EQ Tactics ...

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Philip
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2008/09/17 22:42:16 (permalink)

EQ Tactics ...

What's you're latest thoughts on EQ? ... and/or

Which equilizers do you use (not use)? ...and/or

Do any of you use repeated instances of Ozone3 EQ module ... if so, how many? ... and/or

Do you oft use S7 track or bus EQs?

Thanks in advance for any of your thoughts, thus.


Philip  
(Isa 5:12 And the harp, and the viol, the tabret, and pipe, and wine, are in their feasts: but they regard not the work of the LORD)

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    bitflipper
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    RE: EQ Tactics ... 2008/09/18 11:11:19 (permalink)
    I do not use multiple instances of Ozone in series because the CPU load is too much. There have been occasions when I've used two EQs on one track/bus, in which case I use something lighter for the second EQ, such as the Sonitus.

    I usually do use two instances - and just two - of Ozone EQ on most projects: one on the vocal bus and one on the instrument bus. I do not use it on the master bus, and in fact normally do not use any EQ at all on the master. This lets me EQ the instruments and vocals separately, which works better because they need to be somewhat complementary. For example, I might take a chunk out of the vocals around 3-4KHz to make them sound smoother (my mic seems to accentuate this region), but then boost the instrument EQ slightly in that same range. I might also give the high end (10KHz+) some boost on the instrument bus, but that kind of boost doesn't suit my voice, which benefits more from cutting the highs.

    My favorite track EQ is Voxengo GlissEQ, mainly because it incorporates a spectral display. I do not like the spectral display as much in Ozone because it's too small. I'll often throw Voxengo SPAN on after Ozone so I can better see what's going on.



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    lhansen
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    RE: EQ Tactics ... 2008/09/18 12:16:10 (permalink)
    I use the track (sonitus eq) for cutting only.

    For boosting, I'll use a more 'musical' sounding eq like voxengo, uad-1 neve stuff that incorporate a bit of 'flavor'.


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    Philip
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    RE: EQ Tactics ... 2008/09/18 20:40:16 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: bitflipper

    I do not use multiple instances of Ozone in series because the CPU load is too much. There have been occasions when I've used two EQs on one track/bus, in which case I use something lighter for the second EQ, such as the Sonitus.

    I usually do use two instances - and just two - of Ozone EQ on most projects: one on the vocal bus and one on the instrument bus. I do not use it on the master bus, and in fact normally do not use any EQ at all on the master. This lets me EQ the instruments and vocals separately, which works better because they need to be somewhat complementary. For example, I might take a chunk out of the vocals around 3-4KHz to make them sound smoother (my mic seems to accentuate this region), but then boost the instrument EQ slightly in that same range. I might also give the high end (10KHz+) some boost on the instrument bus, but that kind of boost doesn't suit my voice, which benefits more from cutting the highs.

    My favorite track EQ is Voxengo GlissEQ, mainly because it incorporates a spectral display. I do not like the spectral display as much in Ozone because it's too small. I'll often throw Voxengo SPAN on after Ozone so I can better see what's going on.



    Wow, and I've been running about 5-8 instances of O3 per project (for the EQ primarily: Guitar, Guitar bus, instr, drums, master, etc)

    I see your logic, Bit; The 3-4KHz range is most sensitive to my ears, for many instruments ... hyper-clarity and such comes to mind.

    I'll have to check 10KHz boosts on instruments.

    I use the track (sonitus eq) for cutting only.

    For boosting, I'll use a more 'musical' sounding eq like voxengo, uad-1 neve stuff that incorporate a bit of 'flavor'

    Thank you for that, Larry ... I find myself discriminating more and more ... I'll check out the Voxengo.
    post edited by Philip - 2008/09/18 21:42:18

    Philip  
    (Isa 5:12 And the harp, and the viol, the tabret, and pipe, and wine, are in their feasts: but they regard not the work of the LORD)

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    Fog
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    RE: EQ Tactics ... 2008/09/18 22:03:05 (permalink)
    Philip , I do the same genre of music as the guy in this video and use the same sort of tricks.. the limiter helps me a lot.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6l1OVVc2K0

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    B_Nez
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    RE: EQ Tactics ... 2008/09/19 01:45:56 (permalink)
    I'm pretty fond of the Waves Renaissance EQ.

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    kwgm
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    RE: EQ Tactics ... 2008/09/19 01:47:04 (permalink)
    Mixing and mastering are different processes.

    For mixing / tracking, I use the built-in Sonitus EQ. It's a relatively transparent EQ that has a great user interface with precise controls that are easy to use, and because it's built-in, adding one to each track does not stress Sonar very much. Sometimes I'll add other EQ effects to the bin for additional color, for instance, Stillwell's 1973 or perhaps one of the Antress Vintage collection.

