SHS7 Shapes vs. PA9 Vol Envelopes (with graphics)

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larrymcg
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2010/07/21 15:41:51 (permalink)

SHS7 Shapes vs. PA9 Vol Envelopes (with graphics)

I'm migrating from PA9 to SHS7.  Some of the audio tracks in PA9 have volume envelopes which get turned into Shapes in SHS7.
The PA9 and SHS7 versions of the tracks sound the same but the visual representations are quite different.
And the event list view in SHS7 shows the Shapes as events but the data (parameters) associated with the Shape events is very mystical (at least to me).  Here are the SHS7 and PA9 waveforms.  The SHS7 image includes the event list too.



The above  SHS7 drawing of the shape shows a gain of 0db but it is drawn way above the 0db line.
Also, in the event list, what do those parameters mean?



This is the volume envelope from PA9 for reference.


--Larry  (PS: I'm not sure the graphics will show correctly.  Hope so!)

EDIT:  I think I got the images in this time
post edited by larrymcg - 2010/07/21 17:34:30

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    larrymcg
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    Re:SHS7 Shapes vs. PA9 Vol Envelopes (with graphics) 2010/07/21 17:38:14 (permalink)
    It only took 4 tries to get the graphics included.  There are a lot of ways to do it wrong!
    --Larry  

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    RobertB
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    Re:SHS7 Shapes vs. PA9 Vol Envelopes (with graphics) 2010/07/21 21:01:49 (permalink)
    Larry, glad to see you are pushing forward.
    The only reference I can find to "shapes" has to do with automation envelopes.
    If you look at the MBT parameter (measures, beats, ticks) the events coincide with your nodes.
    I can't explain the gain offset, but the bias of the graphic has come up before.
    If I remember right, it has to do with the soundcard. That's a pretty dramatic swing, and I believe it tends to be more pronounced in low grade cards, such as the built-ins.
    I don't think it is anything to be overly concerned with, but it does look odd.
    Perhaps one of the electrical engineers (Reece?) can shed some light on that.

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    daveny5
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    Re:SHS7 Shapes vs. PA9 Vol Envelopes (with graphics) 2010/07/21 21:33:33 (permalink)
    Actually the upgrade path from ProAudio is to Sonar Studio and not Home Studio so you lost some value there.

    Dave
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    larrymcg
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    Re:SHS7 Shapes vs. PA9 Vol Envelopes (with graphics) 2010/07/22 01:09:40 (permalink)
    Thanks for the feedback, RobertB.  I am using on-board sound.  I used to use an M-Audio Revolution 5.1 but there were some issues getting it to work on this new system even though the old and new systems were both WinXP.  So far the on-board sound is working for me but if I run into issues I can always make the Rev 5.1 work or get another soundcard.

    I wanted to know about the Shape parameters because sometime I edit events in the event list.  However, I've discovered that Shape events can not be edited in the event list.  You have to do it graphically.

    Dave, I agree with you on the upgrade path.  I did research on the Cakewalk site but it doesn't give enough details to do a real comparison of PA9 and SHS7.  Since my needs are small, I can probably get along with SHS7.  Time will tell.....

    And I learned a lesson.  Rather than rely only on marketing info, ask the experienced folks on these forums!

    --Larry

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    Beagle
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    Re:SHS7 Shapes vs. PA9 Vol Envelopes (with graphics) 2010/07/22 08:25:54 (permalink)
    that is an odd looking "event" - I've never seen that (but I rarely ever edit the EVENT list anyway, so I'm sure it's there and I just haven't seen it).  and I'm surprised you can't edit those.  looks like they would be like any other event.

    as far as the envelope not being in line with the markings of the track, I don't remember it being anything to do with the soundcard, if RobertB remembers that happening because of the soundcard then I believe him, I just haven't seen messages in the forum about it that I remember.

    my experience is that the envelopes don't follow the track level convention - they have their own "convention" which is not shown anywhere in a "ruler" type relationship.  the only way to know if you're on 0dB or not is by clicking on the envelope, or looking at what the slider is at for a particular place in the timeline.

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