A Pain Due To Split Nature of Smart Tool ( Addressed - I've Learned Something New)

This is getting very annoying...

As select used to both set now time and select clip, I was always able to double-click on a midi clip and open the PRV at the location of my click...

Now, because smart tool's select mode no longer includes now time, when I dbl-click on a midi clip it opens PRV to wherever the locator WAS!

What a pain this is... I know how to go about making it open where I want, but once again it means lots of additional clicks to accomplish...

Why is everyone so sure that this new system is so much better than before... I for one have found absolutely no new use in it and the smart tool does absolutely nothing that select didn't already do!

Add this to my list of very persistent PITA results of the "new way"...

I'm one angy user these days, aren't I?

Keni

Yeah I've found the same thing Keni but it's not that big a deal to me. Maybe I'm just normalizing the pain but a simple click in the time line gets me where I want to be. I'd prefer it the way you're describing it though.

Also the 'all MIDI notes selected' by default when you open the PRV used to make me nuts. Now I just instinctively click in any free space to deselect. Again I think I've normalized the pain, but the extra click is not that big a deal - to me.

Thanks Will...

I knew about the upper/lower issue (one of my pet peeves with the smart tool), but just discovered that it will open the PRV dbl-clicking on the upper portion... I don't know why I thought you had to use the lower portion for that... I guess just old habits...

When I just dbl-clicked on the upper portion it did open to the correct location... <whew>... Gotta remember that!

Larry? I couldn't agree with you more... I've screamed countless times due to the select all notes that currently opens the prv.... I'm really hoping they make THAT an option much as they did with the split tool's remainder selection (left/right/both)...  Does anyone really select all notes when they go to edit in PRV???

Very frustrating....

Thanks...
Keni

Keni, I am curious and looking for some objectivity. Is the problem that you have been a long time user, they have changed things, and you have to both un-learn and re-learn things OR is X1 truly a step backward for you?
 
Say... imagine you were a new user with no knowledge of earlier versions of Sonar, do you think you would like X1  better?
Are you saying you sometimes just automatically do things the way you aways did and now get a different result and then have to go through extra steps to et where you wanted to be... or is it truly harder to do?

I am not trying to be a smart arse at all.. it is an honest question. I am finally, seriously trying to learn to use Sonar. In a way I am thankful I waited until now. If I had put a ot of effort into learning 8.5 and had barely mastered it... then switched to X1, well I may have been upset...
 
edit> when I wrote this there were only three posts.. I guess it took me a bit to write it, some hs already been answered I see.

Julien

HumbleNoise

FastBikerBoy


Double click in the top half of the clip, moves the now time and opens the PRV at the 'new' now time. That's how it works here anyway.

Perhaps you don't have the 'left click sets now' option set?

Man sometimes I just thrash around with problems that do not exist. That's a really helpful tip. I shudder to think about how much more I'm missing.

Good to see you FBB!

No worries Larry. If it's any consolation I have several 'Doh' moments when I realise that I'm making something unnecessarily complicated.

I haven't gone missing I'm just staying out of some of the more controversial threads, as well as getting on making music - in X1 I hasten to add.

vintagevibe

jbow


Keni, I am curious and looking for some objectivity. Is the problem that you have been a long time user, they have changed things, and you have to both un-learn and re-learn things OR is X1 truly a step backward for you?

Say... imagine you were a new user with no knowledge of earlier versions of Sonar, do you think you would like X1  better?
Are you saying you sometimes just automatically do things the way you aways did and now get a different result and then have to go through extra steps to et where you wanted to be... or is it truly harder to do?

I am not trying to be a smart arse at all.. it is an honest question. I am finally, seriously trying to learn to use Sonar. In a way I am thankful I waited until now. If I had put a ot of effort into learning 8.5 and had barely mastered it... then switched to X1, well I may have been upset...

edit> when I wrote this there were only three posts.. I guess it took me a bit to write it, some hs already been answered I see.

Julien

It seems to me the Cakewalk have totally dissed its long time users.  Many things we have asked for have gone unchanged and now with X1 Cakewalk seems to be saying "we don't need you any more" to it's long time user base.  Why would anyone upgrade to have to relearn everything?  Long time users likely don't need any more channel strips etc...  This is the 1st time since Cakewalk for Win31 that I won't upgrade.  I suppose it's my fault for being naive enough to have Company loyalty.

