Spacecat
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Sonar 5 Producer Edition questions
Hi everyone, I know this is an old version of Sonar, but I'm cool with older stuff, it should just work :) And I don't know what I'm doing to this baby, but... this is seriously strange. I have Sonar 5 PE and when I record audio (just simple, Line-In stuff), I have two issues: 1.) The audio gets a heavy distortion effect all over it, sounds like a mix of amp, reverb and flange to my amateur ears :D 2.) The audio playback lags behind the visual runthrough of the track, so that when it gets to the end, the audio will cut off prematurely, if you play the whole track back. If I only play the end bit, it works OK. When I listen back to an exported track on Media Player NEITHER of these problems appear, and 2.) is probably quite obvious not to appear :) but 1.) really confuses me. I thought there was a problem with my input cable etc, so that the sound I heard playing back within Sonar was true, but this means it is not. Does anyone know why this might happen? And why the playback is lagging? My specs are enough to run the software, and I patched both 5.0.1 and then 5.2 with no change to the issue. I have played with Sonar 3 PE on a friend's PC in the past, and totally loved it. I know that there are advanced features I have no idea about, but it was possible to do a simple, straight recording on a few tracks without too much ado, so I planned to get going, and learn the more advanced controls bit by bit as they happen... Upgrading to a higher version is NOT possible at the moment I'm afraid :/ hope someone has an idea. Thanks a lot in advance!!!
post edited by Spacecat - 2010/06/30 04:59:22
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Wookiee
Rrrrugh arah-ah-woof?
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Re:Sonar 5 Producer Edition questions
2010/06/30 05:11:12
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A few stats on your PC may help OS = Sound card = Sound card driver = CPU = RAM = Latency = Sample rate = Bit depth = number of HD's = Those sorts of things may be of assistance in resolving the problem.
Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass, it's about learning to dance in the rain. Karma has a way of finding its own way home.
Primary, i7 8700K 16Gigs Ram, 3x500gb SSD's 2TB Backup HHD Saffire Pro 40. Win 10 64Bit Secondary i7 4790K, 32GB Ram, 500Gb SSD OS/Prog's, 1TB Audio, 1TB Samples HHD AudioBox USB, Win 10 64Bit CbB, Adam's A7x's - Event 20/20's, Arturia V6, Korg Digital Legacy, Softube Modular, Arturia Keylab-88, USB-MidiSport 8x8
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Spacecat
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Re:Sonar 5 Producer Edition questions
2010/06/30 07:16:02
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Hey Wookiee! Of course! Sorry, they should've been in there in the first place!!! Thanks!! OS = Windows XP Home Sound card = Realtek HD Audio Output (WDM) Sound card driver = RtkHDAud.sys 5.10.0000.6132 08.06.2010 CPU = P4 3Ghz RAM = 1.8 Gb Latency = I don't know how to check this.. sorry! I haven't changed anything though. Sample rate = as above Bit depth = as above number of HD's = 1 I should probably also add that there are crackling and rustling noises, both associated with the actual sound I'm playing (so in time with some instruments / the drums, as if they hit the overdrive on every beat, but all the controls are fine) , and also random, like glitches, except my PC is behaving fine and I don't see why the audio would become corrupted.... If the Latency, Sample rate and Bit depth are the way to go, would you know how to find them out / even change them? I've tried on Sounds in Control Panel, and on the actual soundcard GUI (Realtek HD Audio Manager) and in Dxdiag, but there's nothing on it anywhere... Thank you lots!!:)
post edited by Spacecat - 2010/06/30 07:17:23
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chilldanny
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Re:Sonar 5 Producer Edition questions
2010/06/30 07:41:06
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Hi Spacecat. You could try a free program called ASIO4ALL: http://www.asio4all.com/ All the setup info you need can be found on the website. It's highly likely that your problems are because of using the internal soundcard. I'd suggest a cheap upgrade like M-Audio's Audiophile 24/96. And maybe a RAM increase too. Take a look at my specs below =)
* Windows10 (x64), Focusrite Safire Pro24, Sonar Platinum (x64) * MacOS High Sierra, Logic Pro X, Ableton Live 9 * Danny M
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wintaper
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Re:Sonar 5 Producer Edition questions
2010/06/30 08:28:57
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Intel i7 @ 3.60GHz, 12GB DDR3 1600MHz, Win7 / OSX 10.6.6, Sonar 8.53 / Pro Tools 9.0.1, RME RayDAT, UAD2-Quad, Focusrite OctoPre (x4), Euphonix MC Mix, Tascam US2400, Monette Ajna (x2), 15' Macbook Pro
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Spacecat
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Re:Sonar 5 Producer Edition questions
2010/06/30 09:33:30
