Pommerntat
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Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
Hi, this is my very first post here. I am a nubie of sorts, but not new to Cakewalk software, as I have been a Cakewalk user since Pro Audio 4.01, and every version through Pro Audio 9. I know this is ancient stuff. I had several hardware MIDI modules connected through an old parallel port interface called a "Midiator." It worked well with Win98's MIDI capabilities. The Home studio7 interface looks pretty familiar. The Sonar 8.5 interface looks like something from another planet.
My windows 98 machine finally croaked so I decided to try to bring things up to date. The Midiator is now useless, as drivers beyond win98 don't exist. I still have those 5 or 6 rack mount synths, and a swell Peavey 88-note MIDI Controller with hammer action made in Italy (believe it or not). I don't see any reason to chuck this gear. All that being said, I have no clue on how to interface these boxes with Sonar or Home Studio. The tutorials talk about "drivers," but ain't no driver for a Roland D-550 or a Korg Trinity I'm aware of. I know I need a MIDI-USB or 1394 "mixer" of sorts, but that still leaves me with the logical interface with the software and its soft synths.
So. Where can I turn for direction? Thanks a bunch to anyone who can steer me.
I built a Win7 Pro Intel Q8600 Quad with 4g memory, WD Raptor drive, Seagate 750gb data drive, Nvidea Geforce GT8800. I managed to shoehorn it all into a 3U rack mount case (which I strongly do not recommend.)
Heeelp!?
PS Why does Roland feel the need to sell shampoo?
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planetearth
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/09/30 04:28:21
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What is it you want to know specifically?
You don't need drivers for your keyboards or a "mixer" per se. You need drivers for your internal or external sound card (which will get the sounds and MIDI data from your keyboards into the computer, and you need .INS files for your keyboards.
I wasn't aware Roland was selling shampoo, and I've had a Roland keyboard since 1987! Thanks for the tip!
SONAR Platinum ▪ NI Komplete, Korg DLC, Arturia V5 Collection, Dimension Pro, IK Multimedia & other synths ▪ Les Paul, Peavey and Yamaha guitars. Listen to some of my stuff here: https://soundcloud.com/shadowsoflife . Comments from other SONAR users are always welcome!
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Pommerntat
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/01 13:56:09
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Yea. If you go to the Cakewalk site and look at the Home Studio 7 tutorials, they begin with 30-second shampoo commercials. These tutorials don't appear to be expensive productions. I don't get it. I've never seen such a thing. Anyhow, In Cakewalk product, there is a drop-down menu where you can select MIDI devices. I'm familiar with that part. But the tutorials say you need to have a driver associated with each instrument. There is even a list of drivers available on the Cakewalk website. Back in the day you would define the instrument yourself and assign a port to it. I know it sounds like a stupid question, but I'm looking at sound cards and wondering what role an audio driver would play in dealing with a bunch of MIDI data and port assignments. I have a hardware mixer and at this point am not looking at analog inputs into the system. In Windows 98, for example, there was a multimedia applet that allowed for the configuration of specific MIDI port assignments. You could then assign ports (1-16) to midi interface devices, such as the KEY electronics Midiator (which expanded the number of available ports to 128). You could assign Cakewalk Pro audio 9 ports to interface with the external MIDI device through the Windows98 MIDI configuration applet (see attached images). You could set up a MIDI port assignment "scheme," give it a name and save it. THEN, you could assign ports in Pro Audio9 to specific MIDI instruments, setting up program and bank changing capabilities according to MIDI spec. Then you could assign specific MIDI instruments to tracks and manipulate them in a the ways familiar to Cakewalk. All I'm seeing in Win7 is the Media Center, which is, of course, N/A. I know some folks would say "well, then just go back to Windows 98," but I I know there are ways to put this system back together using current technology. I just don't know what they are or where to look. Hardware manufacturers such as MOTU or Cakewalk or M-Audio sport product that is audio-centric with MIDI capability limited to controller inputs because, well, the synths are all pretty much software based. Thanks for any direction you can provide for this geezer!  
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planetearth
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/01 17:06:01
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Well, no...this isn't exactly Windows 98. Actually, in many ways, it's easier.
