Tropical Cowboy
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getting a new PC - need advice
Hi,
I'm thinking of getting a new pc with 64 bit. Can anyone make any suggestions. I'm basically looking for the best, high end, equiped with everything unit (money no object). I've been looking at Dell's Alien Ware computer. I want the ultimate Sonar PC. I appreciate any replies.
Thanks,
Jerry
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PaPi
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/06 14:59:44
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Don't buy a pre-packaged box from the big manufacturers. Assemble it yourself or, if you think you're not up to the task, have it done by someone who knows what works best for a DAW (several businesses do just that.) In the end, you might even spend less and get more.
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FirmamentFX
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/06 15:06:47
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+1 for that advice! OEM manufacturers use OEM components, which are not always "great" (motherboards particularly).
Get good cooling too... If you are bothered about it, then you can get cases with noise insulation. My boxes are in a different room though, so it is of no import to me.
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dcastle
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/06 15:48:02
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Greetings, If you have an old computer that is working fine, but just isn't as fast as you wish, then you might try what I did — I upgraded my existing computer with hardware from http://www.pcboost.com (disclaimer: I'm not associated with them) for less than $400 and I'm really happy with the results. I just swapped the components, rebooted, Windows XP Pro asked for new drivers, installed, rebooted, and my "new" computer is as fast and quiet as I dreamed it would be — all my software and data are 100% intact — least stressful upgrade I ever did. So I ordered a similar system for my daughter's computer — same experience — nice as you please! Regards, David
ASUS M3A78 AMD 9950 Quad 2.6G 8GB Shure • Rhode • Audio-Technica • Allen&Heath GL2200-24 MOTU 24i • Presonus Firepod • E-MU 1212m • Zoom H2 SONAR 2XL-8PE • Sound Forge 1-9 • Audacity 0.1-1.3
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RichElam
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/06 17:10:46
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I don't agree about not buying from vendors, but the majority of that market is filled with builders that focus on gaming. That's not really a good fit; for instance you absolutely do not want a monster graphic card (or two) taking up space, drawing a lot of power, and building up heat inside your case. The extra fans will also make it a noisy hassle.
There are people/companies that specialize in DAW building. If you don't want to take chances or make this into a potentially long process of trial and error, you could go that route. I don't have a recommendation for who to use -because money is definately an object for me, I build me own.
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pianodano
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/06 17:33:50
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ORIGINAL: Tropical Cowboy
Hi,
I'm thinking of getting a new pc with 64 bit. Can anyone make any suggestions. I'm basically looking for the best, high end, equiped with everything unit (money no object). I've been looking at Dell's Alien Ware computer. I want the ultimate Sonar PC. I appreciate any replies.
Thanks,
Jerry
Core i7 running XP pro. Get in touch with Scott at ADK. http://www.adkproaudio.com
post edited by pianodano - 2009/02/06 17:41:01
Best, Danny Core I7, win XP pro, 3 gig ram, 3 drives- Lynx Aurora firewire- Roll around 27 inch monitor, 42 inch console monitor- Motif xs controller - Networked P4's and FX Teleport for samples- Muse Receptor VIA Uniwire for samples and plugs- UAD QUAD Neve - UAD 1- Sonar X1 but favor 8.5 GUI - Toft ATB 32 - Vintage hardware - Tascam MS-16 synched via Timeline Microlynx -Toft ATB32 console
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gtgarner
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/06 17:36:18
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I"m sorry but when I upgraded to 64 bit...it was nothing but nightmares.
Sonar ran absolutely great. I couldn't tell the difference between 32bit and 64 bit with it, but....oh well.
The problem were the crappy 64bit (so they said) pluggins. They weren't ready. On pluggin that was rated for 64 bit wouldn't even open as a stand alone in 64bit....but the website screamed 64bit READY!!!!.
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PaPi
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/06 18:21:44
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ORIGINAL: gtgarner
I"m sorry but when I upgraded to 64 bit...it was nothing but nightmares.
