Home studio v Music Creator - advice please.

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splinx
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Re:Home studio v Music Creator - advice please. 2010/07/14 12:52:52 (permalink)
The OP made the point in his first post that he had some physical limitations, but the comments keep referring to latency, because - being musicians - you guys want to jam.

For writing music, forget the keyboard. Unplug it and all the latency issues, the clicks and pops and stuttering disappear.

Again, this is for "non-musicians."

Latency is not an issue if you are simply dragging around notes in Piano Roll, even doing it "live" - and that is all that is required for someone who simply wants to write music, again from V in his first post.

I have compositions using several 3rd party virtual instruments alongside (the included)  TTS-1, Cakewalk Sound Center, and the Studio Instruments running without major issues on my previously described very modest hardware. Yeah, there's some pretty sweet-sounding virtual instruments in there, and I find it to be a real gas auditioning newly written parts on the various soft synths.

Playing music and writing music are different. They are obviously closely related, but since I can't do A, but can do B after a fashion, they must be distinct operations.

Rock on!
#31
Beagle
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Re:Home studio v Music Creator - advice please. 2010/07/14 13:09:00 (permalink)
agreed.  I don't think I personally said anything to the contrary.

but personally I do disagree with the term "non-musicians."  if you are creating original music I think you're a musician.  what would you call your self otherwise?  a non-musician songwriter? 

MC can do what the OP asks.  BIAB does it easier, IMO, for someone who doesn't play an instrument, and MC and BIAB can be used together for a very powerful system to create music.

http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
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#32
splinx
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Re:Home studio v Music Creator - advice please. 2010/07/14 14:01:26 (permalink)
Well, that's an interesting question.

I used the term "non-musician" because that's how the OP described himself, and it's a fairly convenient shorthand for someone who doesn't know how to play a musical instrument, who can't sing, and who probably can't read music either. Guilty as described.

And so I've framed my comments here within the context defined by the OP - non-musician, some restricted digital mobility, tight budget, unexpected retirement, getting older - to answer his original question, specifically, but also in a more general sense, to provide some starting points for him and others who may feel the urge to create music, but don't know how.

Again, for those just starting out in any endeavor - especially this one (writing music in MC5) - I highly recommend keeping it as simple as possible while maintaining strict focus on your objective and nothing else.

MC5 is a standalone solution for those who want to write music. Composition in MC5 can be done simply by dragging around notes with your mouse for the various parts/instruments/tracks.

The results will depend on your talent, your dedication, and timely visits from your Muse. Those are the important issues, not the soundcard.





#33
Beagle
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Re:Home studio v Music Creator - advice please. 2010/07/14 14:06:54 (permalink)
I think you've made your point.

http://soundcloud.com/beaglesound/sets/featured-songs-1
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#34
Robomusic
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Re:Home studio v Music Creator - advice please. 2010/07/14 14:50:47 (permalink)
What splinx is saying and i agree, the built in is fine if everything you do is inside the "box". If the process is to dice up loops, paint in notes and such and use the sound center and TTS your good to go. If you start to add a lot of softsynths and heavy effects, then after a while the system bogs down, and the overall timing becomes more critical, but that goes to ram and processor as much as card. 

If you are playing in the midi notes and data from an external controller or keyboard and then trying to monitor that thru a built in card you will have problems, and the latency will raise it ugly head. If you are trying to monitor the mix and add live instruments and vocals you will find problems at the level of monitoring, and will need a software driver for the card that handles that better. Built in card have rather poor driver modes.
 
If composing inside MC, and playback is all that is involved then the built in will get you there.

I'd Seize the day but i can't quite reach it!

http://www.acidplanet.com/artist.asp?AID=33477&T=1260
Music Town
#35
Tap
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Re:Home studio v Music Creator - advice please. 2010/07/14 17:04:58 (permalink)
And, there are some really neat tricks to making the entry of music in the Piano Roll a lot easier if one chooses to use this option to compose music. Using the Keyboard macros, I have programmed a combination of the numeric keys and judiciously mapped alpha-numeric keys to make switching modes easier. I started by mapping the k key to open the keyboard macro editor. Just my couple of cents ....



MC4 - M-Audio FW410 / Behringer UCA202 - Fender Strat / Jazzmaster / DuoSonic / Washburn / Peavy Foundation M-Audio Radium 49 Roland Juno 106 / JazzChorus / Seymore Duncan Convertible - HP A1230N ( AMD Athalon 3800+ 2G Ram + 200G HD )

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#36
Robomusic
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Re:Home studio v Music Creator - advice please. 2010/07/14 18:01:18 (permalink)
One last point is, that iall you are doing is dragging notes around, then playing them live, it should be fine, buuuuut.... If you use a ton of softsynths and effects then the sound card can come back into play at some points. Built in sound cards have horrible drivers for the most part. You can use ASIO4All, but that can cause problems on some systems.

Just sayin'

I'd Seize the day but i can't quite reach it!

http://www.acidplanet.com/artist.asp?AID=33477&T=1260
Music Town
#37
Guitarhacker
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Re:Home studio v Music Creator - advice please. 2010/07/14 19:35:00 (permalink)
I agree... you can write music on MC5 with a factory card..... BUT..... all I said about the cards and other software STILL holds true...and having them will make your job so much easier.



My website & music: www.herbhartley.com

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"Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer 
#38
Robomusic
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Re:Home studio v Music Creator - advice please. 2010/07/14 20:24:39 (permalink)
Absolutely, the drivers on the built ins do not have the flesability to do the difficult tasks that we ask of them in the long run. They handle audio stream pretty well, and that is what comes out the master buss of the DAW program. Still it also has to do with load, and softsynths and effects can stress that. The driver has to do with ebb and flow of the audio data at times, and a well written solid ASIO driver can make a lot of difference.