The first thing we need to know is what your audio and MIDI input/output devices are. Don't worry about the hardware keyboards; we'll get to them later. We just need to know how you plan to get audio and MIDI into and out of the system.
For example, I use a Cakewalk UM-2G MIDI interface to get MIDI into and out of the computer, and an E-MU 0404 audio card for the audio. What are you using?
SONAR Platinum ▪ NI Komplete, Korg DLC, Arturia V5 Collection, Dimension Pro, IK Multimedia & other synths ▪ Les Paul, Peavey and Yamaha guitars. Listen to some of my stuff here: https://soundcloud.com/shadowsoflife . Comments from other SONAR users are always welcome!
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Pommerntat
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/01 23:03:55
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I really appreciate the help. Really.
I have a rack with 6 synth modules and a couple of effects modules. The original interface routed all MIDI (including the Peavey DPM C8 controller) through the Midiator device I mentioned earler. The Midiator hooked up with Win98 through a driver which was never updated, hence being stuck in Win98Land.
On the audio side, I have a Mackie LM3204 16-channel mixer pushing a pair of self-powered Event 20/20 monitors. That's it. From a recording standpoint, no audio I/O on the computer at all beyond the sound card making the gee-whiz win98 startup sound.
I have since parked a Baldwin parlor grand in the living room and no doubt would like to put a mic on it.
I also have some old Pro Audio projects I'd really like to bring back from the dead. This configuration is so simple I'm sure I'd run out and buy the wrong stuff.
My original though was to use something lilke a MOTU Micro Express paired with a USB audio device like their MK-3.
How am I doing so far?
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planetearth
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/02 01:27:01
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You're doing great so far! The MOTU Micro Express might be a bit overkill unless you actually need SMPTE timecode and four MIDI inputs. You only list two keyboards that have keys; four MIDI inputs might be more than you need. And unless you're locking your music to film or tape, the SMPTE timecode is unnecessary, too. Since you already have a mixer, you'll want to ask yourself if you want to bring your keyboards/synths into that and take two (or four) audio outputs from that into your computer. That will help you determine how many audio inputs you need for your sound card. If you only really need two, then you have many affordable choices. If you think you need four, eight or 16 audio inputs (and/or outputs), you don't have many affordable choices (you're getting into professional gear at this point)--but you still have choices. In the example I gave you earlier, I have a relatively inexpensive E-MU 0404 and a Cakewalk 2-in/2-out MIDI interface. I bring two keyboards, a drum machine and outboard effects into a Yamaha mixer. I don't use the sounds on the Yamaha keyboard much, but if I do, I record the audio using the two audio channels on the E-MU 0404. To record MIDI data, I use either the Yamaha or the Roland as a controller into the Cakewalk UM-2G MIDI interface, which then goes into SONAR to drive a softsynth. This works for me (though I'd love to have more, of course!), but your mileage may vary. Bottom line: figure out how many discrete audio inputs you think you'll need into your computer and how many MIDI controllers you'll want to be able to use. Then we can determine which interface you should get. And don't worry at all about "drivers". 
SONAR Platinum ▪ NI Komplete, Korg DLC, Arturia V5 Collection, Dimension Pro, IK Multimedia & other synths ▪ Les Paul, Peavey and Yamaha guitars. Listen to some of my stuff here: https://soundcloud.com/shadowsoflife . Comments from other SONAR users are always welcome!
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Pommerntat
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/05 17:14:06
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Hmm.. I think some of this is starting to sink in. I think one of the primary disconnects I have is recording MIDI vs. audio. To me, these are two separate paradigms, if you will. My primary goal at this point is to record MIDI, using a MIDI sequencer. That way, I can manipulate the tracks in a gazillion ways before the audio is ready for recording. One challenge for me is to incorporate the use of outboard synths in addition to the soft synths. So for me, the first part of the project is complete when all the "synthetic" audio is mixed down and reaches the monitors. With six outboard synths though, I have six discreet in/out/thru ports. (Using the thru ports, I could fudge a little and consolidate the lines into maybe four before latency becomes an issue.) So from a strictly MIDI standpoint, my mystery box would need at least four in, four out, and one in for the controller. I don't know if Sonar can play back MIDI and record audio simultaneously. Would I need two separate computers living in two separate worlds? Ohhhh, I'm heading for the Tylenol now! 