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Hi chilldanny :) thank you! Why do you reccommend a universal sound driver, are the Realtek drivers not reasonable? The soundcard isn't an onboard chip, it's a physical card we put in. SORRY :D I should've thought the term "Realtek HD Audio" itself says NADA about that. I can open up the PC and have a look :) but right now I'm typing this message and wanted to add that I had no problems with Adobe Audition trial or other ones, but I really would like to use Sonar... so I'm a little suspicious about it being the setup, if you forgive me :) Also, are you sure 1.8Gb RAM is not enough for Sonar 5? That is really scary, the reccommendation is 512Mb o_o Thanks very much!!!! ♥
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Spacecat
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Re:Sonar 5 Producer Edition questions
2010/06/30 13:14:44
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Hi Wookiee, childanny, wintaper and everyone else who might feel inclined to have a giggle at hopeless newbie problems :D So... opened up the PC and the card is in fact a Creative Labs SoundBlaster Live thing. I can't remember why on earth I would have got it, but I dunno. I don't remember much of anything usually... Disabled the Realtek chip and enabled the CT card and I found some of the other data in Sonar under Audio options, maybe that'll help? OS = Windows XP Home Sound card = SB Live! Wave Device Sound card driver = RtkHDAud.sys 5.12.0001.3300 17.08.2001 CPU = P4 3Ghz RAM = 1.8 Gb Latency = still no idea, sorry Sample rate = (from Sonar) 44100 Bit depth = (from Sonar) 16 Number of HD's = 1 I've downloaded and installed the ASIO driver, but to no effect. What is so special about Sonar 5 that causes these problems?? =T.T=
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Wookiee
Rrrrugh arah-ah-woof?
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Re:Sonar 5 Producer Edition questions
2010/06/30 13:22:42
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☄ Helpful
As much I hate to say it most of your problems are probably from discrepancies within the sound card. Two things to check though. 1. What does Sonar report you sample rate as i.e. 44.1kHz or 48kHz. 2. Check what the creative control panel reports as the sample rate. They must be the same. More RAM would help and a second HD for Audio recording only would make a difference, some would say an necessity. Though as has been suggested a good Audio grade sound card like M-Audio's Audiophile 24/96 or similar will make a huge difference to your whole Sonar experience.
post edited by Wookiee - 2010/06/30 13:25:00
Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass, it's about learning to dance in the rain. Karma has a way of finding its own way home.
Primary, i7 8700K 16Gigs Ram, 3x500gb SSD's 2TB Backup HHD Saffire Pro 40. Win 10 64Bit Secondary i7 4790K, 32GB Ram, 500Gb SSD OS/Prog's, 1TB Audio, 1TB Samples HHD AudioBox USB, Win 10 64Bit CbB, Adam's A7x's - Event 20/20's, Arturia V6, Korg Digital Legacy, Softube Modular, Arturia Keylab-88, USB-MidiSport 8x8
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Spacecat
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Re:Sonar 5 Producer Edition questions
2010/06/30 14:10:35
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Hey Wookiee, thanks for replying again :) and giving a tip I really want to use! But... Sonar I could find, aye, 44.1Khz, but I can't find one for the soundcard. I don't have a Creative Control Panel, the card must be a freak of nature, lucky me :) Well... thanks anyway. Right now there isn't much else I can do then, I guess... Since it's really bizarre, and I already patched, I thought there was a known bug, that maybe someone in the forum knew. I don't even know if there is technical support for 5, but I also know what effect it has on technical support when you have a system with low specs, even if they match the requirements :D I've worked in tech (you'd think it had rubbed off on me more, eh? nope, nada...) thanks in any case! ♥
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CJaysMusic
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Re:Sonar 5 Producer Edition questions
2010/06/30 14:13:11
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This is straight from Cakewalks help file Realtek audio cards are generally provided with your computer. They are designed for general media playback and, though they will work with Cakewalk software, you would get better performance using a device designed specifically for audio recording. What that means is that onboard sound cards not made to be used with recording programs. They lack the drivers, converters and proper inputs and outputs!! You have had sonar for many years now, since your on version 5. Have you been using the realatec card for the past 3 years or so? If it worked before and doesn't work now, then you changed something in your pc, so change it back!! Here is a list of some good sound cards. http://audio-mastering-mixing.com/FAQ___Q_A.html#33 CJ
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Spacecat
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Re:Sonar 5 Producer Edition questions
2010/06/30 18:08:47