Sonar ran absolutely great. I couldn't tell the difference between 32bit and 64 bit with it, but....oh well.
The problem were the crappy 64bit (so they said) pluggins. They weren't ready. On pluggin that was rated for 64 bit wouldn't even open as a stand alone in 64bit....but the website screamed 64bit READY!!!!.
Maybe you jumped on the 64-bit bandwagon too early. I switched last fall: new quad-core computer with Vista 64, new Sonar 8PE (I was coming from Cubase 4, which I still use, soon to be upgraded to 5), upgraded Absynth from 3 to 4, Kontakt from 2 to 3, dowloaded a bunch of updated drivers/x64 fixes and I had zero problems. The only thing that no longer worked was the Faderport (someone said it works OK with Sonar 8/32.) I replaced it with an Alphatrack and everything is running smoothly. Couldn't be happier about taking the 64-bit plunge...
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ed97643
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/06 18:39:38
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If money is truly no object, then surely don't buy a Dell.
Check out studiocat.com (no afilliation).
Also, seriously examine the plugs that you are using (and / or want to use) and see if they can support 64 bit yet. Many a great song has been happily tracked in 32 bit. I do not believe that we are quite "there yet" with regard to full blown 64 bit productions (JMHO).
Best,
ed
Registered Cakewalk user since 1995
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Jim Roseberry
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/06 20:14:27
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If you want the best DAW that money can buy (cost no object), have someone who knows how to build a DAW spec/build an i7 965 based system for you.
Alienware doesn't know anything about UAD compatibility, why you need a TI chipset Firewire controller, etc. They build gaming machines...
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PaPi
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/06 22:43:55
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ORIGINAL: ed97643
If money is truly no object, then surely don't buy a Dell.
Check out studiocat.com (no afilliation).
Also, seriously examine the plugs that you are using (and / or want to use) and see if they can support 64 bit yet. Many a great song has been happily tracked in 32 bit. I do not believe that we are quite "there yet" with regard to full blown 64 bit productions (JMHO).
Best,
ed
We're about one version away from everything available in native 64-bit. Both Sonar and Cubase now being native 64-bit apps will speed up the process. Meanwhile every VST in current production has been updated/patched to work with Sonar x64 through bitbridge. I really can't complain.
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ronniebee
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/16 10:29:53
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ORIGINAL: Tropical Cowboy
Hi,
I'm thinking of getting a new pc with 64 bit. Can anyone make any suggestions. I'm basically looking for the best, high end, equiped with everything unit (money no object). I've been looking at Dell's Alien Ware computer. I want the ultimate Sonar PC. I appreciate any replies.
Thanks,
Jerry
I built my 64 bit system by using a barebones from www.magicmicro.com and adding the components partially from them, and other vendors such as New-Egg. I was on the BLEEDING EDGE at first, but everything is running excellent now. I have the case fan and temp control in my Apvia Large case, and everythings cool. Just now upgrading my sound card to xonar D2x to go with my Logitech Z5500 5.1 Surround Sound. I still have a few problems with Vista 64 bit Ultimate hanging up on a few of my games, but that seems to have improved a lot since I got Service Pack 1. I have released 2 CDs with my small studio, you can hear some of the songs at my SoundClick link & CD-Baby below.
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sandman5000
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/16 13:24:43
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ORIGINAL: Tropical Cowboy
Hi,
I'm thinking of getting a new pc with 64 bit. Can anyone make any suggestions. I'm basically looking for the best, high end, equiped with everything unit (money no object). I've been looking at Dell's Alien Ware computer. I want the ultimate Sonar PC. I appreciate any replies.
