Metallica - Enter Sandman cover

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hammeron56
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2011/02/06 10:05:23 (permalink)

Metallica - Enter Sandman cover

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/20455833/Enter% ... kbs%29.mp3

This is my 1st ever complete mix (instrumental only - I can't sing )

I've just started getting into recording my guitar playing and learning about mixing.
All comments welcomed.

DAW: Sonar X1
Drums: Steven Slate Drums Platinum 3.5 w/Black Kit
Guitars: ESP STD Explorer w/EMG 81/85, Schecter C-1 Custom FR w/Seymour Duncan TB-11
Bass: Yamaha RBX260
Amps: Mesa Single Rectifier w/Digitech GSP1101, Blackstar HT-5 w/POD HD500
Mics: Shure SM57
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    jshep0102
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/06 13:00:30 (permalink)
    Good tones.  Good start.  Bass guitar?

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    #2
    hammeron56
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/07 10:04:10 (permalink)
    Maybe I need to bring up the bass guitar just a little?  The bass comes through nicely on my monitors,  but they're only a few inches from the wall which may make them seem more bass-y.   I'll re-listen with some good headphones.

    #3
    patm300e
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/07 10:15:26 (permalink)
    Thr drums sit nicely.  Are these real? I can't tell (And I'm a drummer) so if these are the Session Drummer or other type of "fake" ones, you did good!  They don't sound steril and canned as many other recordings do (Including a LOT on the radio waves today).

    If they are not and someone played this, I would tell Lars to watch his back!

    The guitar playing is great!  Great tone too.  You need to find someone who can sing this.

    The guitar seemed a little low compared to the drums to me.  Also the bass could use bumping.

    Note I am listening on ear buds so it might be the reason the bass sits weak with me.





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    #4
    morenoise
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/07 11:31:50 (permalink)
    Hi Michael, nice cover but if there are no vocals why not play some extra lead guitar ?

    Greetings, Rik
    #5
    whack
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/07 13:19:12 (permalink)
    Ah memories,use to do a cover of this when in the band a few years back.

    This does sound good I would have to say, certainly If you are trying to replicate the sound of the original. So kudos for getting a good sounding mix.

    I agree with both comments above, the bass could come forward a little and the drums sound good, if they are fake, I want to know. The song defo needs a melody line, So what morenoise said above, if your lookin for some kind of vocal on it and stuck for someone, then I would be more than happy to send you over a take or two.
     
    Anyway,good work,wish my mixes sounded a bit more like this,think its time to upgrade to producer edition!
     
    Cian



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    #6
    acoustigod
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/07 16:28:00 (permalink)
    Congrats on your first complete mix.

    I haven't listened to Metallica in about a decade, so I don't even remember what the mix is supposed to sound like. Maybe that's a good thing. I will judge your version on its own merits.

    You have some weird issues going on that I don't think are caused by monitors. For example, you have really nice definition and bass in your toms. On the opposite end, the bass guitar, and to a lesser extent the kick, are inaudible. Well, the kick is audible, but it needs to be 2.5x that power.

    It sounds to me that your drums need some parallel compression. The toms are cutting through in the beginning, but perhaps even those could use it. The kick and snare definitely need it. Unlike what someone else said, they don't sit well as they are just not cutting through the mix.

    There's also a "larger than life" that is missing from the mix. Your guitars don't seem to have as much mids/power as the original song had. At times, they actually sound a little tinny. Try double tracking them? Re-track with more mids?

    It sounds pretty good though for a first attempt, and the guitar playing is right on.
    post edited by acoustigod - 2011/02/07 16:29:15

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    #7
    hammeron56
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/08 10:39:23 (permalink)
    @patm300e, @whack - they are fake drums - Steven Slate 3.5 Black kit that I MIDI programmed

    @acoustigod - I agree that the "larger than life" feeling is not there.  This mix already has both rhythm parts
    double-tracked.  I played/recorded each part twice, then panned the 1st part 100%left/40%left and the 2nd part 100%right/40% right.  I didn't scoop the mids on the amp tone, but it *is* a MESA so it's kinda scooped anyways.  I'll have to play around with my mic placement to see if it helps .  thanks for the advice


    #8
    acoustigod
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/08 10:45:46 (permalink)
    It could mic placement for sure. Use this as a way to judge your guitars. It's a slice of the guitar track from miss murder by AFI:

    http://dl.dropbox.com/u/443421/missmurder.mp3

    Need a song, demo or album mixed to sound great? Why waste weeks or months learning how to mix when I'm sure you'd rather spend your time writing songs and performing gigs? I can mix your tracks so that they sound fantastic. My rates are very affordable. Send me a PM to find out more.
    #9
    ruralrocker2010
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/08 10:56:23 (permalink)
    you need some more delay on the guitar...but sounds really nice!

    Joshua Barnes
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    #10
    ruralrocker2010
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/08 10:57:32 (permalink)
    I commented too early...man that's really nice! Brought a smile to my face!

    Joshua Barnes
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    #11
    acoustigod
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/08 11:00:58 (permalink)
    I'm listening to the actual mix. A few things:

    1. Apply a limiter to your guitar tracks. Get more volume of them, even if it's just a -3.0db threshold while keeping the ceiling at 0.