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Hey CJay, thank you for your reply! I have not been using Sonar 5 for more than a few weeks. I probably should have made that clear initially. I got a new, unused copy from Ebay, when I was looking for old versions of Sonar. I used Sonar 3 on a friend's PC but moved away and wanted to get something of my own. I don't know what soundcard was in that PC, but it can't have been too fancy at all. I really couldn't say that the recording process is working at all with either the Realtek chip when I had that enabled, or now with the SoundBlaster Live card and the chip disabled, so what I am getting from the Sonar helpfile text agrees with my experience of the trial versions of other software, that it should work on a basic level at least. The delay, distortion and drop-out is too serious a problem to be covered by "working ok" IMO, and this is what makes me very unsure that a new card would solve the problem :/ even if it would be (much) better quality overall. Which means I don't know what to invest in, a new card or a new software, and the card later. I can't really go for both at the same time at the moment if a small but functional SoundBlaster isn't even accepted. (And it doesn't even say so anywhere in the specs.) Sonar isn't one of those fragile software titles that would get messed up by an antivirus suite being open during installation, would it? Hm... Oh, and thanks for the list! I will check that out just now. thank you!!! x
post edited by Spacecat - 2010/06/30 18:13:33
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Rbh
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Re:Sonar 5 Producer Edition questions
2010/07/01 00:17:00
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☄ Helpful
I use Sonar 5 and have for about 4 years......it's actually a very solid version. You're main issue is the quality of your sound card. Having 1.8 gig memory will serve just fine for basic work. You will have to " render" or Freeze your soft synths in order to use more than a few at a time..but there's nothing wrong with that. It enhances productivity in a lot of ways. Your basic computer specs are fine for starting out - with the exception of one issue - You should really invest in a second hard drive for storage and streaming of Sonar audio files. Get one that is at least 7200 RPM - . Some people don't recommend running anti virus on an audio centered computer because it tends to enjoy interupting things for a few seconds here and there and that can interfere with smooth audio streaming. I don't know for sure because I don't use my audio computer online. Sound card / audio interface. I would recommend the EDIROL brand as they are fully tested and supported for Sonar. There are many others that give excellent performance as well. You will probably be well off to use a USB2 interface..... but if you choose to use a firewire interface, make sure that you are using a TI chipset in your computer firewire for a computer of that age. Welcome to the forum - There is a lot of useful information here. Feel free to PM if you have specific Sonar 5 questions. Most of the forum issues deal with the most current versions. Glad to help if I can.
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Wookiee
Rrrrugh arah-ah-woof?
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Re:Sonar 5 Producer Edition questions
2010/07/01 12:08:52
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Sonar isn't one of those fragile software titles that would get messed up by an antivirus suite being open during installation, would it? Hm... Not specifically, however if the AV is configured to scan every time a disk read/write occurs then this could cause streaming problems. Big +1 to Rbh comments and observations.
Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass, it's about learning to dance in the rain. Karma has a way of finding its own way home.
Primary, i7 8700K 16Gigs Ram, 3x500gb SSD's 2TB Backup HHD Saffire Pro 40. Win 10 64Bit Secondary i7 4790K, 32GB Ram, 500Gb SSD OS/Prog's, 1TB Audio, 1TB Samples HHD AudioBox USB, Win 10 64Bit CbB, Adam's A7x's - Event 20/20's, Arturia V6, Korg Digital Legacy, Softube Modular, Arturia Keylab-88, USB-MidiSport 8x8
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Spacecat
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Re:Sonar 5 Producer Edition questions
2010/07/01 13:45:44
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Hi Rbh!! Thanks so much for the information, explanation and reassurance, I could really use that :)! Great that you've used it for so long and it's been so positive! Again, thanks for breaking it down for me a bit. :) I do plan to invest a bit more in the system in the near future, and the info you posted really helps. ♥ Hi again Wookiee!! :) thanks for replying, yes by the time I posted it I wondered if I was asking myself a rethoric question 8) just to be on the safe side I should prob a) have the antivirus off when installing, and b) not have it on when using the software. Which should be quite alright. It just didn't occur to me before. Just like... ahem... *cough cough* I only remembered to update the audio driver for the realtek chip when I was noting down the info for here :D Thanks everyone !!! ♥
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tarsier
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Re:Sonar 5 Producer Edition questions
2010/07/01 15:01:22
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☄ Helpful
I use Sonar at work, and due to company policy have antivirus running with on-access scanning enabled. I've noticed no adverse effects due to it. Just throwing that out there. (and it's Sophos antivirus, if anyone wants to know...) As for soundcard, if you want a cheap solution, the best one is probably the M-Audio Audiophile 2496. It's a PCI card that you'd have to install inside the computer. A lot of people say to disable all sound devices except the one Sonar's going to use, but I take the opposite approach. I keep my motherboard's onboard sound chip enabled and set Windows to use that. That way, Sonar can use the "pro" card and Windows can use the onboard sound. That way they don't step on each other. It's worked well for me.
