popping and cracking

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sirenadelmar
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2011/06/19 14:18:44 (permalink)

popping and cracking

Hello guys!  (Well, most of the people who reply to this forum are men, but if there are any gals, hello to you too!)  Happy Father's day, to all of you who are fathers!
 
I haven't been around much lately because the problems i had was that my microphone died.  i've been singing in the subway stations of the Big Apple a lot to put together the money for the new mike: encore Blue, pretty good sound. 
 
as you know i work some accompaniments on MIDI by inserting the notes on the Staff View on MC3.  i made this very nice accompaniment with vibraphone sound, but it keeps making pops.  the worse part is that when i bounce the track to a new audio track it takes the pops with it, unlike what guitarhacker says (is it you who said that?), that the new AUDIO track will have no pops.  in another accompaniment i bounced the tracks and i had pure sound, but not with this song. 
 
i have read some of the threads about popping sounds, i also read about popping sounds in MC help.  i have checked and tested some of the changes that are suggested, but the pops keep coming. 
 
any suggestions?  this is a waltz like accompaniment and i don't want to have to re-enter it again from scratch.  (i even copied it and inserted it in a new project page, but the pops came along as well!!)
 
sirena del mar
post edited by sirenadelmar - 2011/06/19 14:20:48


Dell Latitude E6410, 32 bit. Windows 7. Music Creator 5.  My sound card is Focusrite Scarlett 2i2.
La musica es el alma de los pueblos.  (Music is the soul of each nations.) 

#1

16 Replies Related Threads

    57Gregy
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    Re:popping and cracking 2011/06/19 14:55:45 (permalink)
    Hi, Sirena.
    Are you using a software synthesizer for the vibes? If so, which one?
    When mixing/mastering tracks or songs, it's sometimes a good idea to increase the latency so any problems with playback are lessened, such as pops and clicks, since the processor doesn't have to work so hard to play all the audio and synth tracks.
    If using MME or WDM drivers, just increase the latency from the Options menu. If using ASIO drivers, open Options and click the ASIO Panel box to change the latency.
    You may have to close and re-open MC for the changes to take effect.

    Greg 
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    Kalle Rantaaho
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    Re:popping and cracking 2011/06/19 15:05:44 (permalink)
    Why do you call the Lexicon Alpha a "pre amp". It's a proper soundcard which you should use instead of the miserable Conexant, which is the most likely cause of the pops. Disable the Conexant and take care of that you use the latest ASIO drivers for you Lexicon.

    I wonder what the "changes suggested" were..

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    sirenadelmar
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    Re:popping and cracking 2011/06/19 18:19:04 (permalink)
     
    i'm using the vibes that are within MC3.  i don't know how to use plug-ins yet.  (i've read some of the threads about this, but i have no clue of how to start.)  to be more specific when i open the MIDI track, i select the channel, the bank and the patch: vibraphone.  then i click ALT+7 and i insert the notes i want on the  STAFF VIEW.  in this specific song that's the only track so far, i have to add an AUDIO track for my voice.  (on another song i have three different MIDI tracks and then i added voice and it came out exactly like i wanted, not one single pop or crackle.)
     
    i use the WDM driver, my computer went a little crazy when i tried ASIO, so i extracted it.  among the suggestions i read it included changing the latecy on the first window of AUDIO, which i did.  but it made it worse.  i also tweeked the I/O buffer size up and down (an MC suggestion) but it also made it worse.  i also changed the playback queue but nothing changed. 
     
    the thing is that i managed to make two songs the same way with no particular negative effect.  i already sang my track and it came out beautiful.  the new mike brings the special qualities that my voice has naturally.  it seems that i'm going to have to enter those songs again.    aaaaahhhhhgggg! (high C).
     
    Kalle:  i call the Lexicon Alpha a pre-amp because that's how i've seen it called before by others that i believe are more knowlegeable than i in this techie stuff.   if you want to call it a sound card that's good to me too, i don't care of its name but that it does what its supposed to do.  the Conexant card is in my computer but when i connect the Alpha through the USB port it renders it useless, ( i always check the control panel>sound and audio devices window and it always changes)  although i have the problem that sometimes the DRIVER PROFILE window will not stay on the Alpha.  when that happens usually i don't get any sound.  when i change it manually the sound comes back. 
     
    sirena del mar
    post edited by sirenadelmar - 2011/06/19 18:25:25


    Dell Latitude E6410, 32 bit. Windows 7. Music Creator 5.  My sound card is Focusrite Scarlett 2i2.
    La musica es el alma de los pueblos.  (Music is the soul of each nations.) 

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    Kalle Rantaaho
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    Re:popping and cracking 2011/06/20 04:47:24 (permalink)
    I've tried a web search and I've not found a Lexicon Alpha pre amp. It's a soundcard, and surely much better than the Conexant.