    Mastering is different, and like everyone else, I too use Ozone as a rule. I also use the Voxengo Gliss EQ and Elephant 2 limiter, I use Sonar's 64-bit phase linear EQ and Dynamics, as well as the builtin effects in my Yamaha digital mixer via a plugin called Final Master. I also use a few color tools here, and many of these are free for download. For instance, checkout Stardust, TSledge, or Endorphin (which is not quite a mastering limiter, but it has its uses). These are all excellent tools. Checkout Digital Fish Phones tools in general -- these are high quality, specialized tools for specific colorings.

    It's so hard to make generalizations -- every project, every sound environment is different and has its own challenges. The good news is that there are many many many tools to use these days, and so many tools are available for the price of a download, and the time you invest in studying its characteristics.


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    Philip
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    RE: EQ Tactics ... 2008/09/19 10:09:16 (permalink)
    Fog, I checked out the (O3) video and Danny Byrd's use of O3 intelligent limiter "for look-ahead non-pumping limiting" ... "transparency", etc. (which is my usual default) ... he does all his drum busses and master outputs with O3 limiting. (Of course this is an Izotope commercial!) He also plays down the 'mastering engineer', concerned that the ME would wreck his fine-limited productions. That seems definitely 'new school'. (Of course this is an Izotope commercial!)

    Thanks Wayne for your testimony on Waves Renaissance EQ.

    Mixing and mastering are different processes.

    For mixing / tracking, I use the built-in Sonitus EQ. It's a relatively transparent EQ that has a great user interface with precise controls that are easy to use, and because it's built-in, adding one to each track does not stress Sonar very much. Sometimes I'll add other EQ effects to the bin for additional color, for instance, Stillwell's 1973 or perhaps one of the Antress Vintage collection.

    Mastering is different, and like everyone else, I too use Ozone as a rule. I also use the Voxengo Gliss EQ and Elephant 2 limiter, I use Sonar's 64-bit phase linear EQ and Dynamics, as well as the builtin effects in my Yamaha digital mixer via a plugin called Final Master. I also use a few color tools here, and many of these are free for download. For instance, checkout Stardust, TSledge, or Endorphin (which is not quite a mastering limiter, but it has its uses). These are all excellent tools. Checkout Digital Fish Phones tools in general -- these are high quality, specialized tools for specific colorings.

    It's so hard to make generalizations -- every project, every sound environment is different and has its own challenges. The good news is that there are many many many tools to use these days, and so many tools are available for the price of a download, and the time you invest in studying its characteristics.

    Thanks much Kurt,
    You've really explored the gamut. You have a lot of generous diverse suggestions ... even beyond EQ! I see you use Sonitus quite a bit in tracks (vs Sonar track EQ) ... and you use the 64 EQ on the final master (which I've been using on final busses).

    I wonder if anyone is using Sonar Track-EQ anymore ... it supposedly gives really narrow notches of boost/reduction ... with Qs of 20+.

    A summary point: We are behooved to use EQ all over the place ... in our mixes and masters.
    post edited by Philip - 2008/09/19 11:39:04

    Philip  
    (Isa 5:12 And the harp, and the viol, the tabret, and pipe, and wine, are in their feasts: but they regard not the work of the LORD)

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    Fog
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    RE: EQ Tactics ... 2008/09/19 12:27:46 (permalink)
    True Philip.. but how it works with DnB and other sorts of music.. it's played in the clubs LONG before release.. to see how the crowd like it, so it used to be mastered (as it was cut on a dubplate or dj promo) ... now they try to save a few £ on the club version and also the fact dubplates are really expensive to cut and because they are one off cuts.. they damage / wear out far quicker than a normal record would.

    A lot of people have learned heaps from mastering people like George Peckham , who works for porkies (they mastered LOADS of records I own)
    post edited by Fog - 2008/09/19 12:30:50
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    Philip
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    RE: EQ Tactics ... 2008/09/19 16:49:40 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: Fog

    True Philip.. but how it works with DnB and other sorts of music.. it's played in the clubs LONG before release.. to see how the crowd like it, so it used to be mastered (as it was cut on a dubplate or dj promo) ... now they try to save a few £ on the club version and also the fact dubplates are really expensive to cut and because they are one off cuts.. they damage / wear out far quicker than a normal record would.

    A lot of people have learned heaps from mastering people like George Peckham , who works for porkies (they mastered LOADS of records I own)

    I see.

    To be sure, George Peckham would be so great to have in town; as would many salty MEs. I wonder about the garden varieties, here in Huntsville AL and places.

