quantumeffect
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Mastering Software Question
Hi, I am on a post X-mas shopping spree and wanted to solicit opinions on two moderately priced Mastering Suites: Ozone 3 and IK Multimedia's Mastering Bundle. Ozone is $199 through Sweetwater and the IK Bundle is the same price through Musiciansfriend. Does anybody have strong opinions either way. I have a home studio using Sonar 5 with a Delta 1010. For burning CD’s I have CD Architect 5. Additionally, I have three plug-ins that were purchased separately: KJAERHUS Audio’s MPL-1 Pro SE (limiter), the BBE Sonic Maximizer and Autotune. Thanks in advance for any advice. Dave
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AT
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/08 00:36:05
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YOu might take a look at Voxengo's stuff. http://www.voxengo.com/ He has packages - I got one for mastering, and basically you get 10% off the second piece of software, etc. Good stuff - I almost always use Elephant for mastering. There is a free trial (with beeps - boo).
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mudgel
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/08 01:54:58
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Ozone is without peer at the price. Soon to be upgraded to Version 4 for $79 for V3 owners. Are you talking about T-Racks. I also have the 1.5 version not the new V3 but find Ozone is much more comprehensive and better to use. Another point could be to look at upgrading to SONAR 8 PE. there's enough in there for an amateur home user to record/mix/master completely in SONAR with the tool set it includes in the box.
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CJaysMusic
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/08 07:43:03
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I would upgrade to sonar 8 producer. It has everything you need to master and it will probably be cheaper than buying some plugins and youll get allot more form sonar 8 producer. Cj
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bitflipper
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/08 11:22:47
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Big Ozone fan here, but I have to agree with CJ that a SONAR 8 upgrade is probably money better spent in your case. Lots of new goodies from S5.
All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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space_cowboy
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/08 12:18:57
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Soundforge has an easier working environment for 2 tracks, comes with the Ozone stuff and anyother plugs you have can be used too. Plus SF has the ability to export pretty much every file type.
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j boy
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/08 12:48:49
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My advice: You have the MPL-1 Pro SE... that's a pretty good limiter I think, for making your ultimate .WAV or .mp3 file loud enough. I would forget about any other 2-buss "global" processing and focus on making your mix all that it can be. Get it to the point where the only thing you need to do to the 2-buss is make it louder, in other words. Focus on the mix. You've got the tools.
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cryophonik
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/08 14:30:52
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ORIGINAL: space_cowboy Soundforge has an easier working environment for 2 tracks, comes with the Ozone stuff and anyother plugs you have can be used too. Plus SF has the ability to export pretty much every file type. Yeah, I agree. SF9 is excellent. The included Izotope bundle is essentially the limiter, MB compressor, LP EQ, and mastering reverb from Ozone, so it's a much more cost-effective way to go IMO. It also comes with Sony's CD Architect - another excellent program.
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AdamFH
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/08 15:18:58
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ORIGINAL: bitflipper Big Ozone fan here, but I have to agree with CJ that a SONAR 8 upgrade is probably money better spent in your case. Lots of new goodies from S5. Ozone is great, and yeah, thirded about upgrading. I've done so much with the stock effects Cakewalk provides.
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Sonic the Hedgehog
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/09 00:48:48
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quantumeffect, Ozone is a Mastering Plugin, not a Matering Application. There are only a few that can Master properly: Magix Samplitude, Magix Sequoia, Wavelab, and to a lesser extent, Soundforge. Read some articles on what Mastering actually is. If you're mastering a complete cd or audio dvd, most of the above applications can do it. If you're ''Mastering'' one song at a time, any audio application will do that. You cannot do full Mastering with Sonar - not yet anyway.
''I work to live, but live to make music'' -Mahler
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quantumeffect
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/09 22:38:10
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I am thinking Ozone because there really is a wealth of positive feedback out there about it. In addition to what you guys here say about it, I have found at least one website with a product “shootout†where the limiter in Ozone faired vary well compared to a Waves product. Also, there are a number of youtube videos featuring Ozone tutorials and product comparisons (e.g., Multiband Exciter and the Maximizer).