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Spacecat
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Re:Sonar 5 Producer Edition questions
2010/07/02 09:32:13
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Thanks tarsier! Interesting different advice! :) It actually concurs with my experience with the antivirus now (Bullguard). And thanks for the soundcard suggestion!! So here is what happened: I couldn't disable all of the antivirus suite without my system becoming rather unstable. Since their tech support had advised me to reinstall it due to an unrelated problem recently anyway, I figured OK and uninstalled it. No change. Then I uninstalled Sonar and reinstalled. No change, but at setup I noticed it tried to copy settings from the Sonar 7 PE trial I once had on the computer. I thought I had removed all of that... And some programs can't deal with demo leftovers. I dunno if this had something to do with it, but I uninstalled Sonar again, then did a registry cleanup of all things Cakewalk and defragged (there wasn't much need, but why not). Then I did a new installation (no antivirus present) and reinstalled my Antivirus afterwards. And: It works! No corruptions on recording new audio or playing existing tracks!! I want to avoid this happening again though, so I wonder: Did this happen because Sonar couldn't get through to the soundcard properly? It went through a setup screen with my Creative soundcard, and I don't know if it did that with the Realtek chip last time, or tried the soundcard but didn't quite make it (the card wasn't visible on my system, until we disabled the chip in the BIOS and slotted the soundcard into a different slot on the motherboard). Or could remainders of a Sonar 7 (or 8!) trial have caused problems? Or was my antivirus to blame? Or yes, maybe the slot my soundcard was sitting in was somehow dodgy. Eventhough this is a brand new motherboard and behaving well otherwise o_o Because if I upgrade to another sound card in the future, etc, etc, will I really need to uninstall and reinstall Sonar to pick up the card change? :) thanks very much for all the help and advice so far! ♥
post edited by Spacecat - 2010/07/02 09:35:21
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tarsier
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Re:Sonar 5 Producer Edition questions
2010/07/02 10:23:50
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I would say that the best way to avoid this problem is to get a soundcard with good ASIO drivers. You shouldn't have to re-install Sonar when you get a new soundcard, just switch Sonar to ASIO mode and select the card's ASIO drivers in Sonar's audio options.
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daveny5
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Re:Sonar 5 Producer Edition questions
2010/07/02 10:27:02
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SoundBlaster cards prefer a sample rate of 48000, not 44100. Also, select bit depth of 16. All of those are in Options-Audio. In Options-Audio-Drivers, deselect all but the SoundBlaster ins and outs.
Dave Computer: Intel i7, ASROCK H170M, 16GB/5TB+, Windows 10 Pro 64-bit, Sonar Platinum, TASCAM US-16x08, Cakewalk UM-3G MIDI I/F Instruments: SL-880 Keyboard controller, Korg 05R/W, Korg N1R, KORG Wavestation EX Axes: Fender Stratocaster, Line6 Variax 300, Ovation Acoustic, Takamine Nylon Acoustic, Behringer GX212 amp, Shure SM-58 mic, Rode NT1 condenser mic. Outboard: Mackie 1402-VLZ mixer, TC Helicon VoiceLive 2, Digitech Vocalist WS EX, PODXTLive, various stompboxes and stuff. Controllers: Korg nanoKONTROL, Wacom Bamboo Touchpad
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Spacecat
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Re:Sonar 5 Producer Edition questions
2014/02/28 11:58:56
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Thanks again, @tarsier and @daveny5 I'm glad these forum posts stick around. I'll refer to this info again. And I finally worked out the date signatures too so alright, this *is* from 2010, so that makes sense. Sorry I didn't reply before, that would have only been polite.
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