    The Conexant can not understand ASIO, that's why your computer went crazy. The Conexant might understand ASIO4ALL (free DL), but that's not ASIO.

    My advice is still the same: DL ASIO drivers for the Alpha and don't use the Conexant, which is simply not capable of fluent DAW-work, and is most likely the reason of your sound problems. You can not find one person here on the forum, who wouldn't recommend a dedicated audio interface, like Lexicon Alpha, over a 20 cent sound chip. IF there are some particular known problems with Lexicons ASIO drivers, that's another thing.

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    Guitarhacker
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    Re:popping and cracking 2011/06/20 09:10:32 (permalink)
    I probably did say that, and generally, it is true.

    The pops and clicks in the music are usually caused by the processor not being able to process the music in real time to play it back flawlessly. As a result it drops the sections it has to, to keep up. You hear the dropped section as a pop. BUT, when it gets rendered to WAVE or bounced, the processor can take it's time and it should render the parts perfectly.

    If not, perhaps the pops are on the track? Listen to the track soloed, and see if the pop occurs in the exact same place every time. If it does, it is in the track and will always be transferred when the bounce is done or the tracks are exported as a song.

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    sirenadelmar
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    Re:popping and cracking 2011/06/20 20:48:18 (permalink)
    i am always grateful for all the replies and comments that i get in this forum.  in the last year i have had to throw my learning curve really high in order to learn all the technical stuff that has allowed me to complete one project that i'm not ready to publish and the current project.  i'm proud of myself, but i remembered this morning after giving myself a few hours of rest, that at the end of the day is not about the technical stuff that i've learned, it's about the project.  the technical stuff: software, computer, Lexicon Alpha, etc. are the tools to make the music: for me it's about the music. 

    i think that what happened to the MIDI files that keep popping and crackling is that i made them late at night after having the old computer on for many hours.  i'm a compulsive person and once i get an idea going is hard for me to let it rest for another day.  so i kept going when the computer couldn't. 

    instead of re-entering the music in the same computer, even though i'm almost sure that when is cool it wouldn't do it, i entered it in an old Dell Inspiron 1100 where i have MC2.  i bounced the tracks and music, sweet music.  it took all this afternoon but its worth it.  i uploaded the audio track to the memory stick and downloaded it into the HP.  on Wednesday i'll sing the voice track.   
     
    even though Murphy's law keeps interfering with my project i keep working at it and everyday i'm closer to the end.
     
    sirena del mar
    post edited by sirenadelmar - 2011/06/20 20:58:29


    Dell Latitude E6410, 32 bit. Windows 7. Music Creator 5.  My sound card is Focusrite Scarlett 2i2.
    La musica es el alma de los pueblos.  (Music is the soul of each nations.) 

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    Kalle Rantaaho
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    Re:popping and cracking 2011/06/21 07:40:20 (permalink)
    If what you made late at night were just MIDI-tracks (you did not bounce them to audio) I don't think they can have pops or crackles, so the heating up of the PC could not be the cause. MIDI just basicly tells when to start, which note, when to stop. This info, AFAIK, can not have crackles or any other anomalies. You can hear such during the playback, caused by drivers or whatever, but there are no pops saved in the MIDI data.  It's either transmitted or not. The crackles come when you bounce.

    Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

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    Guitarhacker
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    Re:popping and cracking 2011/06/21 13:03:50 (permalink)
    Kalle Rantaaho


    If what you made late at night were just MIDI-tracks (you did not bounce them to audio) I don't think they can have pops or crackles, so the heating up of the PC could not be the cause. MIDI just basicly tells when to start, which note, when to stop. This info, AFAIK, can not have crackles or any other anomalies. You can hear such during the playback, caused by drivers or whatever, but there are no pops saved in the MIDI data.  It's either transmitted or not. The crackles come when you bounce.

    Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.


    That is correct... the noise and other stuff gets introduced when it is converted to audio. Pops and clicks are indicators that the settings are not right for the smooth flow of data from the midi/synth to the audio engine, or the audio processor is not fast enough to keep up and drops audio from time to time resulting in the clicks and pops you hear.

    Updated drivers on a proper interface should solve that problem. If the interface is a good one that others here can use with no major issues, then it falls back to the driver updates and the buffers & latency settings in your system.



    My website & music: www.herbhartley.com

    MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW   
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    "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer 
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    sirenadelmar
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    Re:popping and cracking 2011/07/01 00:33:26 (permalink)
    Guess what?  the popping and crackling sounds have returned and getting worse.  the thing of it is that when i'm using the Conexant sound card, the one built in the computer, i don't hear the pops and cracks.  is when i attach the Lexicon Alpha that it pops.  but i cannot sing into the computer unless i attach the LA.  could there be something wrong with the LA?  how do i know that the LA is working properly?  the wave profile seems to be saying its working well, but what do i know?   only bought it in Nov!  how long does a sound card lives?  i have all the music ready and i cannot finish my proyect and i'm so frustrated!

    Heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeelp!  (in high C, actually i can reach high Bb!)

    sirena del mar
    post edited by sirenadelmar - 2011/07/01 00:44:16


    Dell Latitude E6410, 32 bit. Windows 7. Music Creator 5.  My sound card is Focusrite Scarlett 2i2.
    La musica es el alma de los pueblos.  (Music is the soul of each nations.) 

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    Kalle Rantaaho
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    Re:popping and cracking 2011/07/01 04:29:13 (permalink)
    You never told us you got the pops to go away, and what you did to cure the problem, so we have to start from an empty table from that onwards.

    So...do you have the latest ASIO drivers for the LA? Have you made sure that Conexant is not selected for MC to use in any checkbox? Recording and playback timing master is the LA?
    Please try to give a clear picture of what you're doing. You write much but don't list the details. Which options, drivers, settings, soft synths etc are used.


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    Guitarhacker
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    Re:popping and cracking 2011/07/01 09:14:16 (permalink)
    I would try a new interface. Something like one of the M-Audio models or the Focusrite interfaces. Buy it at a reputable store and you have a 30 to 45 day return policy.

    Somewhere in the back recesses of my memory, I seem to recall that the Lexicon series are just a tad bit better than the factory cards but still not really up to specs needed for professional recording.

    Just my thoughts.... I would explore a new card/interface that uses USB to try to resolve it.

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    57Gregy
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    Re:popping and cracking 2011/07/01 11:59:46 (permalink)
    Have you tried increasing the latency while mixing down? If you set the latency to something like 40 ms and you still have noise, it's probably not the Alpha but something else making the noise.

    Greg 
    I am selling my MIM Fender Stratocaster HSS, red and black. PM for more details.

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    Re:popping and cracking 2011/07/01 14:47:30 (permalink)
    yup... just checked the lexicon series includes the Lambda....which, as I recall, is a real pain for the people who use it.

    I'd consider a switch to something else. Just my 2 centavos!

    My website & music: www.herbhartley.com

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    sirenadelmar
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    Re:popping and cracking 2011/07/01 15:50:22 (permalink)
    i hear the switching to something else deal, but money is tight and the Lexicon Alpha is what i got. 
     
     now, Kalle (i hope this is the correct way of addressing you, since you seem to have a name of a culture i'm not familiar with) wrote: "So...do you have the latest ASIO drivers for the LA? Have you made sure that Conexant is not selected for MC to use in any checkbox? Recording and playback timing master is the LA?
    Please try to give a clear picture of what you're doing. You write much but don't list the details. Which options, drivers, settings, soft synths etc are used."

    no, i don't have the ASIO driver installed at all.  the last time i tried to install it it became a problem and i un-istalled it.  since i'm desperate, i would consider trying it again, but i would appreciate detailed instructions on how to install it.  i know how to get to and navigate the LA web-site.  is the actual process of downloading and installing ASIO that is a challenge.  i have no problems installing programs from a CD, but from the Internet is a hassle, because i never know what to answer to the questions that pop-up during the installation process. run? save? folder? etc. 

    i want to add that i check and re-check everytime that all the LA options are selected in the computer as well as in MC.  i mentioned before, that sometimes the Driver Profile window reverts to Conexant, but i learned when does it happen and is easily corrected.  nothing else has changed, that's why i'm not writing any details.

    over and out,
    sirena del mar
    post edited by sirenadelmar - 2011/07/01 15:54:34


    Dell Latitude E6410, 32 bit. Windows 7. Music Creator 5.  My sound card is Focusrite Scarlett 2i2.
    La musica es el alma de los pueblos.  (Music is the soul of each nations.) 

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    Guitarhacker
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    Re:popping and cracking 2011/07/02 10:21:51 (permalink)
    I'm not an expert by any means on drivers, but I think when you DL it, it should install automatically where it needs to.  Then with a restart of the computer, it should be recognized by the LA... you select the ASIO driver and adjust the settings as needed to get it to run smoothly.

    Just a note.... It took me the better part of 2 weeks to finally get MY system figured out the first time I set it up. One week to get sound of any sort and then a few more days to iron out the kinks in the way it worked.

    Once you get it there, it should run the same way every time.

    My website & music: www.herbhartley.com

    MC4/5/6/X1e.c, on a Custom DAW   
    Focusrite Firewire Saffire Interface


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    "Just as the blade chooses the warrior, so too, the song chooses the writer 
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    Kalle Rantaaho
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    Re:popping and cracking 2011/07/02 16:04:57 (permalink)
    The way I read it, the last time you tried to use ASIO it was with the Conexant, but, as I remarked, the integrated chips do not understand ASIO. That was the time you insisted your Lexicon is a pre-amp.

    I have read about cases when some settings seem to drop off or change really by themselves during re-boot or such. If something mysterious like that is taking place in your computer, I'm unable to give constructive hints.

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