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quantumeffect
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/09 22:39:47
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Originally, I started with CW Proaudio 6, upgraded 9 several years later and then Sonar 5, again many years after that. The point being, upgrading gives me anxiety and I don’t do it very often but, it looks like is time again. What I’ll probably do is first, purchase the Izotope Ozone (or alternatively, SoundForge which would put me over budget) and then maybe a couple of months from now drop the hundred bucks for the upgrade to Sonar 8.
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quantumeffect
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/09 22:44:40
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Please keep in mind this is for a home project studio and in all fairness, I never called it a “Mastering Application†nor did I say I was Mastering, all I did was call it a Mastering Suite. With respect to the term “Masteringâ€, what I do now is mix in Sonar and export the file(s) as a 24 bit file (not to pat myself on the back but my mixes are usually very good). From there, I bring it into CD Architect where I typically place the limiter and/or eq, reverb, maximizer, etc. Am I actually Mastering (or PreMastering)? I don’t know … the answer to that is either, probably not or, it is a matter of opinion but, I do distribute the resulting CD’s.
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bitflipper
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/09 23:41:49
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Question for CD Architect users: does it do wordlength reduction and dither? The last time I played with it (long ago) it only handled 16-bit files. And does it support VST plugins? If I could load up my 24-bit files and run Ozone for limiting, wordlength reduction and dither, I'd get CD Architect in a minute.
All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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bitflipper
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/09 23:44:56
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There are only a few that can Master properly: Magix Samplitude, Magix Sequoia, Wavelab, and to a lesser extent, Soundforge. You cannot do full Mastering with Sonar - not yet anyway. Interesting comment. Could you elaborate on what you can do in Samplitude that can't be done in SONAR, as far as mastering goes? Do you mean that SONAR can't burn a proper CD?
All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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Rbh
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/10 01:30:11
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CD architect does support VST plug-ins. I believe it also uses the same POW-r algorhythms as Sonar, along with several other options. I'm no expert by any means, but being as I assumed the algo's are the same I've been just as happy to export 44.1 16 out of Sonar and use CD architect for assembly and final burning only. It's nice to make use of it's media pool. I'm sure your knowledge of mastering would get more mileage out of it than I currently do... but all in all it's seems to work fine here.
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Sonic the Hedgehog
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/10 02:38:50
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Please keep in mind this is for a home project studio and in all fairness, I never called it a “Mastering Application†nor did I say I was Mastering, all I did was call it a Mastering Suite. With respect to the term “Masteringâ€, what I do now is mix in Sonar and export the file(s) as a 24 bit file (not to pat myself on the back but my mixes are usually very good). From there, I bring it into CD Architect where I typically place the limiter and/or eq, reverb, maximizer, etc. Am I actually Mastering (or PreMastering)? I don’t know … the answer to that is either, probably not or, it is a matter of opinion but, I do distribute the resulting CD’s. - Quantumeffect, what you're doing is cool and I'm sure you make great music. I didn't wan't to sound ''snoty', and I didn't know you had CD Architect. In this case, getting Ozone will be great. Doesn't CD Architect use Ozone's limiter and dithering section? Question for CD Architect users: does it do wordlength reduction and dither? The last time I played with it (long ago) it only handled 16-bit files. And does it support VST plugins? If I could load up my 24-bit files and run Ozone for limiting, wordlength reduction and dither, I'd get CD Architect in a minute. - Bitflipper, I'm not sure CD Architect supports VST's. It's odd because Soundforge does. However, it does do the rest of the things you mentioned. Interesting comment. Could you elaborate on what you can do in Samplitude that can't be done in SONAR, as far as mastering goes? Do you mean that SONAR can't burn a proper CD? - Bitflipper, it's not that it can't burn a CD properly. For example, say you're music is like Enigma's, where one piece of music crossfades into another, or has multiple index points, I don't think you can burn a cd/project of that kind seemlessly in Sonar - unless I'm mistaken. Also, Sonar's ''Normalize'' is only peak normalization. Average RMS normalization is far more efective as you can, for example, set all your tracks to an average RMS of -20db and then tweak from there. You'll be using much less compression/limiting in the end and still have reasonable loudness. There is also the question of IRSC codes and cue sheets, among other things, that you'll need to provide to the replication plant - if that's what you're aiming for. My 2¢ is usually Sonar for recording/mixing, and then an inexpensive application like Wavelab Essentials. Psychologycally, it's also important to change applications for mastering so that you get out of that ''mixing'' mode in your main application. It makes you view everything so much more objectively.
