Put the key signature next to song titles?

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jhughs
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2009/02/12 22:24:28 (permalink)

Put the key signature next to song titles?

I had a crazy idea the other day, see what you think.

When I was in college (long long time ago) a girl in one of my classes could tell what key a piece of music was in almost every time. She said her dad listened to classical music and always told her what key the music was in so she just learned what each key sounded like.

The other day, this idea came to me that if contemporary musicians put the key signatures next to their songs do you think kids would grow up learning to recognize key signatures?

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    bapu
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/13 00:18:52 (permalink)
    Very interesting idea.
    Better than the hula-hoop.
    Simpler too.
    #2
    The Maillard Reaction
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/13 08:22:30 (permalink)
    they do... it's called sheet music!


    #3
    v42x
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/13 08:26:02 (permalink)
    There's a difference between keys? So if i transposed my song from C to Bb, it'd sound different? Honestly, there's some microintonation thing that my cabbages aren't picking up?

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    #4
    The Maillard Reaction
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/13 09:15:34 (permalink)
    I'd rather play in Bb... it seems more sophisticated ;-)


    #5
    edentowers
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/13 09:50:49 (permalink)
    I used to live in Ab.

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    #6
    spacey
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/13 10:07:17 (permalink)
    I can C living in Ab, pretty #
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    jhughs
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/13 14:12:41 (permalink)
    Thanks.

    Okay, first, not sheet music, but right next to the title of the song so you know what it is while it's playing (or read on the back of the CD, whatever). You're just pulling my leg right?

    Second, you all remind me of my dear friend and bass player in college (until the Fundamentalists got to him and he couldn't be my friend anymore - that really hurt).
    Anyway, every time we started to cross a street he'd say "You'd better C# or you'll Bb."

    Cheers.

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    J Hughs Soundclick
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    Garry Stubbs
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/13 14:26:52 (permalink)
    I lived in Ab, was promised a C view but couldn't see the F in C had a word with my friend D who said Db was to B demolished I said A whats going on G its a strange world


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    bapu
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/13 14:46:55 (permalink)
    #'s & b's

    Two sides of the same coin?
    #10
    The Maillard Reaction
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/13 15:22:18 (permalink)
    I don't know about the name part but I think it's a great idea to have a little cheat sheet of favorite songs and relative keys.

    Now a days I usually start playing along by ear and a few measures in I figure out what key I'm in simply by the map my fingers are making... it's ears recognition first, pattern recognition second then I can elaborate as I it occurs to me.

    I got that way by studying songs just as you seem to be suggesting you want to.

    best regards,
    mike


    #11
    Guitarhacker
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/13 19:34:38 (permalink)
    It's not difficult to "hear" the differences in the intonation between different keys. I can listen to a guitar and the sound of the chords will tell me what the key is. I can "see" the chords being played, by hearing them.

    Taking the same song to a different key will at times produce some amazingly different colors in the music.

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    #12
    jhughs
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/13 21:10:11 (permalink)
    Ok, now imagine if the whole time you were growing up, most every song you heard had the key signature next to it.
    How much more advanced would you be now?

    yeah yeah, living in Ab by D C.

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    #13
    The Maillard Reaction
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/13 23:49:50 (permalink)
    advanced in what way?


    Furthermore, most of the songs I've "heard"... I've never "seen" the title of. :-)


    #14
    jacktheexcynic
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/14 00:16:27 (permalink)
    yes, each key sounds different. hard to explain. some are mellower, some brighter. haven't been at the piano in a long time but you could get a really mellow sound out of a Cb (or B, if you prefer) while E was pretty bright sounding. as i recall anyway

    guitar chord voicings are different from key to key, and you can further mess with things by using a capo. but guitar is a bit of an oddball anyway.

    the key a song is in absolutely matters to how that song will sound though, nuances aside, because the range of the melody and harmony affects the tonality of the instruments. you can always play with the groove with an "off" tempo but the key makes a big difference. in my opinion.

    - jack the ex-cynic
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    The Maillard Reaction
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/14 08:56:17 (permalink)
    I think most songs sound best when the key suits the singer ;-)


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    space_cowboy
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/14 09:38:40 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: jhughs

    I had a crazy idea the other day, see what you think.

    When I was in college (long long time ago) a girl in one of my classes could tell what key a piece of music was in almost every time. She said her dad listened to classical music and always told her what key the music was in so she just learned what each key sounded like.