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planetearth
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/05 17:37:49
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If you really have six outboard synths, you still only need ONE MIDI input, unless you want to use ALL of those hardware synths as controllers at one time or another. (Please ignore any preconceived notions of latency or having to use MIDI Thru ports; that's no longer the issue it used to be.) The problem is, you mention having six, but you only want to use one as "the controller". With a 4-in or 6-in MIDI interface, you could use four or six hardware synths to drive SONAR--and that may be a bit much for what you really need to do. It's getting a bit confusing because I don't remember you saying you had six hardware synths--at least, not until this post. This might go a bit easier if you filled out your "signature" (like you see at the bottom of many of our posts), and included your hardware and software synths and anything else you're not extremely ashamed to admit owning. SONAR can record and play back MIDI and audio at the same time; that is no problem at all. But you need a MIDI interface and an audio interface. These are almost always the same device. Once I get a better idea of what you really have, I'll be able to give you a better idea of what you actually need. (And if you want to draw up a flow-chart or a layout of your studio, feel free to send that to me.) I still don't think you'll need more than two MIDI inputs and outputs and 2 audio inputs and outputs. More can be better...but it can also be overwhelming. I too left the MIDI music-making arena for a decade. When I returned in 2004, I was almost ashamed to ask my local music store rep what had changed. ("Are they still using MIDI?" "Where can I get parts for my Korg Poly-800?" "Does this haircut make me look too 'Spandau Ballet'?" "Why are you laughing at me?") Turns out, most of what you learned in the early versions of Cakewalk still applies. There's just better, faster, easier and cheaper ways of doing it now. Save the Tylenol for now. You'll need it when we get into tweaking your sound card.
SONAR Platinum ▪ NI Komplete, Korg DLC, Arturia V5 Collection, Dimension Pro, IK Multimedia & other synths ▪ Les Paul, Peavey and Yamaha guitars. Listen to some of my stuff here: https://soundcloud.com/shadowsoflife . Comments from other SONAR users are always welcome!
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Pommerntat
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/07 01:19:03
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Hey, I spent almost the entire decade of the 80's wearing a mullett and playing in clubs. That's why I still have all this crap. I know I should list my configuration, but, well, it hasn't happened yet. This is what I have: Outboard Hardware Synth Modules (all rack mount):
1)Korg Trinity TR Rack
2)Korg Wavestation SR
3)Roland TD-7 Drum Module
4)Alesis Nano Bass module
5)Roland P-330 Piano Module
6)Roland D-550 (Rack version of the fabled D-50)
Keyboard controller:
Peavey DPM C8 (88 note keyboard with an awesome Italian-made hammer action)
Mixer:
Mackie LM 3204 16 (stereo) channels
Computer:
Intel Q8600 Quad
4GB Ram
140GB system drive
750GB data drive
Windows 7 Pro
No firewire (blast!)
Thanks again for your help!! 
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planetearth
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/07 09:21:32
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Well-done! Very thorough and helpful. And for what it's worth, I'd love to have those modules, regardless of when they were made!
Out of curiosity, why do you have the modules sending MIDI data back to SONAR (or at least, back out)? Are you using this for SYSEX dumps? Most modules are designed to receive data and don't "generate" any data per se, so a MIDI output may not be required. I could see maybe using the buttons on the drum module, but you'd probably get better response in programming drums from your Peavey.
SONAR Platinum ▪ NI Komplete, Korg DLC, Arturia V5 Collection, Dimension Pro, IK Multimedia & other synths ▪ Les Paul, Peavey and Yamaha guitars. Listen to some of my stuff here: https://soundcloud.com/shadowsoflife . Comments from other SONAR users are always welcome!