''I work to live, but live to make music'' -Mahler
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quantumeffect
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/12 23:18:28
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This info is probably a bit dated and remedial at that but, CD Architect 5 does have dither plug. The KJAERHUS Audio’s MPL-1 Pro SE Limiter also has dither but I turn it off and use the Sony plug at the end of the chain. Also, (I'm not sure if I'm stating the obvious) the "Cakewalk" plugs (in Sonar 5) will not load in CD Architect (not licensed or something like that) but the Sonitus:fx plugs do. The Sony plugs come up as demos when I try to use them in Sonar (functional but w/ an intermittent nasty squeeky sound).
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Sonic the Hedgehog
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/12 23:51:23
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Hmmm, I'm not I understand clearly, but normaly you wouldn't use the plugs belonging to one application in another(most apps won't allow you). However, I think CD Architect's dithering plug is Ozone. However, if you need the other tools in Ozone, they're great. You can export all your work into stereo files from Sonar and then line them up in CD Architect and use Ozone to tweak everything the way you want to. Ozone comes with a huge number of Mastering presets to get you started. You'll start figuring out in no time how the different modules interact with one another. The limiter and dithering section is very flexible.
''I work to live, but live to make music'' -Mahler
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spencer09
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/13 00:18:00
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I really like Steinberg Wavelab. It just has a really nice interface and seems to run smoothly. Loads VST and DirectX plugins which is pretty standard I guess, but I've had good results from it.
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Lil Droppa
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/13 09:25:25
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Sonic the Hedgehog
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/13 18:44:09
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ORIGINAL: spencer09 I really like Steinberg Wavelab. It just has a really nice interface and seems to run smoothly. Loads VST and DirectX plugins which is pretty standard I guess, but I've had good results from it. I use Wavelab myself, but out of respect for the original poster, he wanted a mastering plugin and not a mastering application, and he was thinking of Ozone.
''I work to live, but live to make music'' -Mahler
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Bob Oister
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/13 23:34:25
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Anothe vote for Ozone and you also may want to check out Har-Bal. Bob
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Bajan Blue
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/15 02:32:13
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Bob Do you use Har-Bal regularly? I purchased Har-Bal some time ago after reading about it in the Forum - however I have never been able to get a decent result from it - I do use it to look at my mixes some times, but I never use it to alter those mixes. Perhaps this is just me being ignorant or something. What I do now (and I have tried both Ozone and the old version of Tracks) is to master in Sonar using my UAD plugs - normally compressor and EQ - then limit using PSP Xeon - gives pretty good results I think. Nigel
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soundchaser59
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/24 21:28:31
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I too have never been able to get anything out of Har-Bal (short for "harmonic balancing"?) that was anywhere near close to what Ozone will do. I'm not rocket scientist, but the more I learn about Ozone, the more I like it. I'm pretty sure Ozone will do something similar as far as matching an EQ curve, but it has so much more than that.....
post edited by soundchaser59 - 2009/01/24 21:33:09
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moosetex
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/24 22:16:42
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I agree with those who say an upgrade to SONAR 8 PE would be the best investment you could make for your money. Other than that, I believe WaveLab is world-class spectacular, even the "Essentials" version (as Sonic the Hedgehog would probably say... OT: Hi Sonic!). BUBBA
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Anubis
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/25 16:24:26
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soundchaser59
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/26 21:06:40
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ORIGINAL: Anubis Sweetwater has Ozone 4 for only $199! That's interesting...... I cant find anything on Izotope's web site about O4, other than a press release saying it will ship in January 09. But not one word about buying it or upgrading. If the upgrade price from O3 to O4 is reasonable, I'll probably jump on it. I guess $79 bucks is fairly reasonable these days....... assuming I get that tube amp I want first...... You did notice on Sweetwater's page that little green line that says "arriving soon"??
post edited by soundchaser59 - 2009/01/26 21:13:04
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Sonic the Hedgehog
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RE: Mastering Software Question
2009/01/26 21:43:19
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''I work to live, but live to make music'' -Mahler
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