Sonar Producer 8 - running out of disk space - how can I access more?

I noticed this once when I tried to record a pair of stereo mics. It popped up this message "not enough disk space". I like you have GB of space left.

knightime


Hi there,
 
I have a Quad core PC system with over 3TB of overall storage.  Sonar 8 is loaded onto the primary drive, but all files and sessions are saved to another drive that currently has 96GB of free space.
 
I'm working on a fairly large project at the moment using mainly vst instruments.  I've got to the point where I'm freezing synths and rendering them as audio files - then copying the original part onto a new audio track and muting the original part (makes better sense from an arrangement point of view).
 
The thing is that, while I've got, say, 25 audio tracks playing at one time, each with their own effects etc, my CPU registers at being only a quarter used, but my hard disc registers at 70% - and I still haven't added vocals yet!!!
 
I was of the impression that Sonar would access as much disc space as there was on the drive the files were on - am I wrong?  I mean, I have 96GB of free space, so why isn't Sonar using it?
 
I've had a quick search around on the forum and came accross the idea of doubling the input/output buffers (they were 256 so I increased them to 512) - but then all the audio started to drop out.
 
Has anyone got any ideas as to how I can get Sonar to access the spare 96GB so I can get more audio tracks recorded?  I'm keen not to export any files and keep everything in one place.
 
Thanks in adavcne for any advice you may have to offer.
 
Regards,
 
Brian

When you're saying your hard disk registers at 70% is this the disk indicator in Sonar? If so, that's not an indicator of how much disk SPACE is being used as it is of THROUGHPUT of your disk system. And it has nothing to do with cpu usage. And it has nothing to do with being able to access your whole drive.

What size is the drive you have your files and sessions on? You only have 96 gig available on that drive? You should save off to cd or dvd any old stuff you don't need on the drive to free up space. Say it's a 1 Tb drive - that 96 gig would be less than 10% of drive space and one should never let a drive get that full. I know you say you want to keep everything in one place, but do you really need to have any old projects on the drive (if indeed you do have any on there)?

knightime


Hey jackn2mpu
 
You're absolutely correct - I'm observing the disc indicator below the cpu indicator in Sonar.
 
Can you briefly explain what you mean by 'throughput' i.e. what's the relationship between 'throughput' and recorded audio?  More to the point, is there aything I can do to increase throughput?  If not, am I looking at something like, say, producting a final musical 'master', then creating another session where the 'master' is imported and the vocal work begins?
 
Also, all my HDs are partitioned, and the drive the projects are located on was partitioned to 115gb, so I around 80+% free disc space.  I'm guessing though that this doesn't make a difference with regards to my original enquiry !
 
Thanks for your advice buddy!

Throughput is the amount of material flowing through a system in a given amount of time. The more that flows in the same amount of time the more efficient a system is (you're taking advantage of what a particular system can do). If you want to increase throughput you need a faster system. That means things like faster disk drives or even solid state drives.

What does the Sonar metering show when you try and add your vocal tracks? If you're getting close to 100% you mayn want to go with SSD drives or do a split like you say where you render down to 2 bus/track and then add your vocals to that. But with the fast machine you say you have, and if it's properly optimized with good drivers and such you shouldn't have problems.

Thanks for the explanation on the disk space issue - now it's in perspective. But I do have to ask - why partition your drives and why such a small partition to begin with? There's absolutely no reason to go with partitions anymore, especially such small ones.

It also sounds like you're duplicating the rendered vst audio tracks. There's no need to do that. Even if you mute the track it's still being loaded from your disk drive. That will eat your throughput for sure. What I do, and I'm on a severely limited machine for Sonar (2.53 GHz P4 1 gig ram laptop with Edirol UA1000 USB2.0 audio, TC Powercore dsp and external FW drives) is, like you, render down my softsynths to an audio track and then archive the MIDI track that drove the softsynth. I don't duplicate the rendered audio track and I can do upwards of 30 tracks this way.

jackn2mpu


It also sounds like you're duplicating the rendered vst audio tracks. There's no need to do that. Even if you mute the track it's still being loaded from your disk drive. That will eat your throughput for sure. What I do, and I'm on a severely limited machine for Sonar (2.53 GHz P4 1 gig ram laptop with Edirol UA1000 USB2.0 audio, TC Powercore dsp and external FW drives) is, like you, render down my softsynths to an audio track and then archive the MIDI track that drove the softsynth. I don't duplicate the rendered audio track and I can do upwards of 30 tracks this way.

Ahhh, that didn't even occur to me!!!  I was under the impression that if you rendered and muted vst tracks it wouldn't affect the overall project - but reading your explanation of throughput it appears I was mistaken!  I'll look into archiving as part of my routine music making (provided I can easily access them again - I have a habit of fiddling with parts !)
 
Yeh, the partition thing is a tad redundant now, but I partitioned them a while back - do you think if I made the cakewalk project partition 'whole' again it would improve performance (just out of interest of course!)
 
Thanks for your advice mate - it's really helped!

Oh yeah, forgot to ask. Isn't the indicator adjacent to the CPU indicator? Just to the left of it?
How can it be underneath?
The only thing underneath my CPU indicator is the time, and that is on the windows task bar.
Steve

Oh yeah
I'd forgotten about that since I never use it.
Steve

twaddle


The 70% percent indicator maybe something to do with "throughput" but that is the most convolluted explanation for something much more simple surely?
The 70% is an indication of how much disk space you have remaining.
Mine is currently and 90%, am I worried, nope.
If you select your hard disk in windows and click, "properties" does it look like you have used 30% and therefore have 70% remaining?
If so there is your proof.
Steve

As Jack said the disk usage meter is ONLY about throughput so I'm afraid what you said here is living up to your user name!  :<)
 
It is perfectly possible that you have a project that uses 30% of available disk throughput while at the same time the amount of storage used on the disk is 30%, so what you suggest offers absolutely no proof at all.
 
To the OP, if your Sonar partition is on the same physical disk as the OS, your available throughput will be immediately limited so although defrag may help considerably (if shared with the OS, defrag both partitions) it will never be as good as using a completely seperate hard drive for your Sonar projects.

OK you may be right I'll confess I've never read up on the subject but since it says "Dick Space  I'd assumed it must have meant disk space.
Funny that, why doesn't it say through put if that's what it refers to?

Since I didn't spot that he was refering to the "large transport" view that
papa2005 spotted can I get half a point?

Where, anywhere in the GUI does it "dick" space?

Another thing to check is how much space you have left on your main operating system drive (C:) The page file is usually written to the C: drive for buffering.  If you have inadequate space there that could cause you some grief.  The disk space indicated on the very bottom of Sonar would be how much space is left on you drive where your projects are going but no indication of space on you OS drive.  With inadequate space there your system will bog down with increased disk writing and CPU usage.

P.S. I am assuming the disk space/cpu usage and disk usage you are referring to are from the very bottom line of Sonar.

LOL CJ thats what you wrote!

papa2005


Where, anywhere in the GUI does it "dick" space?

Damn - this is the best laught I've had all day.
Does this mean we're just 'dicking around'?
And where's bapu or Strummy when you need them?

Disk management is what it's all about. The fuller a hard disk gets, the longer it takes to seek data, because it has to seek through more crap. For audio and video, you shouldn't let a disk get more than about 50% full in order to maintain seek speed. It doesn't matter how large a disk is. It the percentage of empty space that is important in maintaining speed.

Once a project is completed you should move it to another hard disk or DVD etc to store it. Keep your main audio drive empty, with just the current project on it, and you should be fine.