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brundlefly
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/07 14:14:39
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Out of curiosity, why do you have the modules sending MIDI data back to SONAR (or at least, back out)? Are you using this for SYSEX dumps? Most modules are designed to receive data and don't "generate" any data per se, so a MIDI output may not be required. I could see maybe using the buttons on the drum module, but you'd probably get better response in programming drums from your Peavey. I agree that it should not be necessary to have outputs from the Synth Modules unless you want to save patches and setups with SysEx dumps. And unless your arrangments are really dense, you can probably get away with an interface that has two pairs of MIDI ports with a little daisy-chaining of the synths. I have a similar setup, and own a MOTU MIDI Express XT, but haven't really used if for a while. I have two keyboard synths 9RD-300s and QS8) connected to each of two MIDI I/O pairs on my E-MU 1820m, and daisy chain an UltraProteus and a D-110 on the QS-8's THRU, and another D-110 on the RD-300s' THRU. The only caveat is that some synths may alter the data echoed to THRU. Specifically, I found that it was important not to chain anything from either of the D-110s, because they "quantize" velocity values down to something like 8 discrete values. You might want to check that your Roland modules don't do this if you don't have enough ports to ensure that they're all at the end of a chain. Also, I would highly recommend getting an interface that has enough audio inputs to accomodate direct input from most or all of your synths so you don't have to be messing with your mixer all the time to get the signal you want, and be sure that what you're hearing is what you're recording without any extraneous noise from idling synths, etc. Trying to keep track of all your signal routing in SONAR can be tough enough without throwing a mixer into the mix. Use the Mixer as an output level control, and maybe a place to patch your PC audio output and other media players to your monitoring system. That's what I do with my old Mackie 1402
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planetearth
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/07 21:10:24
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brundlefly
Out of curiosity, why do you have the modules sending MIDI data back to SONAR (or at least, back out)? Are you using this for SYSEX dumps? Most modules are designed to receive data and don't "generate" any data per se, so a MIDI output may not be required. I could see maybe using the buttons on the drum module, but you'd probably get better response in programming drums from your Peavey. I agree that it should not be necessary to have outputs from the Synth Modules unless you want to save patches and setups with SysEx dumps. And unless your arrangements are really dense, you can probably get away with an interface that has two pairs of MIDI ports with a little daisy-chaining of the synths.
The only caveat is that some synths may alter the data echoed to THRU. Specifically, I found that it was important not to chain anything from either of the D-110s, because they "quantize" velocity values down to something like 8 discrete values. You might want to check that your Roland modules don't do this if you don't have enough ports to ensure that they're all at the end of a chain.
Also, I would highly recommend getting an interface that has enough audio inputs to accommodate direct input from most or all of your synths so you don't have to be messing with your mixer all the time to get the signal you want, and be sure that what you're hearing is what you're recording without any extraneous noise from idling synths, etc. Trying to keep track of all your signal routing in SONAR can be tough enough without throwing a mixer into the mix.
Use the Mixer as an output level control, and maybe a place to patch your PC audio output and other media players to your monitoring system. That's what I do with my old Mackie 1402
I agree with Seńor Brundlefly. While I haven't heard about an issue with the D-110 quantizing velocities, I know older synths and modules like that (and my D-10) introduced some latency if you used their MIDI Thru ports. Avoid them if you can, since they're not just mirror copies of the MIDI In port; they actually process the data, and in doing so, introduce latency. Keyboard magazine did a lot of reporting on this back in the early '90s. I don't know if it's still an issue now (with faster processors in today's hardware synths), but I don't take the chance. And yes, your mixer should only have whichever channels need to be "active" at any one time to get the cleanest signal, and if you can set everything at "unity" for your gain, you can use SONAR to mix your levels. Mackies generally have very clean signal paths, so you should have no problem with that, assuming you have enough inputs for all your modules (if you don't, I'll be glad to take a few of them off your hands). You'll return one set of stereo outputs from your PC to the Mackie, and that can be sent to your control room power amp.
post edited by planetearth - 2010/10/07 21:13:11
SONAR Platinum ▪ NI Komplete, Korg DLC, Arturia V5 Collection, Dimension Pro, IK Multimedia & other synths ▪ Les Paul, Peavey and Yamaha guitars. Listen to some of my stuff here: https://soundcloud.com/shadowsoflife . Comments from other SONAR users are always welcome!
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brundlefly
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/08 14:51:45
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While I haven't heard about an issue with the D-110 quantizing velocities, I know older synths and modules like that (and my D-10) introduced some latency if you used their MIDI Thru ports. Hmmm... I must have had something else going on when I observed this. I just double-checked it, and I'm getting the full range and resolution of velocities returned from the D-110's THRU, and no added MIDI delay - same 2.5ms round-trip I get patching OUT directly to IN on my interface (EMU-1820m PCI).
