. Put a very small room delay or verb with very short predelay, less the 20ms, on the dry sound. Do not let this small room effect run out into the mono verb. This means you will have to put things on a parallel bus.

    By giving the drier sound a small room feel and the mono verb very bright and spacious, that should push things at least in your brains interpretation up in front and above. No guarantees but that would be my approach. Going to play with this now.

    I don't thing you want to use acoustic phase as an approach because it just breaks down in mono where your music could end up on a speaker in a hotel or worse. If its just for your friends on decent speakers, then it is an option.

    Also, this will not work on headphones. Single source speakers can't place frequences up down or any direction, basically two mono sources left and right.




    post edited by Middleman - 2008/09/14 01:48:21

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    DreamzCatcher
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    RE: How to make something sounds from above/below (using EQ) 2008/09/14 01:55:36 (permalink)
    listen to my first attempt
    http://boomp3.com/listen/c0xulqn1x_p/spatial-eq

    I didn't give it too much attention yet, but you can hear the effect, or at least its potential.

    used only EQ.
    tell me what do you think...

    edit: link fixed.
    post edited by DreamzCatcher - 2008/09/14 02:05:34

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    Middleman
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    RE: How to make something sounds from above/below (using EQ) 2008/09/14 01:58:54 (permalink)
    Ok, just tried this and it works, marginally. About the highest I could make it appear was at approximately 30 degrees above my eyes. It was a rough call as to where it was exactly in the stereo field but the only way to get it higher would be to have a sound source i.e. speaker above my head. This is just a limitation of the medium i.e. a speaker left and right. You can get the sound up in the tweeters and the mono reverb does help but its a bit indistinct overall. The result will have as much to do with the placement of your speakers in relation to your ear as the approach.

    Anxious to see what others come up with.

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    Middleman
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    RE: How to make something sounds from above/below (using EQ) 2008/09/14 02:00:35 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: DreamzCatcher

    listen to my first attempt
    http://boomp3.com/listen/c0xud8ham_3/spatial-eq

    I didn't give it too much attention yet, but you can hear the effect, or at least its potential.

    used only EQ.
    tell me what do you think...


    I hear the sound moving left and right with some of the ambiance just above, that was in headphones, so you did well.

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    DreamzCatcher
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    RE: How to make something sounds from above/below (using EQ) 2008/09/14 02:08:19 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: Middleman


    ORIGINAL: DreamzCatcher

    listen to my first attempt
    http://boomp3.com/listen/c0xud8ham_3/spatial-eq

    I didn't give it too much attention yet, but you can hear the effect, or at least its potential.

    used only EQ.
    tell me what do you think...


    I hear the sound moving left and right with some of the ambiance just above, that was in headphones, so you did well.



    yipee :D
    I still miss lots of knowledge in order to control it perfectly, any tip is welcome!

    I will make a coffee and then I read all the replies in depth.

    "Don't forget to imagine."
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