    Philip  
    (Isa 5:12 And the harp, and the viol, the tabret, and pipe, and wine, are in their feasts: but they regard not the work of the LORD)

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    Fog
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    RE: EQ Tactics ... 2008/09/19 17:22:33 (permalink)
    why the ? the cost of pressing vinyl isn't cheap.. so when it gets played in a club for a while, well that's pretty much market research for the artists (who a lot of them also DJ) .
    I posted a link of George at work a while ago, if you put that name into youtube it will turn up also. I've got a suspicion, dunno why DnB isn't the biggest selling thing where your from
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    Philip
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    RE: EQ Tactics ... 2008/09/19 18:12:23 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: Fog

    why the ? the cost of pressing vinyl isn't cheap.. so when it gets played in a club for a while, well that's pretty much market research for the artists (who a lot of them also DJ) .
    I posted a link of George at work a while ago, if you put that name into youtube it will turn up also. I've got a suspicion, dunno why DnB isn't the biggest selling thing where your from

    George Peckham

    The was because I suddenly realized how stupidly I hand-waved ME's.
    I saw that video by George P. a month or 2 ago ... I think he was stressing "that cool sound" and some basic mastering stuff. He's very generous with his pearls.

    I looked up DnB (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drum_and_bass) and am certainly interested in EQ techniques to enhance DnB in my mixes.
    Despite the apparent simplicity of drum and bass productions to the untrained ear, an inordinate amount of time is spent on preparing tracks by the more experienced producers.

    The genre places great importance on the "bass line", a deep sub-bass musical pattern which is felt physically as much as it is heard. There has also been considerable exploration of different timbres in the bass line region, particularly within techstep. Bass lines exist in many forms, but most notably they originate from sampled sources or synthesizers. Bass lines performed with a bass instrument, whether it is electric, acoustic or a double bass, are rare. Sampled basslines are often taken from double bass recordings or from publicly available loops. Synthesized bass lines are however just as common.


    Philip  
    (Isa 5:12 And the harp, and the viol, the tabret, and pipe, and wine, are in their feasts: but they regard not the work of the LORD)

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    Fog
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    RE: EQ Tactics ... 2008/09/20 15:11:02 (permalink)
    Philip, that wiki article to me is to be honest and written by someone who knows some of what was going on.. but left out a good bit of detail that was relevant

    I got into the music by fate or accident.. I grew up all of 10 minutes from about 5-6 of the labels that were at the forefront and when it was all kicking off.

    it's a bit like me talking about hhmm opera, I wouldn't as I'm not that informed.. that article is pretty clueless.

    this article is more clued up and FACTS.. (although not everything)

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/1xtra/events/xtrabass06/interact/timeline.shtml

    the wiki article mentions goldie.. yep he's a well know person within the scene.. but where he come from? reinforced (it's a record label that if people don't mention properly, you know they really don't know so much)

    hope you enjoy the other article more, by people who know what they are talking about.


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    Philip
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    RE: EQ Tactics ... 2008/09/20 17:18:54 (permalink)
    Thanks for that lead Fog;

    Thats a UK site, Fog ... it won't let me in some of the podcasts ... also, playing their samples requires RealPlayer, a RealCrummy adware-spam-infested player from all my past experience. I'd rather deal with YouTube, SoundClick and MySpace only for samples.

    I'm still interested in their be-labored approach to obtaining their sounds, for eclectic use of

    Philip  
    (Isa 5:12 And the harp, and the viol, the tabret, and pipe, and wine, are in their feasts: but they regard not the work of the LORD)

    Raised-Again 3http://soundclick.com/share.cfm?id=12307501
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    Fog
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    RE: EQ Tactics ... 2008/09/21 16:19:40 (permalink)
    BBC like other places have it locked to check your actually in the UK for listening. .much as the US websites for CBS etc

    theres plenty of the tunes on youtube though

    as for the sounds (and I'm not giving any secrets away) some of it was days of twisting sounds and bouncing them back into sampler from DAT tapes.

    Reinforced were known to have "lab coat" sessions where they would spend a few days mangling up sounds.. give them to their artists also, so there was some simularity and basically a "sound" that was theirs.

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    Philip
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    RE: EQ Tactics ... 2008/09/21 17:01:45 (permalink)
    Thanks for that, Fog.

    I found some great EQ tactics from Trance Production @ http://www.tranceproduction.com/technique/equalization2.html.

    John Moxey shares his basic EQ tactics at: http://www.songstuff.com/articles.php?selected=53

    Finally, Ethan Winer shares his take on the Art of Equalization: http://www.ethanwiner.com/equalizers.html

    To be sure, their awesome charts, together with their generous coherent conclusive thoughts on EQ ... currently leave me saturated with EQ tactics. I've printed 2 charts that should remain on my DAW till further notice.

    Philip  
    (Isa 5:12 And the harp, and the viol, the tabret, and pipe, and wine, are in their feasts: but they regard not the work of the LORD)

    Raised-Again 3http://soundclick.com/share.cfm?id=12307501
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    Fog
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    RE: EQ Tactics ... 2008/09/21 18:13:03 (permalink)
    I have a chart like that , it came from computer music mag. they normally include it on their DVD as a PDF file.. it's handy for general pointers.
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