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planetearth
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/08 15:36:08
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brundlefly
While I haven't heard about an issue with the D-110 quantizing velocities, I know older synths and modules like that (and my D-10) introduced some latency if you used their MIDI Thru ports.
Hmmm... I must have had something else going on when I observed this. I just double-checked it, and I'm getting the full range and resolution of velocities returned from the D-110's THRU, and no added MIDI delay - same 2.5ms round-trip I get patching OUT directly to IN on my interface (EMU-1820m PCI).
Interesting. I've never tried to measure the MIDI Thru latency myself; I just took Keyboard magazine's word for it. Still, I've been using a $30 passive MIDI Thru splitter/box for 20 years and haven't had a latency problem--at least, nothing that I could tie to that. Thanks for clarifying, though!
SONAR Platinum ▪ NI Komplete, Korg DLC, Arturia V5 Collection, Dimension Pro, IK Multimedia & other synths ▪ Les Paul, Peavey and Yamaha guitars. Listen to some of my stuff here: https://soundcloud.com/shadowsoflife . Comments from other SONAR users are always welcome!
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Pommerntat
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/09 01:35:22
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Hm. In my rig I think I limited the use of "thru" to just one device for fear of introducing latency. I never actually made any measurements to determine whether that was ever actually an issue, although I do recall reading about it in the back of some modules' manuals. Anyway, getting back to MIDI outputs: This is my logic: MIDI data signal from Peavey controller is directed to the appropriate module (via mystery box). Module in turn makes marvelous noise. However, comma, MIDI data needs to be routed back to Sonar in order to be recorded. Hence MIDI out from module. If, on the other hand, the MIDI data coming from the Peavey is in fact going to both the module and to Sonar, then probably no need for MIDI outs on the modules. Playing back tracks in Sonar simply sends MIDI data back to modules, making several simultaneous marvelous noises. Once that is done, audio recording can commence. So when I'm recording audio, I'm looking at 12 jacks in something, or swapping out audio jacks. MOTU MIDI device with 12 audio jacks? Granted the mixer will introduce it's own "stuff" into the signal, it seems like a fairly viable option to me. So why the discreet inputs? Maybe I should change my forum name to "Clueless." 
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planetearth
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/09 02:06:51
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MIDI data signal from Peavey controller is directed to the appropriate module (via mystery box). Module in turn makes marvelous noise. However, comma, MIDI data needs to be routed back to Sonar in order to be recorded. Hence MIDI out from module. Nope. The MIDI info goes through the computer (where it's recorded) and out to your modules. Once that is done, audio recording can commence. So when I'm recording audio, I'm looking at 12 jacks in something, or swapping out audio jacks. MOTU MIDI device with 12 audio jacks? Granted the mixer will introduce it's own "stuff" into the signal, it seems like a fairly viable option to me. So why the discreet inputs? You don't need 12 audio jacks/inputs. You either record each module one at a time in stereo (if you're using them for discrete sounds), or you layer them and record that stereo submix into SONAR. For ultimate flexibility, you could go with a high-end, multi-input audio interface, but it would be quite expensive. The Focusrite Saffire Pro 40 offers 20 inputs and outputs in a rack-mount device and connects to your PC via Firewire...for around $499. On the lower end, the M-audio Delta 66 is available for $189. It's an internal device, with six inputs and outputs and decent A/D converters. If you go for a multi-input device like the Focusrite (or M-Audio's similar offering, the ProFire 2626), you wouldn't even need to plug your synths into your Mackie. Their pristine, analogue audio outputs could go directly into the Focusrite and then straight into the PC. Bottom line: Don't worry about MIDI Thru or MIDI Out on your modules. And don't worry about changing your user name!
post edited by planetearth - 2010/10/09 02:09:41
SONAR Platinum ▪ NI Komplete, Korg DLC, Arturia V5 Collection, Dimension Pro, IK Multimedia & other synths ▪ Les Paul, Peavey and Yamaha guitars. Listen to some of my stuff here: https://soundcloud.com/shadowsoflife . Comments from other SONAR users are always welcome!
