Tangentially OT: D-50

I just started using a old but pristine Roland D-50 as my main MIDI kybd in the studio, and ran across a couple of problems I cannot recall if I ever solved. Or maybe they're the reason the board has sat in the closet for so many years.

Anyway, if I got this right:

#1 I dimly recall that the D-50 sends note off messages whenever you release a key. This messes with overdubbing. Is there a way to disable this "feature"?

#2 The board doesn't respond to a simple sustain pedal. I think it needs to see a MIDI sustain  message to send the controller to any other synth.

If anyone knows how to overcome either of these odd functions in the D-50, please let me know.

Thanks in advance.

The All Notes Off and no sustain problem are related. Like your D-50, my old Roland RD-300s sends All Notes Off (CC123) when the last key is released. This does cause problems with overdubs, because the CC123 from the keyboard will stop notes being played back from a previously recorded MIDI clip. Also, some soft synths do not respond properly to CC123, and will let it override the sustain pedal.

There is no way to turn it off at the keyboard, so you have to block it somehow. Here's link to a post I made about how to set up Cakewalk's MIDI Event Filter to block only CC123:

http://forum.cakewalk.com/fb.ashx?m=2089027

Widetrack


brundelfly:

so if I block cc 123, will a sustain pedal work?

I have to admit, not having one is challenging-- and improving-- my lackluster keyboard chops, but it's still a pain in the nether regions.

I re-read your OP, and am not sure exactly what the setup is, but here's the deal:


The D-50 should respond to a sustain pedal plugged directly into it, as well as to CC64 sustain messages played or echoed back from SONAR, so long as the particular patch supports it. And it should send corresponding CC64 message to its MIDI out. 

If you have Local OFF on the D-50, and play it by echoing MIDI back to it via a track in SONAR, the CC123 shouldn't cause a problem with sustain, because the D-50 handles them correctly (i.e. ignores them when sustain is on).

The only time you should need to block CC123 is when you are playing a soft synth that doesn't handle CC123 correctly (e.g. Dim Pro and most NI synths), or when you are overdubbing to a track (either soft synth, or MIDI back to the D-50) with an existing MIDI clip that is playing back, so that held notes from the clip won't have their durations cut short by All Notes Off from the keyboard.

EDIT: All this assumes that the D-50's MIDI implementation is essentially the same as my RD-300s from the same era.

There are midi fx that solve this issue:
http://www.tencrazy.com/gadgets/mfx/

I don't know if he made x64 version yet though.

Otherwise the workaround I did was to glue the top key down - with adhesive tape.

That means you do not have to do anything else(but as said make CC64 output by pedal).

And sounds from D50 can not be used - but as pure midi keyboard it will work.

And we're talking about plain, mechanical sustain pedals that do nothing but open and close a connection, yes? Not some weird MIDI implementation of a pedal?

brundlefly

There are midi fx that solve this issue: http://www.tencrazy.com/gadgets/mfx/ I don't know if he made x64 version yet though.

No, unfortunately there are no x64-compatible versions of those MFX. I e-mailed the author about it once. IIRC, he said he had no plans for it, but did not rule out getting to it eventually.


Would be nice to have an alternative, because the Cakewalk MFX can be a little glitchy when the MIDI stream gets dense.


Ultimately, the best solution is probably to get a keyboard that doesn't send CC123 - most don't. My QS8 doesn't, but I still prefer the feel of the RD after all these years. Roland built some stout kit back then.

Maybe Cake forum should sign up for a huge groupbuy(even though his stuff was free so far) to get him update it to x64?

Or suggest Cake buys the code from him. Quite a bunch of useful stuff there to be included in an upgrade of Sonar X2 maybe. Or at least make it worthwhile for him.

I downloaded the SDK stuff for Midi Fx but have not found the time to get into this field of programming yet.

But for this sake - a bit of adhesive tape on top key to keep it down really solves the issue.

a Midi Solutions Event manager can simply be inserted in the midi chain if you wish to filter out CC123

a Midi Solutions Event manager can simply be inserted in the midi chain if you wish to filter out CC123

True... after you "simply" shell out the $169 for this hardware solution. MIDI Event Filter is cheaper, and there's no shipping time.