Editing NRPN Data

Author
Post
Essentials Only Full Version
UCG Musician
Max Output Level: -89 dBFS
  • Total Posts : 80
  • Joined: 2005/03/01 23:25:15
  • Location: Milwaukee, WI
  • Status: offline
2011/05/30 13:14:39 (permalink)

Editing NRPN Data

Help!  I'm working with an instrument that requires a vast number of NRPNs to effecetively contol its operation.  I hope this is not too basic a question but how can I edit what an NRPN "represents"?  I recorded MIDI date from the instrument (it's an Allen church organ) and a number of messages came across as NRPNs.  Isn't there a way to identify, for example, that an NRPN with a data number of 196 and a value of 16256 stands for "Turn G1 piston on" and an NRPN with a data number of 197 and a value of 16256 stands for "Turn G1 piston off"?  I will be working with NRPN numbers for almost every setting on this instrument and I can't find where the information is edited.  I think there's a way in the instrument definition but I haven't discovered it yet.
#1

5 Replies Related Threads
    joetabby
    Max Output Level: -77 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 651
    • Joined: 2003/11/08 12:54:44
    • Status: offline
    Re:Editing NRPN Data 2011/05/30 14:51:53 (permalink)
    IIRC, NRPN are made up by each manufacturer, in any way they choose as long as it makes sense for the particular instrument, hence the N in NRPN. So I'd think you'd really need Allen's midi doc right from the start.
    #2
    johnnyV
    Max Output Level: -48.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 2677
    • Joined: 2010/02/22 11:46:33
    • Location: Here, in my chair
    • Status: offline
    Re:Editing NRPN Data 2011/05/30 22:52:08 (permalink)
    Would this capture those controls and play them back?

    http://www.allenorgan.com...idi/midiassistant.html

    Sonar X3e Studio - Waiting for Professional
     Scarlett 6i6
    Yamaha Gear= 01v - NSM 10 - DTX 400 - MG82cx
    Roland Gear= A 49- GR 50 - TR 505 - Boss pedals
    Tascam Gear=  DR 40 - US1641 -
    Mackie Gear= Mix 8 - SRM 350's 
    i5 Z97 3.2GHZ quad 16 Gig RAM W 8.1  home build
    Taylor mini GS - G& L Tribute Tele - 72 Fender Princeton - TC BH 250 - Mooer and Outlaw Pedals  Korg 05/RW
     
    #3
    WDI
    Max Output Level: -54.5 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 2069
    • Joined: 2007/08/28 02:31:11
    • Status: offline
    Re:Editing NRPN Data 2011/05/31 02:19:12 (permalink)
    If you are asking what a NRPN represents, that is manufacture specific as Joe mentioned. If you are asking how to edit the NRPN data in Sonar there are several ways. The help file in Sonar goes into depth. Just type NRPN in the index.

    Sonar 7 PE
    Windows XP Pofessional (SP3)
    MSI K8N Neo4-F
    AMD Athlon 64 3500+
    2 GB PC 3200 Ram
    RME Fireface 800
    Edirol FA-66
    CM Labs MotorMix

    Old stuff: ARJO
    #4
    UCG Musician
    Max Output Level: -89 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 80
    • Joined: 2005/03/01 23:25:15
    • Location: Milwaukee, WI
    • Status: offline
    Re:Editing NRPN Data 2011/06/01 10:38:13 (permalink)
    The instrument is at least 20 years old and no MIDI implementation guide was ever published.  Allen provides no information on how individual stops are selected or what their NRPN scheme is.  Everything I can determine on this is from people who have encounted similar issues.
     
    My question is how to name NRPNs if it can be done.  I have discovered that a stop is turned on by sending 4 NRPN messages: CC 98 with a value 16256, CC 99 with a value 16256, CC 6 with a value of the MSB part of the stop number and CC 38 with a value of the LSB part of the stop number.  To turn off the same stop, the CC 98 and 99 values are set to 0.  Since stops are regularly -- even frequently -- turned on and off, it would be extremely cumbersome to have no visible evidence in SONAR indicating what NRPN messages means.  Just as a person can see a simple patch change in an event list (which shows what patch is contained in the instrument definition) I want to be able to see that I'm turning a particular stop on or off by its name.
     
    Hopefully, now that I've clarified what I'm after (and why), someone who knows this aspect of MIDI and how it's handled in SONAR can help explain what to do.  I discussed it at length with SONAR tech support and was given additional information on how to create instrument definitions (outside of SONAR if necessary) but the complexity is still daunting.
    #5
    lfm
    Max Output Level: -53 dBFS
    • Total Posts : 2216
    • Joined: 2005/01/24 05:35:33
    • Location: Sweden
    • Status: offline
    Re:Editing NRPN Data 2011/06/02 05:05:44 (permalink)
    As already said many times above - the source for your information is manufacturer:
    http://www.allenorgan.com/

    or the owners club there.

    There is no standard for what NRPN is.

    If you want to teach Sonar to recoqnize these in a certain way and give them names, I'm not sure if you can do that. That would have to be individual for each track then, and knowing what instrument is loaded.

    But you could very well make and CAL script that recoqnizes these codes that you know. It would be cool if CAL could preset itself graphically in gui, but I don't  think that is possible. But present what codes(and names you give them) and what time location could be presented as a list for you.

    The script could help you position on the next of those codes egc, select them or whatever.

    I'm puzzled that Cake is not extending the use of CAL, instead of hiding it away almost. It's an option that not many programs have, apart from Sonar.
    #6
    Jump to:
    © 2024 APG vNext Commercial Version 5.1