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Pommerntat
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/10 03:01:05
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So, what I hear you saying (my shrink taught me that) is that when I play something on the controller, the data goes into sonar first then squirts out to the module on the appropriate MIDI channel. That's great! And it does cut down on the complexity. I'd still prefer 6 MIDI ins although I could cut it to 4.
Hmm. Delta 66. Wow, that Delta 1010 looks pretty cool. The 1010LT looks . . . all those wires!
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planetearth
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/10 11:40:20
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So, what I hear you saying (my shrink taught me that) is that when I play something on the controller, the data goes into sonar first then squirts out to the module on the appropriate MIDI channel. See? And you thought all those years of therapy weren't helping you with your music at all! Yes, SONAR will take in the MIDI data first, and spit it out to whichever module you choose (based upon the MIDI port and channel)--that's the beauty of it. You can have the Peavey drive any (or all) of your hardware modules, or any internal softsynth. You can layer sounds this way, too, between hardware and softsynth sounds. Ultimately, you'll still need to record your hardware synths into SONAR, so get as many inputs as you're comfortable using. The Deltas have respectable A/D converters, and I don't recall too many people here complaining about them. You should check Delta's site for the latest drivers for the card you want (and your operating system) though, just to be sure its up-to-date. You really only need two outputs from SONAR (the stereo mix, which goes to your control room amp) unless you're going to use your Mackie to mix your songs. While that's usually easier than mixing with a mouse, it requires you to convert your digital audio back to analogue to go into the Mackie...and then you need something to record that finished mix. If it's another digital device, you're converting back into digital again...and I think you see where this is going. Again, it took me a little while to see the flexibility of it all when I came back after a 10-year prison ter--er, self-imposed hiatus, and I'm still learning new routing tricks from the people in these forums. Within a week or two, you'll see how this beats the old way of doing it, at a fraction of the cost in hardware.
SONAR Platinum ▪ NI Komplete, Korg DLC, Arturia V5 Collection, Dimension Pro, IK Multimedia & other synths ▪ Les Paul, Peavey and Yamaha guitars. Listen to some of my stuff here: https://soundcloud.com/shadowsoflife . Comments from other SONAR users are always welcome!
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Pommerntat
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/10 20:24:19
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So, The disgise . . I get it now. I can relate, I did 10 years hard time in an IT sweatshop.
You know, I think we're getting close. The E-MU 404 you're using looks good, although I'm not sure I can shoehorn a PCIe card into my 3U can. As it is, I will have to dremel a card slot in the back, as the manufacturer forgot to. I mean, the screwhole is there, but no cardslot. Note: Don't EVER try to build a 3U rack mount can with an ATX board. Even if they say it will work with no problem. 4U, fine. 3U will make you grow old fast. I'll have to post some pictures.
But I digress. What do you think of PCI for audio and outboard USB for MIDI? I'll need a MIDI splitter too, won't I?
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planetearth
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/10 22:30:51
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Pommerntat
You know, I think we're getting close. The E-MU 404 you're using looks good, although I'm not sure I can shoehorn a PCIe card into my 3U can. As it is, I will have to dremel a card slot in the back, as the manufacturer forgot to. I mean, the screwhole is there, but no cardslot. Note: Don't EVER try to build a 3U rack mount can with an ATX board. Even if they say it will work with no problem. 4U, fine. 3U will make you grow old fast. I'll have to post some pictures.
But I digress. What do you think of PCI for audio and outboard USB for MIDI? I'll need a MIDI splitter too, won't I?
