Raba_licious
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Minor Chords do not = sad!
I dont know why in the western world minor chords are reffered to as "sad" sounding cause its doesnt always apply. This bugs me a bit because I use minor progression for a lot of my music and they are not sad songs at all. Maybe serious or epic but not sad. Infact most hip hop and electronic music are in a minor key and a lot of it is positive. So why do we have this major=happy and minor=sad idea when it doesnt always apply??
post edited by Raba_licious - 2011/04/24 03:14:35
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craigb
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Re:Minor Chords do not = sad!
2011/04/24 00:39:05
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Oh great. Now you'll have to explain to Bapu what a Major chord is!
Time for all of you to head over to Beyond My DAW!
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spacey
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Re:Minor Chords do not = sad!
2011/04/24 00:48:57
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Raba_licious
I dont know why in the western world minor chords are reffered to as "sad" sounding cause I dont think so at all. This bugs me a bit because I use minor progression for a lot of my music and they are not sad songs at all. Maybe serious but not sad. Infact most hip hop and electronic music are in a minor key and a lot of it is positive. So why do we have this major=happy and minor=sad idea when it doesnt always apply??
You may have answered your own question by stating "when it doesn't always apply". Surely you realize that your statement admits that it does apply, just that sometimes it doesn't. I'm not sure why your opinion about how the "western world" feels that minor is sad and then support that the western world doesn't by listing two western world genre's......very confusing. One relates musical sound to emotion and if we start at the two basic chords or triads of major and minor I believe if one played a major followed by a minor most listeners would agree the major sounds happy or bright and the minor sounds dark or sad. A simple example of the sounds outside of a composition.
Here is something that may be of much more help than what I can provide.
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Beagle
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Re:Minor Chords do not = sad!
2011/04/24 08:10:09
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spacey
Raba_licious
I dont know why in the western world minor chords are reffered to as "sad" sounding cause I dont think so at all. This bugs me a bit because I use minor progression for a lot of my music and they are not sad songs at all. Maybe serious but not sad. Infact most hip hop and electronic music are in a minor key and a lot of it is positive. So why do we have this major=happy and minor=sad idea when it doesnt always apply??
You may have answered your own question by stating "when it doesn't always apply". Surely you realize that your
statement admits that it does apply, just that sometimes it doesn't.
I'm not sure why your opinion about how the "western world" feels that minor is sad and then support that the western world
doesn't by listing two western world genre's......very confusing.
One relates musical sound to emotion and if we start at the two basic chords or triads of major and minor I believe
if one played a major followed by a minor most listeners would agree the major sounds happy or bright and the minor sounds
dark or sad. A simple example of the sounds outside of a composition.
Here is something that may be of much more help than what I can provide.
that's a very cool link, Michael. very interesting paper. i haven't finished it yet, but will continue reading this afternoon.
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Janet
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Re:Minor Chords do not = sad!
2011/04/24 10:20:56
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Interesting article, Michael. I'm not sure they did enough research of languages world-wide, since all of them don't use rising tone to mean a question. But nonetheless, it's interesting.
But Raba...to get back to your original question...I agree with you that a composition using minor chords does not necessarily sound sad. But like Michael said, most western people, if you played just a major and minor chord, would agree one is 'happy' and one is 'sad.' I use that with my young piano students to introduce them to major and minor chords and it works every time.
I once listened to a song on the forum and someone made the comment that it was quite a clever composition because it didn't use minor chords. I had never even considered that thought...that maybe a 'better' composer wouldn't depend on minor chords to get that tension. I certainly love and use them a lot. (perhaps that's not exactly what they were saying...it's been awhile and I've forgotten the details (Beagle probably knows...)) but it has sparked my thinking anyway.
But I also know that if I want to compose a 'dark' song...not sad necessarily, but definitely not 'fun and happy,' it will be in a minor key. In fact, if I had time, I'm so 'into' that type of piece now, I'd compose several of them.
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Crg
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Re:Minor Chords do not = sad!
2011/04/24 11:00:03
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Like the much belittled Em chord, You might add diminished and suspended chords to the sad list also. Would you have to say that perfects are emotionless?
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bapu
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Re:Minor Chords do not = sad!
2011/04/24 13:59:19
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craigb
Oh great. Now you'll have to explain to Bapu what a Major chord is!
Are those the one's made by Monster?
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SteveStrummerUK
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Re:Minor Chords do not = sad!
2011/04/24 14:02:48
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bapu
craigb
Oh great. Now you'll have to explain to Bapu what a Major chord is!
Are those the one's made by Monster?
Umbilical?
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Beagle
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Re:Minor Chords do not = sad!
2011/04/24 14:06:36
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bapu
craigb
Oh great. Now you'll have to explain to Bapu what a Major chord is!
Are those the one's made by Monster?
you are hereby served with an injunction to cease and desist the use of "that word." "The word" is so sacred that we, lawyers for "the company" can't even say "it" in our rebuke letters. Either pay us tribute each use of "the word" or cease to use it. it's up to you. but you already owe us $10,000USD. and do not send that money to The Bouy Limited for "currency exchange" - it comes directly to "the company."
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Ham N Egz
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Re:Minor Chords do not = sad!
2011/04/24 16:24:58
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Beagle
bapu
craigb
Oh great. Now you'll have to explain to Bapu what a Major chord is!
Are those the one's made by Monster?
you are hereby served with an injunction to cease and desist the use of "that word." "The word" is so sacred that we, lawyers for "the company" can't even say "it" in our rebuke letters.
Either pay us tribute each use of "the word" or cease to use it. it's up to you. but you already owe us $10,000USD. and do not send that money to The Bouy Limited for "currency exchange" - it comes directly to "the company."
Been reading some old threads on the GearSlutz forum, Beagle????