That's all a matter of opinion of course. I've been using Sonar since V2 and I find X1 a big improvement on everything that's gone before. YMMV but of course if you don't try it and rely on others opinions you'll never know for sure.

jbow


Keni, I am curious and looking for some objectivity. Is the problem that you have been a long time user, they have changed things, and you have to both un-learn and re-learn things OR is X1 truly a step backward for you?
 
Say... imagine you were a new user with no knowledge of earlier versions of Sonar, do you think you would like X1  better?
Are you saying you sometimes just automatically do things the way you aways did and now get a different result and then have to go through extra steps to et where you wanted to be... or is it truly harder to do?

I am not trying to be a smart arse at all.. it is an honest question. I am finally, seriously trying to learn to use Sonar. In a way I am thankful I waited until now. If I had put a ot of effort into learning 8.5 and had barely mastered it... then switched to X1, well I may have been upset...
 
edit> when I wrote this there were only three posts.. I guess it took me a bit to write it, some hs already been answered I see.

Julien

Hi Julien...

OK... I'll do my best to answer this... Not to worry as I'm not feeling "attacked" and understand your questions (I believe)...

Let me try to answer it this way... If I was a new user and never knew anything different/better? I'd be thrilled with X1 as it does so much....

But as I've been able to do things at a faster pace with earlier versions this very software (yes, 8.5.3), I'm being made uncomfortable with the things that slow me down... (cause extra clicks and mouse moves and the likes)...

There are some issues that will simply take some getting used to... this current thread is one of those. But there are others such as the upper/lower clip portion in the TV where it is nothing but a detour I'm forced to take 100 times/day...

Re-learning where commands are is mostly all that is needed to make the changeover. For the most part, Sonar still does the same jobs the same ways, but the access to the tools (the gui) is what is different. For me, this was a waste, but I'm perfectly happy to live with it (maybe even find some uses for it eventually)... Commands have moved and thow many are touting how well organized it is I disagree... I know things were constantly added onto the earlier version so things got placed accordingly, but due to how many words use same/similar letters, how many keys are on our keyboard and such, this problem was and is still with us. so some are better some are worse... I didn't need the new multidock and such so this was not a necessary change for me.

I appreciate the new shortcuts in as much as there are more now than before... That's great!

I am somewhat fluent with X1 tho I still get some surprises (such as this thread)... So I'm getting used to the new layout, but it was an exercise that I was forced to do tho it was un-necessary for my needs. I had no problem with the ui itself in 8.5.3... so things such as the added shortcuts and Prochannel are my upgrades while the rest are mostly things I don't use...

I've been using benstat's Sonar Plus to hide the multidock and bring back the tool buttons I find helpful (that were lost in the x1 change) and Panup's Orfeus II Mod (skin) to adjust the look (and a bit more) where we have lost the ability in the current preferences... I float the Browser in a small window and leave it on the synth rack so that it is essentially the same to me as the synth rack was in 8.x as well... My red dot (for track record arm) has been changed back to a letter R and my Automation Read button has been changed back to the RD button as it was in the past as well... My snap tool in the new Control Bar now displays the wor To/By instead of the (for me) difficult to read graphic that comes with X1...

I've really only had a few major complaints once Ben and Panu stepped in to fix their' respective issues for us... Some of them still need proper addressing by Sonar...

These are/have been my major issues tho some are easier now with the above mentioned tools... they are:

1. Snap! I don't think this was even close to a good move and we need separate snap settings for each view... NOT only via Screenset changes...

2. The inability of the smart tool to both set now time and select a clip in a single click... Most annoying as it repeats itself all day long!

3.  The Edit Filter! I understand the issue(s) they were trying to address, but it NEEDS either an all-access option or bypass as it is not easy to work with for many of us where we had far less/fewer problems previously (8.5.3)... Even if they fix the issues regarding it's visibility (color choices when not selected), I must again be forced to additional clicks to allow for a tool I have no need of. Better they should have added controls to move top/bottom type to clear up access to buried (one on top of another) envelopes...

4. the Loss of buttons! they didn't have to be defaulted on, but they should still be available. Often a button is easier than the myriad of two-handed selections and key-clusters that now must be used (unless you wish to go menu diving everytime)...

5. tools from track controls and Inspector/CV are not all available on each view... so now we must go back and forth more to find/access some tools...

A bit long winded ... I'm sorry... But  for me, making things take extra clicks and such makes a job "harder"... Especially when it's repeated many times in a session...

I hope this cleared up some things for you...

Thanks...
Keni

Thanks guys. I think I understand.

Julien