Thanks,
Jerry
I'd recommend http://www.pcaudiolabs.com/ This (from their site) says it all: PCAudioLabs audio computers, powered by the Intel Core i7 processor and featuring Intel Solid State Drives, were used for software demonstrations and live performance recording by the following companies at this year's Winter NAMM 2009 convention in Anaheim, CA. * Allen & Heath * Arturia * Cakewalk * IK Multimedia * Roland * Steinberg * Vestax * Yamaha
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wintaper
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/16 19:40:30
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Why 64-bit? All modern CPUs are 64bit capable. Unfortunately support for 64bit plugins and hardware is less than ideal. Basically, on identical hardware, Sonar32/XP32 will outperform Sonar64/XP64 and Sonar64/Vista64. This is a fact. The primary advantage of a 64bit OS is a larger addressable memory map. There is no implied promise that 64bit is faster - 64bit instructions don't run any faster than their 32bit counterparts. In fact, they run a bit slower, because executable files tend to be larger and occupy more memory when loaded. So, as my boss would say, what problem are you trying to solve by going 64bit?
post edited by wintaper - 2009/02/16 19:46:27
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ronniebee
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/18 10:59:21
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Wintaper, My 2.4 64bit PC has Dual Quad 4 processors, and dual memory channel with 4mb of channed SDR 800 mhz ram. I am using Sonar 6 HS-XL 64 bit edition, with Vista Ultimate 64 bit, and believe me it is faster than greased lightning. The only complaint I have is there's a Codec conflict with My Movie Producing Software Pinnacle. After using Cakewalk, I have to re-install Pinnacle, or vice-versa Cakewalk and Dim Pro. when switching back. Although I think service pack 1 may have solved this. I have not tried my Movie SW since it was installed. I believe 64 bit will be the wave of the future, it's just on the bleeding edge right now, and Windows 7 from what I understand is just an updated version of Vista with bells and whistles. I just purchased a 64 Bit Sound Card, Asus Xonar D2x to go with my Asus P5N-E SLI MOBO. It will be here today 2-18-09, and I plan to review it here in the Hardward section once I get going. It is supposed to up-mix my analog from my mixer to full 5.1 or 7.1 Dolby Digital, or DTS Optical. I have over 25 Years of professional experience in the Information Technology field, and I know the Hardware and software just keeps on improving and improving. I'm trying to stay on that bleeding edge, because I love to be an adventurer and be the first to try out new technology. You guys may want to wait, but sooner or later I believe 64 bit will be the norm. I will be 69 in May, and will be retiring April 30 this year. So I'll have pleanty of time to experiment. Good Luck with whatever you're into. Ronnie Bee
post edited by ronniebee - 2009/02/18 11:00:52
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wintaper
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/18 13:46:43
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ORIGINAL: ronniebee
Wintaper,
My 2.4 64bit PC has Dual Quad 4 processors, and dual memory channel with 4mb of channed SDR 800 mhz ram. I am using Sonar 6 HS-XL 64 bit edition, with Vista Ultimate 64 bit, and believe me it is faster than greased lightning.
Fast machine, no argument from me. But if you put XP32 on the same hardware, it'd run even faster. BitBridge is normally the culprit. Its thunking the audio up to 64 bit.
I believe 64 bit will be the wave of the future, it's just on the bleeding edge right now, and Windows 7 from what I understand is just an updated version of Vista with bells and whistles.