    The other day, this idea came to me that if contemporary musicians put the key signatures next to their songs do you think kids would grow up learning to recognize key signatures?

    What is the key signature of rap?

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    jacktheexcynic
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/14 12:27:42 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: mike_mccue
    I think most songs sound best when the key suits the singer ;-)


    yes that is step one but you get more urgency from a singer hitting the top of their range than a couple steps below... which is probably what you meant

    - jack the ex-cynic
    #18
    jinga8
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/14 12:39:56 (permalink)
    What is the key signature of rap?

    ARe yoU Nuts? Dm or C, of course!
    #19
    jhughs
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/14 13:40:32 (permalink)
    Yeah, I think rap is usually in C; as in C Rap.

    (But seriously, my experience is that every musical form has a lot of mediocre music but if you stick with it long enough you start finding stuff to like.)

    But yeah, there's the flaw in my plan. It'd get pretty meaningless if every song were in the same key.

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    The Maillard Reaction
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/14 22:11:41 (permalink)
    You can always start calling Modes if major keys get too boring?


    #21
    Cheeto
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/15 15:58:21 (permalink)
    Nice topic but...I don't understand how this benefits someone who is not musically inclined or has no inclination to be.

    Very cool for us musical types! But for the average majority of listeners, I fail to see how they could make sense of this, and or even what to do with it if they can make a differentiation.

    But being a musical person, I can very well see the benefit of the key being listed as well as the mode too. Then again I suppose we just have to do that for ourselves if we feel it is of any importance. Or just refer to the sheet music as mentioned




    #22
    jhughs
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/15 17:28:51 (permalink)
    Cheeto,

    Maybe a little more background would help.
    The girl I mentioned was, in a strict sense, not musical; she didn't play an instrument and couldn't read music.
    But she enjoyed music (we met in a music appreciation class).
    So again, because her father had indoctrinated her in classical music and always told her the key a piece was in she learned to recognize them.

    Imagine if you learned music the same way you learned colors, starting in Kindergarten or even on Sesame Street.
    They teach you what different colors are called. Those are just different frequencies of light.
    Why not do the same with different frequencies of sound?
    "Kids, this note is an "A" and it's an A if I sing it up here or down here".. .that sort of thing.
    Of course, it could progress from there to recognizing more than just a single note.

    Foreign language is best taught before the age of 12, it's probably the same for music.
    Even if those students never became musicians it'd give them a better appreciation for music.
    If they did go into music, it'd be a priceless skill.
    post edited by jhughs - 2009/02/15 17:37:01

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    #23
    Cheeto
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/16 01:03:08 (permalink)
    jhughs,

    I appreciate you expanding on that, And I do think your original idea is a good thing to have, just that the average non-musical, nor non influenced or inspired listener could probably care less. Sort of like algebra, while studying it one may think it is a waste of time, but there may come a day when we need to draw upon what we have learned.

    Oh, all those things we thought were insignificant at a young age, but wished we had learned so well! Yikes !

    So I see your point more clearly now, & who knows, maybe someone who thinks they will never play an instrument in their entire lifetime may suddenly change their mind. And if so, what a wonderful benefit!

    I just wonder what that person you refer to results would be when listening to something that isn't tuned to concert pitch? What would be her reaction to that, would that cause her difficulty in naming the key?

    I wish I could see all pitches as colors, but unfortunately I can't. It would truly be a cool gift to have.
    Otherwise referred to as form of "synesthesia", it's a mixed bag, a blessing for some...and a curse for others when the wrong senses collide. So be careful what you wish for I guess.

    Thanks again for giving me insight and seeing the other side of the coin.

    #24
    SongCraft
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    RE: Put the key signature next to song titles? 2009/02/16 01:22:05 (permalink)
    Ideal if the singer has an incredibly really good key range!

    Sometimes the bass end can become less clearer and more muddy due to being played way too low or the opposite going way up a key the notes lose their bottom end but a bit of tweaking, change of sound patch or instrument setup, or something like EQ may help. Sometimes I've had to change a small part of bass line making the run down to a run up instead! Ah the ups and downs of key changes LOL!! Just be careful not to change key up way too much or the poor singer will be featuring on the next Chipmunks CD or the Squeaky Town Blues CD by the Eunuchs.
    post edited by SongCraft - 2009/02/16 01:28:05

     
     
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