    2. Limit the whole track more if you're not already. Get to an average of -10db or -11db RMS.

    3. The intro guitar has more of a chorus/flange effect. It's stronger. The tone is more thick. This is tracking issue as well as a plugin issue. It's probably easier to use plugins to get the big effect sound rather than expecting your amp to create it. It'll also make the signal easier to work with honestly.

    4. Definitely use parallel compression if you're not already. If you are, try and make it bigger. The toms in the beginning of the actual mix are EPIC. I'd say parallel everything.

    5. Add reverb to your snare so that it echos like on the original mix.

    6. Those guitars on the original mix have a lot of reverb/delay on them, which is totally missing from yours.

    7. I think the original mix is washed with reverb on the whole track too, so you might want to apply reverb to your whole mix as well at the mastering stage.

    That should get you closer.

    Need a song, demo or album mixed to sound great? Why waste weeks or months learning how to mix when I'm sure you'd rather spend your time writing songs and performing gigs? I can mix your tracks so that they sound fantastic. My rates are very affordable. Send me a PM to find out more.
    #12
    mgh
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/08 18:57:10 (permalink)
    Acoustigid has some very valid points.
    firstly, this is very well played, but needs vocals. just go for it, this is James Hetfield, not Freddie Mercury.
    guitar sounds needs to be heavier, you need some verb on them, and a lot of compression. i'd bump the mids a touch too.
    bass needs to be much more, this is '...and justice' bass not 'black album'!

    whole mix is a little polite and needs to be maxxed a bit more to add some edge.

    but a great start dude, very clean and well-recorded mix!

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    #13
    ruralrocker2010
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/09 09:02:56 (permalink)
    What is parallel compression? And what does it do?

    Joshua Barnes
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    #14
    mgh
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/09 09:21:56 (permalink)
    basically means adding a very highly compressed clone to the original drum track (s), that way you keep the original feel, dynamics and details like reverb tails, but you add a lot more punch and transient attack from the compressed track...
    it's also known as New York technique. you can do a similar trick with eq to help a track stand out in the mix or add weight/punch...

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    #15
    hammeron56
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/09 09:36:12 (permalink)
    @acousticgod, @mgh, @ruralrocker2010,

    First off, Thanks guys - all of your info and support is really helpful!

    Since I double tracked each of the two rhythm parts, I have 4 rhythm guitar tracks.  In my mix, all 4 tracks output to a "rhythm" bus where I EQed a highpass @150Hz and a -3db @5000Hz(harshness).  If I start playing around with adding delay/reverb, do I want to do it to each individual track or just once to the rhythm bus?  Sorry if this is a noob question - I'm just starting out.  :)
    #16
    acoustigod
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/09 10:02:01 (permalink)
    I am not a fan of guitar bus's at all. The thing is, you want your guitars to sound different so that the blend of different sounds makes it thicker. If you bus it, you are actually making the sounds blend to sound more of the same, which will make it thinner.

    To know if HP @ 150hz is correct, I'd need to take a look at the tracks. Maybe 60hz is all you need. The bass guitar needs to be in the mix more anyway as it's missing.

    You need to use a limiter like I said in the post above to make the guitars thicker/louder without raising their actual db. Again, do it to each track individually.

    I am not a fan of bus's to group things in general. I use buses for effects, parallel compression, etc. Usually everything goes to the main mix bus.

    Need a song, demo or album mixed to sound great? Why waste weeks or months learning how to mix when I'm sure you'd rather spend your time writing songs and performing gigs? I can mix your tracks so that they sound fantastic. My rates are very affordable. Send me a PM to find out more.
    #17
    acoustigod
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/09 10:04:38 (permalink)
    ruralrocker2010


    What is parallel compression? And what does it do?

    It's when you play the original track along side a highly compressed track. The original track can also be compressed too, but usually the parallel compressed track (a bus) is very compressed. This is often used when you are trying to bring out punch, attack, volume, etc. in drums to get them to cut through in a mix. You can parallel compression to do a lot of other things though too. It's not just limited to drums.

    And of course, you can EQ the compressed bus before or after the compression to get the blended sound to be exactly what you want. In R&B vocals for example, you HP @ 400hz on the compressed bus to get the "s" sounds and the highs of a vocal to be really huge.

    Need a song, demo or album mixed to sound great? Why waste weeks or months learning how to mix when I'm sure you'd rather spend your time writing songs and performing gigs? I can mix your tracks so that they sound fantastic. My rates are very affordable. Send me a PM to find out more.
    #18
    Kroneborge
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/09 10:22:46 (permalink)
    Nicely played.

    I echo everyone who says more kick/bass.


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    #19
    vechung
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/09 10:24:28 (permalink)
    Great guitar playing!   You already got lots of feedback on your mix.

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    #20
    Wickens
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    Re:Metallica - Enter Sandman cover 2011/02/09 10:58:16 (permalink)
    Sounds tits so far dude! Needs a wee bit more oomph in the guitars but that sounds wicked!

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