Any whoo dat is enough from me!

I'd Seize the day but i can't quite reach it!

http://www.acidplanet.com/artist.asp?AID=33477&T=1260
Music Town
#39
57Gregy
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Re:Home studio v Music Creator - advice please. 2010/07/15 00:29:42 (permalink)
So, I think we all agree that Vincent can input notes with his mouse, or record them in with his keyboard, without additional expense.
The upgrade to MC 5 is a good thing, not only for future-proofing due to an untimely computer explosion and the necessity of an OS upgrade, but for the additional sounds and the support for VST soft synths and effects.
Give it a whirl, Vincent.
We'll be here if you have any more questions.

Greg 
I am selling my MIM Fender Stratocaster HSS, red and black. PM for more details.

Music Creator 2003, MC Pro 24, SONAR Home Studio 6 XL, SONAR  X3e, CbB, Focusrite Saffire, not enough space.
Everything is better with pie. 

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#40
lostandconfused
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Re:Home studio v Music Creator - advice please. 2010/07/15 18:35:33 (permalink)
Wow!  How precient was the selection of 'lostandconfused' as a monica?

Right , Gary, [my lad] has just 'phoned, his available card is a creative Soundblaster 5.1. while the card in my computer is a Realtec 97 Audio.

If it's OK with you lads I'm going to try to accomodate all that has been suggested.  I don't think there is much danger of me turning into a music/computer buff anytime soon, but,  I have been a good boy and done my homework and made time to 'mess around' with Home Studio.  As before, I struggled with a project for a while and [when the lump hammer failed], I then returned to the advice I have received here and I now have a trial project with 6 midi tracks and 1 drum loop and which, thanks to you, plays back as 7 instrument sounds instead of 7 piano's.  I even rembered to grab a piece of paper and write down the sequence of steps taken to accomplish this so I wouldn't forget how to do it.  Now, if only I could remeber where I put it?  This may not be music, it may be just noise - but it's my noise!

I'll let Gary [my lad] fit his soundcard; I'll have a look at some dedicated music cards, and if, or as soon as, I start hearing [clicks and pops?] I'll sort something out.

Now for the bad news. 

I've had an email from the suppliers of my ordered MC5.  They promised me a ten day 'stay of execution' and the rotters have only gone and posted it early.  

Yours, [in dread],

Vincent.
#41
Guitarhacker
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Re:Home studio v Music Creator - advice please. 2010/07/15 19:14:54 (permalink)
10 day delay... that's some serious latency...... bummer!

My website & music: www.herbhartley.com

MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW   
Focusrite Firewire Saffire Interface


BMI/NSAI

"Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer 
#42
splinx
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Re:Home studio v Music Creator - advice please. 2010/07/16 18:16:41 (permalink)
But seven MIDI tracks? That's some serious creativity, and great news.  

Dream in Sight, Muse Onboard, Prepare to Engage Overdrive...
 
#43
splinx
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Re:Home studio v Music Creator - advice please. 2010/07/17 21:39:51 (permalink)
(snip)
post edited by splinx - 2010/07/17 23:59:53
#44
Guitarhacker
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Re:Home studio v Music Creator - advice please. 2010/07/17 23:20:51 (permalink)
you need to post your songs in the SONGS forum and...provide a direct link to the song.

I really enjoy jazz stuff and would love to hear them

My website & music: www.herbhartley.com

MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW   
Focusrite Firewire Saffire Interface


BMI/NSAI

"Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer 
#45
lostandconfused
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Re:Home studio v Music Creator - advice please. 2010/07/18 07:09:13 (permalink)
Hello All,

Just logged on, [sorry had a couple of very hectic, unproductive days].

When I was writing my 'poems/song lyrics' it was purely for my own satisfaction, because I had seen or heard something and it made me think, "I wonder why/if...." and I then felt compelled to try to 'write it out'.  Although essentially private, this facet of my 'personality' could not be concealed from my friends and was frequently the object of some mirth if not outright derision.  Only 'weirdos' write poems, right?

I've said "thanks for the help" and it is sincere, but I can't tell you how immeasureably pleased I am at some of the highly flattering [and undeserved] comments I've just seen here.  I've been called a lot of things in my time - some of them true, but I've never been called a musican before.  Thanks Beagle et al, you've warmed my heart.

Seriously, [and I hope that this is just temporary] the six tracks I recorded are 'just noise'.  I was just excited that after so long there is a chance that I might be able to trap the ephemeral 'sounds in my head' on my computer and manipulate them into some kind of [melodic?] order.  I am a long, long way from meriting the epithet above - but, after 40 years, I'll snatch it greedily, it just the same.

MC5 arrived and I managed to install it [without assistance from Gary].  Just 'fiddling' at the moment, trying to work out where things are and how to move them.  I watched some MC5 videos on Youtube(?) and will have to keep revisiting.

As no one objected when I said that I had printed out your earlier instructions  I am now going to print out the comments here and then, when I am dead I can, justifiably, [I've got it in writing], have engarved on my tombstone:

                   'Here lies a deranged and deluded man. 
                               He was, of course,
                                   a Musician.'

Regards,

Vincent.

#46
57Gregy
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Re:Home studio v Music Creator - advice please. 2010/07/18 10:01:58 (permalink)

Greg 
I am selling my MIM Fender Stratocaster HSS, red and black. PM for more details.

Music Creator 2003, MC Pro 24, SONAR Home Studio 6 XL, SONAR  X3e, CbB, Focusrite Saffire, not enough space.
Everything is better with pie. 

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=609446
http://www.reverbnation.com/#!/gregfields 
#47
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