Green Acres is the place to be I dont twitter, facebook, snapchat, instagram,linkedin,tumble,pinterest,flick, blah blah,lets have an old fashioned conversation!
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Beagle
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Re:Minor Chords do not = sad!
2011/04/24 16:37:15
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cakewalk forum user "yep" use to be on a big "anti-Monster" here on the forums when he was around. I don't spend much time on the slutz forum. i pop in occassionally to have a laugh.
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Jonbouy
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Re:Minor Chords do not = sad!
2011/04/24 19:55:55
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Some great food for thought there from the OP and Michael. Basically then much of how we percieve sounds/tone is down to expectation laid down by familiarity over centuries. This is why I've always believed that hit songs are found by a process of remembering what strikes a chord (pun intended) with the many, rather than being created afresh from the ether. Where the 'western' tag comes in to my mind is that the twelve tone system has caught on in spite of it's known mathematical limitations and any attempts to break out of it now will sound pretty strange as we've gotten so used to how things have been 'tuned' over the centuries. Much of the reason why some oriental and ancient music sounds inaccessable to many of our 'western' ears. That it is a different animal to the Major/Minor debate is only true if you discount the importance of how sound is percieved en masse. For example does the 7th harmonic only sound horribly dissonant because it has been largely 'censored' out of all the music we've heard in the last few centuries, even to the point where the hammer in a piano is designed to strike is to eliminate as much of that harmonic as possible? This is the stuff that keeps me awake at night.
post edited by Jonbouy - 2011/04/24 20:08:04
"We can't do anything to change the world until capitalism crumbles. In the meantime we should all go shopping to console ourselves" - Banksy
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Guitarhacker
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Re:Minor Chords do not = sad!
2011/04/24 22:20:03
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Baaaah.... I'll stick with Am..... and the occasional Em.
My website & music: www.herbhartley.com MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW Focusrite Firewire Saffire Interface BMI/NSAI "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer "
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Bub 
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Re:Minor Chords do not = sad!
2011/04/25 00:07:56
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Beagle
cakewalk forum user "yep" use to be on a big "anti-Monster" here on the forums when he was around. I don't spend much time on the slutz forum. i pop in occassionally to have a laugh.
I did a search for 'cakewalk forum down' (or something similar) when the server went down the other day. Just to see if I could find any info. I came across this thread from gearslutz about the Coffee House. Apparently it wasn't a very nice place a few years ago and was shut down? I've been hanging out upstairs for years, but I never even came down here until recently. Is it true that the CH was closed because of an out of control religious based fight? That's what I read ...
"I pulled the head off Elvis, filled Fred up to his pelvis, yaba daba do, the King is gone, and so are you."
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Guitarhacker
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Re:Minor Chords do not = sad!
2011/04/25 08:22:43
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That was before my time in the forum but that is the truth.... well the part about the CH being shut down in it's last life here for the threads devolving into name calling and worse.
This time round, it actually seems to be the bright spot in the forums at times. All the name calling goes on up stairs now..... (for the most part)...and we have actually had some very civil and intelligent (well as best we can given the participants) discussions on some banned topics when Willie was on vacation. Of course, he shut it down and locked it when he returned. The thread, IIRC had reached 4 pages and was objective and both sides of the argument were well thought out..... but it was clearly a TOS violation and was locked eventually.
My website & music: www.herbhartley.com MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW Focusrite Firewire Saffire Interface BMI/NSAI "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer "
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spacey
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Re:Minor Chords do not = sad!
2011/04/25 08:58:42
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Not so much for OP as there seems to be a lack of interest but for those
that may not have drifted off ....so, for the sake of what seems to be a popular relationship of sound (chord types) and some emotions...and much like everything else I've learned about music....
it's not written in stone.
And I wouldn't think this is the end-of-line for the emotional ride of sound...
just think when these types are formed into progressions...talk about a complicated
discussion....but interesting. Progressions of same chord types. Moving forward, Moving back.
Within the established tonality...outside and the confusion which quickly loses a listeners interest..
Same chord type example; Hey Joe is good one...C,G,D,A,E.....now do it backwards.
What I'm getting at I guess is that how the listener excepts what one does and are there
certain things that loses the interest (yes) and what are they?
What the mind excepts as "alright" and keeps interest in the sounds...
example...playing different types of the same chord in a progression can work with great results.
A little to heavy for a Monday I'm thinking.
Major -Happiness, cheerfulness, confidence, brightness, satisfaction
Minor -Sadness, darkness, sullenness, apprehension, melancholy, depression, mystery
Seventh -Funkiness, soulfulness, moderate edginess
Major Seventh -Romance, softness, jazziness, serenity, tranquillity, exhilaration
Minor Seventh -Mellowness, moodiness, jazziness
Ninth -Openness, optimism
Diminished -Fear, shock, spookiness, suspense
Suspended Fourth-Delightful tension
Seventh, Minor Ninth-Creepiness, ominousness, fear, darkness
Added Ninth -Steeliness, austerity
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Crg
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Re:Minor Chords do not = sad!
2011/04/25 09:33:11
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A little to heavy for a Monday I'm thinking. Major -Happiness, cheerfulness, confidence, brightness, satisfaction Minor -Sadness, darkness, sullenness, apprehension, melancholy, depression, mystery Seventh -Funkiness, soulfulness, moderate edginess Major Seventh -Romance, softness, jazziness, serenity, tranquillity, exhilaration Minor Seventh -Mellowness, moodiness, jazziness Ninth -Openness, optimism Diminished -Fear, shock, spookiness, suspense Suspended Fourth-Delightful tension Seventh, Minor Ninth-Creepiness, ominousness, fear, darkness Added Ninth -Steeliness, austerity I can live with that. 
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