Again, no argument. My server boxes are 64 bit, its just not the best choice for audio at the moment. As far as Windows 7, I have to laugh. MS systems are always more bloated and slower than their previous versions. Why anyone would rush out to install a new microsoft OS is beyond me. The only one that shined at the start was Windows 2000. Otherwise, they're a few patches and fixes away from primetime when they launch. I just purchased a 64 Bit Sound Card, Asus Xonar D2x to go with my Asus P5N-E SLI MOBO. It will be here today 2-18-09, and I plan to review it here in the Hardward section once I get going. It is supposed to up-mix my analog from my mixer to full 5.1 or 7.1 Dolby Digital, or DTS Optical. Look forward to reading it - I love this stuff. I have over 25 Years of professional experience in the Information Technology field, and I know the Hardware and software just keeps on improving and improving. I'm trying to stay on that bleeding edge, because I love to be an adventurer and be the first to try out new technology. You guys may want to wait, but sooner or later I believe 64 bit will be the norm. I will be 69 in May, and will be retiring April 30 this year. So I'll have plenty of time to experiment. Awesome, we have much in common, I'm a full-time programmer - started writing code in the early 80's - first DOS then Windows and eventually Unix, using C, C++ etc. These days I'm an enterprise developer with TV Guide Online doing mostly large-scale data-driven web development. I too REALLY wanted to run all 64bit - In fact I did for about 2 months - Sonar64 on XP64 then Vista64. At the time I thought it was great. Until problems with incompatible drivers (lexicon drivers for outboard efx for one). When I reinstalled XP32/Sonar on the exact same box, I was surprised at how much snappier it was. (Both OS's were installed by me - so it wasn't a setup issue). What I ended up deciding is that its just not here yet. Oh well.
Good Luck with whatever you're into.
Ronnie Bee
same to you -Dan
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Ikaru
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/18 16:14:06
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Check out http://www.wootcomputers.com/. Drooling over their octo-core machines is what led me to building my own. Personally, I can't stand the idea of letting another man mess with my box, so I've been building my own machines since high school. But what they have on that site is pretty top level stuff. Not really any cost-cutting cut corners on the available components. --Update to that-- As with most PC manufacturers, and I can say this having had my own little PC housecalls business for a while, there is almost ZERO margin in selling PC components. So, not surprisingly, I went to the site listed above and built the equivalent of the 8 core DAW I just cut the last check for (still waiting on the shipment), to the tune of about $700 more than I spent on Newegg for slightly better components. This is the price you pay for not doing it yourself. Do some research, find a friend to help you with the one or two delicate operations (like applying thermal compound to a processor) and you'll be better for the experience.
post edited by Ikaru - 2009/02/18 16:26:38
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jcschild
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/18 16:30:24
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and the sad thing is the Core i7 kills the Xeons for less money
i also hope you didnt use the motherboard they are using!
Scott
ADK
Scott ADK Home of the Kentucky Fried DAW!
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Jim Roseberry
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/18 17:55:39
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Drooling over their octo-core machines is what led me to building my own. Why drool over dual-quads when the i7 is faster... significantly less expensive... quieter... etc? 
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craigb
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/18 19:39:52
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ORIGINAL: Jim Roseberry
Drooling over their octo-core machines is what led me to building my own.
Why drool over dual-quads when the i7 is faster... significantly less expensive... quieter... etc?
Because you wouldn't want to get the chip you're actually using wet and short circuit it?  Sorry! Not being helpful, I know. I'll shut up now. 
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edentowers
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RE: getting a new PC - need advice
2009/02/19 07:59:01
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I can't resist stepping in on these discussions. Sorry.
I'm having to do some work at home this week and, just for fun, while I've got some database software installed, I thought I'd see what affect it had on Sonar.
My PC is a Dell quad core 6600 at stock speed with 3GBytes of RAM. It has the Sigmatel Chip still enabled and it's online all the time.
So I loaded up the 'Guilty' demo project whilst I was still running Oracle SQl Developer against an Oracle 10g Enterprise database installation, I also had MySQL's GUI interface open, and Internet Explorer logged on to this forum.
My Edirol UA101 had the slider all the way left at 1ms and I have to say I got pops and crackles. I played around and eventually set it at 3ms.
At that setting the audio was smooth as silk, so I started running some CPU intensive queries that typically take 3 or 4 minutes to work. Whilst they were running I browsed around the forums and checked MS Outlook for new mail.
The audio remained crystal clear throughout this. I know that 'Guilty' doesn't have a load of softsynths and effects, but it is near enough 40 audio tracks and I was impressed with the way my Dell performed. I guess I'm just that lucky guy. (Sorry Todd)
S8PE, Dell XPS 720 (Q6600), XP Pro SP2, Edirol UA-101
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