The audio and MIDI devices/interfaces will be one and the same unit. You'll probably be looking at an external, Firewire-based unit (as long as you have a FireWire port on your PC), if you want at least six inputs. These items aren't cheap, though; they start at $500. The E-MU 0404 I have won't cut it for you, since it only has 2 analogue inputs. From what you were saying, you want to bring in several discrete channels directly from the modules. If that's the case, the Delta 1010LT is your only option (from the items we've discussed), even though it's an internal unit. Keep in mind that the 1010LT has 8 unbalanced, RCA inputs and outputs (plus 2 XLR mic pres and MIDI In/Out). You'll need to convert those RCAs to 1/4" when bringing them into and out of your mixer, so you'll either need new cable or 16 adapters...and you'll lose a bit of signal with each conversion--at least, technically. (Whether or not you'll hear it is open for debate.) You will want a MIDI splitter, unless you want to daisy-chain your modules. MIDI Solutions makes a 1-in/4-out MIDI splitter for around $50, and a 1-in, 8-out splitter for around $150. The 1-in, 4-out would be sufficient, since you could daisy-chain 2 modules and save $100. (Of course, you could daisy-chain all your modules and not buy a splitter at all, but then you'd always have to have all your modules "on" for the MIDI signal to reach the last module.) The MIDI splitter will take the output from your 1010LT (for example), and split that into 4 or 8 MIDI Outs, which will then go to the modules. If you'd like, you can send me a PM with your budget (unless you want to post it here--nothing wrong with that), and I'll let you know which items to review for your purchase.
SONAR Platinum ▪ NI Komplete, Korg DLC, Arturia V5 Collection, Dimension Pro, IK Multimedia & other synths ▪ Les Paul, Peavey and Yamaha guitars. Listen to some of my stuff here: https://soundcloud.com/shadowsoflife . Comments from other SONAR users are always welcome!
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Pommerntat
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/11 16:35:10
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Thanks, Mr. Earth.  I'll do that. In the meantime, here's a pic of my old MIDI interface for your amusement. I was wrong about the module MIDI outs, due to my failing memory. Pretty advanced for its day, I guess - 128 discreet MIDI channels. Yes, it does say "printer port" on the back.
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planetearth
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/11 18:09:59
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Ah, yes...I remember when MIDI devices could be hooked up to printer ports through boxes like this! Heck, I even remember Key Electronics!
But if this box still works without the parallel port connection to the PC (and it should), then you don't need another MIDI splitter. This one is powered, has a MIDI In and 4 MIDI Outs, and should work fine for you. It won't accept MIDI data from the computer, but your new audio/MIDI device will provide that. This will just split that signal out to four of your modules.
You may have just saved yourself $50!
SONAR Platinum ▪ NI Komplete, Korg DLC, Arturia V5 Collection, Dimension Pro, IK Multimedia & other synths ▪ Les Paul, Peavey and Yamaha guitars. Listen to some of my stuff here: https://soundcloud.com/shadowsoflife . Comments from other SONAR users are always welcome!
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Pommerntat
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/13 23:40:01
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planetearth
Ah, yes...I remember when MIDI devices could be hooked up to printer ports through boxes like this! Heck, I even remember Key Electronics!
But if this box still works without the parallel port connection to the PC (and it should), then you don't need another MIDI splitter. This one is powered, has a MIDI In and 4 MIDI Outs, and should work fine for you. It won't accept MIDI data from the computer, but your new audio/MIDI device will provide that. This will just split that signal out to four of your modules.
You may have just saved yourself $50!
Huh! I was about ready to fling this thing!
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Karyn
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/10/20 10:25:30
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No, those inputs are not connected to the outputs.
Mekashi Futo. Get 10% off all Waves plugins.Current DAW. i7-950, Gigabyte EX58-UD5, 12Gb RAM, 1Tb SSD, 2x2Tb HDD, nVidia GTX 260, Antec 1000W psu, Win7 64bit, Studio 192, Digimax FS, KRK RP8G2, Sonar Platinum
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Crg
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Re:Basic, Basic, Boringly Basic Redundant Question
2010/11/11 09:54:28
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Just get an 8 in 8 out Midi Merger that connects to your PC via USB. You have so many modules that you are going to have a mess with what channel they all send on. Of course you want to control the modules with the controller and possibly control one module with another module with varieing combinations per project. It's hard to tell you which way to hook it up. But with an 8X8 you hook each midi out from each module and controller to the midi ins on the merger, plus all your listed ins/outs in Sonar will be greatly cleaned up. You're going to have to play with the routing of controller to synth module to merger to PC. I'm sure those are all great peices but you need to consider streamlining the whole headache. With Sonar PE 8.5 you have more than enough softsynths to replicate what you have in modules and newer Midi Controller-synth workstation would be a plus. The GM1 or GM2 language is going to be a factor also. It's going to take some hands on experimenting to see what works nice together. No quick answer.
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